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Proposal to allow reservations for Xunta albergues

Bradypus

Migratory hermit
Time of past OR future Camino
Too many and too often!
A Pontevedra news website has an article about a proposal to allow reservations to be made for Xunta albergues. The idea was raised at a meeting of hospitaleros last year and is being supported by the Amigos del Camino Portugués. The proposal is to permit reservations to be made in the peak months of July and August.

 
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A Pontevedra news website has an article about a proposal to allow reservations to be made for Xunta albergues. The idea was raised at a meeting of hospitaleros last year and is being supported by the Amigos del Camino Portugués. The proposal is to permit reservations to be made in the peak months of July and August.

I think that may encourage me to walk out of high season even more.
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
The Xunta albergues are kind of an insider tip - because they don't allow reservations, plenty of beds left even in high season ...
BC SY
Does rather depend where you are. Not sure if it’s a Xunta or a Municipal, but you can’t book Bruma for example, and in the high season the queue often exceeds capacity an hour or two before it opens. Equally, O Cadavo Xunta on the Primitivo was completely full by 17.00 when I was there.

Should they decide to allow reservations, it shouldn’t be much of an issue for an organisation as large as the Xunta to also require prepayment, and set up the relevant infrastructure. It would considerably reduce no -shows.
 
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Does rather depend where you are. Not sure if it’s a Xunta or a Municipal, but you can’t book Bruma for example, and in the high season the queue often exceeds capacity an hour or two before it opens. Equally, O Cadavo Xunta on the Primitivo was completely full by 17.00 when I was there.

Should they decide to allow reservations, it shouldn’t be much of an issue for an organisation as large as the Xunta to also require prepayment, and set up the relevant infrastructure. It would considerably reduce no -shows.
It would possibly reduce no shows, some people wouldn't baulk at booking two beds, just in case, but it would put a lot of pressure on those of us who don't know where we're going to end up to have to start booking, it would totally change that çamino feeling.
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
One more reason for me to carry my camping equipment.

I'd rather walk a 50km day to get to a campsite without having to book than booking a xunta albergue in advance.

I mean, honestly.

I have nothing against people making reservations.

But there's already countless private albergues, apartments, hostales and hotels that allow reservations for those who want that.

Leave at least a few albergues for those who prefer not to make reservations.

Please?
 
One more reason for me to carry my camping equipment.

I'd rather walk a 50km day to get to a campsite without having to book than booking a xunta albergue in advance.

I mean, honestly.

I have nothing against people making reservations.

But there's already countless private albergues, apartments, hostales and hotels that allow reservations for those who want that.

Leave at least a few albergues for those who prefer not to make reservations.

Please?
Thank you for your post!!

A lot of pilgrims don't and or are unable to make reservations therefore it is necessary that there are auberges available that don't except reservations!!
 
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They claim that that feeling has already been changed, as pilgrims feel forced to start walking very early in the morning to reach the Xunta albergues, wait in line for it to open, and often still face the fact of not being able to secure a bed
As "good old shoes" noted there are plenty of other places where you can sleep that accept reservations.
 
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I understand, but I'm sure pilgrims can make do with what is available and make the best of it.

Implementing a reservation system costs money and it will even cost more if prepayment is required. The cost of accommodation will then go up and a cheaper option will no longer be available.

There are also many pilgrims that are dependent on auberges that one can't reserve and they may also be dependent on ones that are cheaper. For example pilgrims from Europe that have very limited funds, that don't have phones and are not "tech savvy".
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
I agree, @trecile. The only time I stayed somewhere where they allowed nearly all reservations ahead of time, but kept about ten beds available for walk-ins was at the Abbey St. Foy in Conques, France. It is hugely popular and the majority of beds get pre-booked. My friends and I barely arrived in time as walk-ins and were given the perfect private room/bathroom to ourselves. I was thankful that they set several rooms aside in this busy tourist fairytale village.
 
It would possibly reduce no shows, some people wouldn't baulk at booking two beds, just in case, but it would put a lot of pressure on those of us who don't know where we're going to end up to have to start booking, it would totally change that çamino feeling.

As a former hostel manager I can assure you that having to pay in advance most definitely reduces the number of no shows! Yes, there’s always the odd one that will book and still not show - but at least they have paid for the privilege.

