Camino Francés Federación to ban suitcases in their albergues (11 albergues affected by this rule)

[Bradypus]

Several news sites today have reported on a meeting of the Camino Francés Federación in Saint Jean Pied de Port. Amongst other business the member Amigos associations have decided to ban suitcases in the 11 albergues under their direct control. A proposal which @Rebekah Scott posted here some months ago.

Las asociaciones del Camino de Santiago prohíben las maletas en los albergues que gestionan sus asociaciones, once en total

Las asociaciones del Camino de Santiago acuerdan ser "beligerantes" con los "atentados" contra la ruta jacaboea

www.noticiasdenavarra.com

 

[Former member 92300]

My google chrome translated this paragraph:

"We are traditional Jacobean shelters that work for and for the pilgrimage to Santiago. The pilgrim travels with his belongings in a backpack, the tourist with his suitcase, which makes no sense on a natural path that is done on foot, by bike or on horseback. There are other accommodations that meet the needs of a tourist and we do not want to lose the essences that make the Camino de Santiago a unique and global phenomenon", they explain from the Camino Francés Federation.

I find this interesting as there is much debate on what does and does not make a pilgrim. I guess at least the Camino Frances Federation has taken a stand on this particular statement.

 

[Anhalter]

Glad that this was not my decision to make, cause i'm in no place to decide that. But i guess i like it.

 

[stevepjq]

I applaud this - the right thing to do!

 

[Anamiri]

I remember walking into a place in Lestedo, and being shocked by the enormous pile of luggage. Huge wheeled suitcases, and large cosmetics bags.
The pile took up the whole reception area. We could barely get around it. A lot of places dont have the space to deal with that type of luggage.
The rooms also weren't that big, so I imagine the occupants barely able to walk around their own room either.
I can understand people sending luggage ahead to Santiago, that makes complete sense, but I remember thinking that these people wouldnt have enough days to wear the stuff they bought, even if they changed twice a day.

 

[J Willhaus]

FICS does not mince words. They are quite vocal about what they believe a pilgrim is and isn't.

 

[Former member 92300]

FICS does not mince words. They are quite vocal about what they believe a pilgrim is and isn't.

I like that. With the surge of "pilgrims" especially on popular routes, and when there are shortages of beds, - I personally think that more clarity from the proper authorities is good. Otherwise, the "pilgrims" begin to speculate and come up with their own definitions of who is a "pilgrim" and who is more deserving of a bed.

 

[auburnfive]

I don’t read Spanish, but does it say if someone is able to send a backpack forward to these albergues? Just not suitcases?

 

[AnneO]

I don’t particularly like the pilgrim vs tourist distinction because I don’t think it is necessary or productive. It just serves to give people a sense of superiority over others, which in my mind should not be part of a pilgrimage. However, as someone who will transport a bag, I am fully supportive of some places prohibiting it. Given all the recent discussions about bed availability and the effect booking ahead has had, I think there should be places reserved only for those who want to wing it and not plan ahead. There should be options to suit all walking strategies.

 

[Former member 92300]

I don’t particularly like the pilgrim vs tourist distinction because I don’t think it is necessary or productive. It just serves to give people a sense of superiority over others, which in my mind should not be part of a pilgrimage. However, as someone who will transport a bag, I am fully supportive of some places prohibiting it. Given all the recent discussions about bed availability and the effect booking ahead has had, I think there should be places reserved only for those who want to wing it and not plan ahead. There should be options to suit all walking strategies.

I totally understand that. I do like the idea of more clarity as stated above - especially for access of the municipal and religious albergues which often don't accept reservations. Similar thought process to yours.

I know what I would like the "more clarity" to include - but not my decision so I will refrain for now.

 

[henrythedog]

The Federation’s requirement will include ‘rucksacks only’ and also the need to carry one’s ‘own sleeping bag’; which seems sensible given that they are necessary for their albergues.

There is no mention in the article as to whether the prospective peregrino need turn up carrying the rucksack or have it delivered; but I could hazard a guess.