I see both sides.
I value the Municipal/Xunta system, but nothing is foolproof. The fact that the quickest walkers / earliest risers secure a bed, leaving those that are struggling to walk on doesn’t sit particularly well with me. Especially if they are also those that are not as financially secure. The ability to book would improve the situation for many of those. And it’s easy to say that they can’t - lack of a smartphone for instance - but we can always ask for assistance, whether from a fellow pilgrim or the current Hospitalero.

And just because we have the ability to book doesn’t mean we have to.

By and large, after the first day or two I walk without booking; it is by far my preferred option. But I don’t think that the ability for others to book or not will affect that - as you say, I have no idea where I am going to want to end my day. Which also means that there may or may not be a Municipal/Xunta , let alone a bed.
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
For example pilgrims from Europe that have very limited funds, that don't have phones and are not "tech savvy".
I have yet to meet a pilgrim from Europe that wasn’t more tec savvy than me🤣. Let alone one that didn’t have a cell phone.

I did meet a wonderful older man from South America who’d saved for 20 years to walk, but he was very resourceful. Grateful for the Xunta/Municipal/ Donativo networks, but certainly not dependent on them.
 
I agree with @trecile and @Camino Chrissy: if they must take reservations, please, please, please leave some for free walkers and people who cannot pay higher pension prices.
You might want to make this request to the people proposing this change. I'm not sure if there are sufficient details in the newspaper article - if not, it might be an option to comment on the article itself. But it does seem to come from an association that should be reasonably easy to find.
 
As a former hostel manager I can assure you that having to pay in advance most definitely reduces the number of no shows! Yes, there’s always the odd one that will book and still not show - but at least they have paid for the privilege.

I see both sides.
I value the Municipal/Xunta system, but nothing is foolproof. The fact that the quickest walkers / earliest risers secure a bed, leaving those that are struggling to walk on doesn’t sit particularly well with me. Especially if they are also those that are not as financially secure. The ability to book would improve the situation for many of those. And it’s easy to say that they can’t - lack of a smartphone for instance - but we can always ask for assistance, whether from a fellow pilgrim or the current Hospitalero.

And just because we have the ability to book doesn’t mean we have to.

By and large, after the first day or two I walk without booking; it is by far my preferred option. But I don’t think that the ability for others to book or not will affect that - as you say, I have no idea where I am going to want to end my day. Which also means that there may or may not be a Municipal/Xunta , let alone a bed.
With respect to pre paying not everyone can pay or wants to pay in advance, especially if it's an unknown site! If payment goes through "booking.com" most are probably O.K. with that but there is a cost and it will be passed on to the user.

I can also see both sides and I notice that most auberges accept reservations so getting a bed is not a problem. Those that want to reserve can do so. It's also necessary to have ones that one can't reserve to give those that don't reserve some piece of mind. As those are unlikely to the be ones that are private shouldn't the Municipal auberges remain the ones that one can't reserve?

With respect to pilgrims that are the quickest walkers and earliest risers that's not really an issue. Pilgrims start at different locations along the trail and and they end at different locations. A late riser and/or a slow hiker can arrive at an auberge earlier than an early riser and/or a fast walker depending on how may kms. they walk.
 
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
I have yet to meet a pilgrim from Europe that wasn’t more tec savvy than me🤣. Let alone one that didn’t have a cell phone.

I did meet a wonderful older man from South America who’d saved for 20 years to walk, but he was very resourceful. Grateful for the Xunta/Municipal/ Donativo networks, but certainly not dependent on them.
Without trying to be negative I don't understand why you have so readily dismissed my comments. I have run into plenty of pilgrims that experience difficulties communicating with a smart phone particularly when the language is foreign. I am one of them.
 
1/ With respect to pre paying not everyone can pay or wants to pay in advance, especially if it's an unknown site! If payment goes through "booking.com" most are probably O.K. with that but there is a cost and it will be passed on to the user.

2/ I can also see both sides and I notice that most auberges accept reservations so getting a bed is not a problem. Those that want to reserve can do so.
1) If you don't want to pay in advance you have an easy alternative: don't book. Or simply walk in a timeframe that is not affected by the proposals.
If you can't pay in advance you won't be able to pay on the day either - I'm not suggesting months, I'm talking about a day or two, once you have a reasonable idea where you might expect to end up.
If however you mean that you do not have an online account or credit card for example, then I return to my earlier point: you simply need to seek the assistance of others.