 

[trecile]

I don’t particularly like the pilgrim vs tourist distinction because I don’t think it is necessary or productive. It just serves to give people a sense of superiority over others, which in my mind should not be part of a pilgrimage. However, as someone who will transport a bag, I am fully supportive of some places prohibiting it. Given all the recent discussions about bed availability and the effect booking ahead has had, I think there should be places reserved only for those who want to wing it and not plan ahead. There should be options to suit all walking strategies.

I agree. I don't think that they needed to make a distinction between pilgrims and tourists, as I believe that whether one is a pilgrim or not depends on the intention of the individual, not how they carry their belongings. They could have just made the rule without the judgment.

Edited to add: I think that it's a good decision to not allow suitcases in these types of albergues. There are plenty of accommodations for those who are having suitcases sent ahead, and I'm happy that these albergues will be available only to those carrying their own backpack.

 

[alhartman]

I dont see this so much as 'pilgrims vs tourists', but a matching of traditional pilgrims to limited 'cheap' beds in a total of less than 20 albergues out of many hundreds of other accommodations available. Probably a good thing for the 'traditional' pilgrim. Suitcase travelers and luggage services have lots of other options--no great need to take traditional spaces. Hope it happens and is well received. Seems much like the old days of not admitting bicycles until after 6pm.

 

[NicP]

Yes… lots of opinions on this topic. I hold two distinct views - one is my “theoretical” view that me making judgements of others and the way they do their camino doesn’t add anything useful to my own; the other, which comes from arriving at albergues after a long day of walking, making my way past a massive stack of (presumably pre-delivered) suitcases, and being told that the place, in spite of currently being almost empty, is fully booked for the evening.

 

[J Willhaus]

The Federation’s requirement will include ‘rucksacks only’ and also the need to carry one’s ‘own sleeping bag’; which seems sensible given that they are necessary for their albergues.

There is no mention in the article as to whether the prospective peregrino need turn up carrying the rucksack or have it delivered; but I could hazard a guess.

The FICS managed albergue where we worked last summer did not accept pilgrims who received vehicle support meaning you should be walking and carrying your own pack.

 

[Bradypus]

Yes… lots of opinions on this topic. I hold two distinct views - one is my “theoretical” view that me making judgements of others and the way they do their camino doesn’t add anything useful to my own; the other, which comes from arriving at albergues after a long day of walking, making my way past a massive stack of (presumably pre-delivered) suitcases, and being told that the place, in spite of currently being almost empty, is fully booked for the evening.

My early Camino experience predates both luggage transfer services and reservations. Sadly I have to recognise that both of those things are here to stay - at least on the Frances - but that doesn't mean that I have to pretend to welcome the fact. Walking the Frances in September 2016 the number of huge suitcases outside albergues was jarring. For me the process of stripping my "necessities" to a minimum is an important part of a pilgrimage. Unless you have unusual and very specific personal requirements a summer/autumn Camino using albergues allows you to carry a tiny load - well within the physical limits of most people who can walk an average 20km stage. I feel that the ever-growing luggage transfer industry is parasitic - preying on the fears of those who have never walked long-distance before.

 

[peregrina2000]

My early Camino experience predates both luggage transfer services and reservations. Sadly I have to recognise that both of those things are here to stay - at least on the Frances - but that doesn't mean that I have to pretend to welcome the fact. Walking the Frances in September 2016 the number of huge suitcases outside albergues was jarring. For me the process of stripping my "necessities" to a minimum is an important part of a pilgrimage. Unless you have unusual and very specific personal requirements a summer/autumn Camino using albergues allows you to carry a tiny load - well within the physical limits of most people who can walk an average 20km stage. I feel that the ever-growing luggage transfer industry is parasitic - preying on the fears of those who have never walked long-distance before.

@Bradypus, your post has sparked something in me, so I will respond, even though I swore I would stay out of this debate.

For me, the saddest thing is that I see that so many people’s first instinct is to look for the way to make their camino the easiest, the most hassle-free, the most amenities-laden. And then they lose an opportunity to challenge themselves, to see exactly what they can do. I see that at home — Yes, you can walk up two flights of stairs and don’t have to take the elevator, but everyone takes the elevator without even trying to walk. And it’s the same on the camino — Yes, you can carry 15 pounds on your back and don’t need jacotrans, but people sign up for jacotrans and don’t even try to push themselves.