As the 'Xunta de Galacia' is quite literally the "Regional Government of Galicia" according to Google one would assume that they have a secure payment site already in existence. (I'm not a local). Making the site readily verifiable. And meaning that any costs would be minimal.

If payment were to go through b.c then as you point out the costs would most definitely rise because they take a significant commission.

2/ yes but those private Albergues are typically more expensive, and as others have pointed out above there are those who may not be able to afford that.
As those are unlikely to the be ones that are private shouldn't the Municipal auberges remain the ones that one can't reserve?
In an ideal world yes, however it is not I that am suggesting that they Institute a reservation system, it's the Hospitaleros themselves according to the article.
With respect to pilgrims that are the quickest walkers and earliest risers that's not really an issue. Pilgrims start at different locations along the trail and and they end at different locations. A late riser and/or a slow hiker can arrive at an auberge earlier than an early riser and/or a fast walker depending on how may kms. they walk.

Not according to the article:

"These situations are causing the Camino to Santiago to lose its essence , reiterates Lores, pointing out that "this stress to secure a bed not only goes against the spirit of the pilgrimage, but also represents discrimination based on age and physical condition , because the youngest or the fittest will arrive first and will have more opportunities than the rest."

He also says:
"In high season we have 86 places, but they are almost always too small and it is a nuisance to take half of those who have been waiting for one or two hours and tell them that they no longer have a place, that they must find another place to spend the night," he points out.".


On much of the Camino Frances your comment may well be valid. But most camino's don't have that level of infrastructure.
And even on the Frances, Roncesvalles for example has multiple occasions every year where they have to turn away pilgrims despite having both bookable and non-bookable accommodation.

On some Caminos you are likely to be starting at the same point and ending at the same point - the Camino Inglès is a classic example. Certainly you have the option of doing short stages however the majority of people that walk the route do the standard stages.
 
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Without trying to be negative I don't understand why you have so readily dismissed my comments..
I wasn't being dismissive of your comments. The only part I commented on was the "pilgrims from Europe that have very limited funds, that don't have phones and are not tech savvy" and even then I added a laughing emoji after my comment.

The only Europeans that I have met that did not have a cell phone were those that had either very recently lost it or had chosen to walk without one.

Even the South American gentleman that I met had one.
I have run into plenty of pilgrims that experience difficulties communicating with a smart phone particularly when the language is foreign. I am one of them.
So am I! I was given my first smartphone at work 14? years ago, an iPhone 7. I'm writing this on it now. There are probably still functions that I don't know how to use. As to languages: I speak some German but I've only learnt that in the last couple of years. When it comes to French or Spanish I literally just know a few words and phrases.
Worst case I simply ask someone for help.
 
If you can't pay in advance you won't be able to pay on the day either

Are you assuming that if the Xunta albergues institute a booking system that they will no longer take cash?
I think that the reason why people wouldn't be able to pay in advance would be because they don't have a credit or debit card or other type of electronic payment to do so.
 
Are you assuming that if the Xunta albergues institute a booking system that they will no longer take cash?
No
I think that the reason why people wouldn't be able to pay in advance would be because they don't have a credit or debit card or other type of electronic payment to do so.
Yes, I covered that too.

Over 40 years ago the International youth hostel association had a very simple prepayment and booking system. Basically you simply asked the staff at wherever you were staying to phone ahead on your behalf, and you could pay for the next hostel (or two) at your current one.

In this technological age I'm sure a simple system could be instituted. Especially
bearing in mind the high tech registration system that the Xunta currently operates.
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
A Pontevedra news website has an article about a proposal to allow reservations to be made for Xunta albergues. The idea was raised at a meeting of hospitaleros last year and is being supported by the Amigos del Camino Portugués. The proposal is to permit reservations to be made in the peak months of July and August.

I was shocked that the municipal albergue in Azofra was allowing bookings. People couldn’t just turn up any more. That was in the Covid days (2021?)
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
And just because we have the ability to book doesn’t mean we have to.

In theory, yes.

But in practice, when all or almost all albergues allow reservations, the reality is a bit different.

If all albergues allow reservations, it is impossible to plan if you don't make reservations. You have no idea if there's a bed available anywhere, no matter what time of day you arrive. There might not be a bed available for you in the next 60kms and you'll only find out once you're told "complete" again and again or by making phone calls. Which makes it very difficult to walk without reservations, and pushes you towards booking even if you prefer not to.

When there's non-bookable albergues, you at least know that there's a bed for you for certain if you arrive early, and you can make a good guess what time of day the albergues might fill up, depending on how busy it is. That way you can plan even without making reservations.

If a place can not be booked, I have a fairly good idea what time of the day I can arrive and still get a bed, depending on how busy the Camino is at the moment and at what times the albergues I stayed the days before filled up at, and how many beds they have.

So I don't run to be first at an albergue, even without reservations, usually I arrive in the afternoon, sometimes even later, sometimes even in the evening.

If it isn't very busy, I know that most likely the place won't fill up until evening, so, no need to hurry at all. If it is a bit more busy and not many other options, I walk a slightly shorter day so that I don't arrive too late in the day.

But if all places can be booked in advance, you never know. It's impossible to plan at all.

Even if albergues 'keep a few beds for walk ins' as was suggested, it's still problematic.

When it is only "a few" beds for walk - ins, then you definitely (!) need to arrive early, if you want any chance of getting a bed there.

So, then it really is a bed race for the few beds that are left for the walk-ins!

In the end, walking without reservations is then an option that mainly exists in theory, as it puts those who prefer not to make reservations at a massive disadvantage from the get go.

Look at the Via Podiensis, for example. Almost all (or all?) gites allow and even encourage reservations.

Yes, you could walk it without reservations if you walk during a less busy time and if you're okay adding 10-15km at the end of the day from time to time, but almost nobody does that, almost all walkers make reservations unless they've got a tent as backup (and those are few).

I'd understand the change of rules for the Xunta albergues if there were truly no options yet for those who walk extremely slowly, arrive very late, or simply want the security of having a reservation for whatever reason.

But many, many albergues already do allow reservations. So there's no disadvantage for the eldery and slow walkers. They can book one of the many, many beds in a private albergue already. Yes, those are slightly more expensive.

But if Xunta / municipal albergues can be booked, too, most likely their prices will go up, also, so it's probably not even cheaper anymore than the private ones.

In short,

If all albergues can be booked, then there's not really a choice anymore.

For me, that is not a positive change.

But it is what it is. If that change of rule truly becomes reality, and if in the end it becomes the norm in general (and with more and more municipals allowing reservations it seems to go into that direction...) all you can do is adapt.

I'll be a happy camper then, I guess.
 
I think the real reason some are upset here is that the age bracket of the upset posters is 70+ and it's not that they are incompetent from using a card or a cell or buying things off their phone (because I guarantee every one of those posters is very proficient with Amazon!) but that the updated version of how things operate is different from both the way they started and also their individual nostalgic memories of the mystique that drew them to walk in the first place. The same posters can be found getting ticked about tour groups and singers and mountain bikers and lack of communal dinners. But the reality is that the Camino has changed, especially post-Covid. Booking.com and Hotels.com are a thing. Hosts use them to guarantee their rooms will be full and their revenue will be made. Travelers use it to make sure they have a place to be at night. Perhaps the municipals would like to have guaranteed revenue as well. They see the private facilities full and doing well and would like that too. If it's ok to use Wise Pilgrim for a route map because its a more modern and efficient way to walk, then it also has to be ok to use a prebook for a room. Even Ivar has an app now. We either embrace changing ways of doing things or not, but the world is going to evolve whether an individual chooses to participate or not.
 
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I think the real reason some are upset here is that the age bracket of the upset posters is 70+ and it's not that they are incompetent from using a card or a cell or buying things off their phone (because I guarantee every one of those posters is very proficient with Amazon!) but that the updated version of how things operate is different from both the way they started and also their individual nostalgic memories of the mystique that drew them to walk in the first place. The same posters can be found getting ticked about tour groups and singers and mountain bikers and lack of communal dinners. But the reality is that the Camino has changed, especially post-Covid. Booking.com and Hotels.com are a thing. Hosts use them to guarantee their rooms will be full and their revenue will be made. Travelers use it to make sure they have a place to be at night. Perhaps the municipals would like to have guaranteed revenue as well. They see the private facilities full and doing well and would like that too. If it's ok to use Wise Pilgrim for a route map because its a more modern and efficient way to walk, then it also has to be ok to use a prebook for a room. Even Ivar has an app now. We either embrace changing ways of doing things or not, but the world is going to evolve whether an individual chooses to participate or not.

I don't think it's simply a matter of being old and therefore nostalgic why some people (me included) dislike the fact that more and more municipals now accept reservations.

I'm still 30 years away from 70 and still hate making reservations, having to do everything online, ect.

Having the option to do so is great, but having to isn't.

And it's not that it's not okay to book a room or bed in advance. That's totally okay and not the point.

It's the problem that once all albergues can be booked, there's basically no other choice anymore in the end than to book in advance, and with that, a lot will be lost.

That's the problem, at least from my point of view.
 
I think the real reason some are upset here is that the age bracket of the upset posters is 70+
That is something of an assumption.

The main drawback will be walkers who book and don't show up, resulting in albergues having empty beds having turned away pilgrims who haven´t booked. It will also require a lot of investment in software that works and training hospitaleros to use it. And I don´t subscribe to the view that all change is for the better or that change is inevitable so we may as well accept it. Sometimes we need to defend good things if we can.
¨They paved paradise, and put up a parking lot¨.
 
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Oooh noooo!
I don't like to book ahead but will if necessary. I always feel so grateful when I get to Galicia and can just turn up at a Xunta Albergue and get a bed. And I plan accordingly - get up early and be at my destination ready to line up if necessary. Although I have never walked in the absolute peak season, in July this year the only place with a long line, or any line, was Ponferrada. The lovely young person in front of me said I was number 47 in the queue of the 90(?) bed Albergue so would get a bed. However, the thought of an hour wait to check in etc. was just too much. I walked back down the road and got what I believe was the last room in a very nice hotel for E55, and left the albergue to the young and perhaps less monied.
Maybe things are different in peak season, but I never walk at that time anyway so hopefully whatever they decide will work better for those on Camino at that time.
 
I believe that the Xunta albergues use municipal employees to greet pilgrims and take their payments.
I have heard from a usually reliable source that the Xunta has contracted out a lot of the work of the albergues to a catering company based in Madrid, which makes it strange that they are having meetings of hospitaleros. I´d be very interested to know the situation. Maybe it is just the cleaning and maintenance that is contracted out.
 
I understand, but I'm sure pilgrims can make do with what is available and make the best of it.

Implementing a reservation system costs money and it will even cost more if prepayment is required. The cost of accommodation will then go up and a cheaper option will no longer be available.

There are also many pilgrims that are dependent on auberges that one can't reserve and they may also be dependent on ones that are cheaper. For example pilgrims from Europe that have very limited funds, that don't have phones and are not "tech savvy".
Quite a generalisation saying that all pilgrims from Europe have 'limited funds'. 😮.
You can buy me a beer if we cross paths😉
 
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[...] the Xunta has contracted out a lot of the work of the albergues to a catering company based in Madrid, which makes it strange that they are having meetings of hospitaleros. I´d be very interested to know the situation. Maybe it is just the cleaning and maintenance that is contracted out.
I, too, got curious about this, i.e. that a Camino association manages a Xunta albergue and so I had a quick look. The Galician government put out a new contract for tender this summer; it includes servicio al atención al peregrino, limpieza y gestión de cobro del precio en los albergues publicos y centres de information. They have done so for many years. They will pay some €11,000,000 to the company who will win the contract for providing these services (if I understand correctly).

The Memoria xustificativa do contrato says that the Galician government currently owns or has commissioned 76 pilgrim albergues on the 7 routes to Santiago de Compostela that make up the public network of albergues on the Camino de Santiago in Galicia. They are directly responsible for 62 of these albergues, with the opening of 4 new ones planned, all of which form part of the new contract, and the other 13, while owned by the government, are being managed by local councils or other organisations.

So the albergue in Pontevedra must be one of the Xunta owned albergues that are managed by a local Friends of the Camino association and not by the staff of the external company that currently holds the contract for management.

The proposal - if it is ever seriously considered by the Galician authorities - concerns only the public albergues in Galicia. I guess that the discussion in the thread is more about the general idea and keeping the spirit of the Camino than of practical relevance. Nobody would be obliged to book. Everybody could stay in a public albergue or a private albergue or a hotel without having booked, just as they can do now. As I said, I guess the concerns are about the idea and the spirit of the Camino. Because surely those who do not wish to book are not concerned for themselves - that it would be they who don't get a bed where and when they want one ... ? 🫤

Source: https://www.contratosdegalicia.gal/licitacionlang=es&cambioIdioma=true&N=823141
 
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