There is a huge difference, imho, between suffering and challenging yourself to see what you can do. I don’t think suffering needs to be a part of a camino, but I do think that the camino gives you a terrific opportunity to see just how very self-reliant you are.

 

[Bradypus]

For me, the saddest thing is that I see that so many people’s first instinct is to look for the way to make their camino the easiest, the most hassle-free, the most amenities-laden. And then they lose an opportunity to challenge themselves, to see exactly what they can do.

Some years ago my friend Johnnie Walker went to Japan and walked the Shikoku 88 temple circuit. He posted about it on his personal blog at the time. The very first response was a question - Is there a luggage transfer service? Because otherwise I'm not interested. John's journey and his writing about it inspired my wife and me to go to Japan and walk the route (at different times!). The idea that someone would base their travel decisions for a pilgrimage route around the minimum possible effort achievable is deeply depressing to me.

 

[Sheesh]

.... I do think that the camino gives you a terrific opportunity to see just how very self-reliant you are!

And just how little one really needs. It's an illuminating and freeing revelation.
A 15 pound or less pack is within most people's capabilities.

 

[stevepjq]

@Bradypus : Johnnie Walker always does that to me! I can't get enough of that spirit!!

 

[J Willhaus]

So for those who didn't translate the article and don't read Spanish, there's several things here the group met and discussed. One is to prosecute people who deface the Camino. Another is to encourage communities to open gyms and sports centers in May for pilgrim overflows. A third is a to measure to have pilgrims carry their own sleeping bags. It was a busy meeting. The suitcase ban is in 11 albergues so it isn't the whole Camino, just a few who have specific rules.

 

[Bradypus]

So for those who didn't translate the article and don't read Spanish, there's several things here the group met and discussed.

I do almost all my internet browsing through Google Chrome these days. Set by default to translate to English. From all sorts of languages. Does a surprisingly good job on Korean and Japanese. Way back in the 1980s I did a university course in Computer Science and had to write an essay on the largely theoretical idea of machine translation of human languages. Glad to see it is working better than I predicted at the time! A friend in 1989 tried to explain a research project going on in Switzerland involving hyperlinks and something called the World Wide Web. Sounded like Star Trek fiction at the time. I wonder how that worked out....

 

[David Tallan]

I think this reflects the situation that there are many ways to make the pilgrimage to Santiago de Compostela, with different degrees of support and amenities. This has always been the case. I very much doubt that when Ferdinand and Isabela made their way on pilgrimage to Santiago, they walked and carried their own things (backpacks not having been invented yet). Nor do I think they (or their nobles who went on pilgrimage) stayed at pilgrim hospices along with the poorest pilgrims. I have no doubt whatsoever that they stayed at fine inns or the homes of fellow nobles. The Camino de Santiago has always provided the complete range.

It continues to, with a range of albergues, casas rurales, hostals, hotels and paradors available to pilgrims. From the outset, albergues were not intended to replace the other options for pilgrims, but to supplement them. And I put that "for pilgrims" in there intentionally. What makes one's journey to Santiago a pilgrimage is not the mode of one's travel, or the level (or lack) of luxury, but what is in one's heart when one sets out and/or when one completes the journey.

That said, just as the fine hotels and paradors have set themselves up to accommodate and support one kind of pilgrim, it makes perfect sense for the FICS albergues to set themselves up to accommodate and support another kind of pilgrim. And not accepting large suitcases is completely consistent with that.

 

[Former member 92300]

The FICS managed albergue where we worked last summer did not accept pilgrims who received vehicle support meaning you should be walking and carrying your own pack.

The only problem with this is that sometimes, due to injury, a pilgrim may need to ship their bag ahead and I would hate for an injured pilgrim to be turned away because their backpack was forwarded in order for them to be able to keep walking.

One is to prosecute people who deface the Camino.

This one I like - but can't imagine how hard it must be to do. Unless they are going to have significantly more policia policing the paths.... seems like an impossible task to make any headway to reduce graffiti or other defacement on the Camino.

 

[Bradypus]

The only problem with this is that sometimes, due to injury, a pilgrim may need to ship their bag ahead and I would hate for an injured pilgrim to be turned away because their backpack was forwarded in order for them to be able to keep walking.

On the couple of occasions when injury has halted my Camino journeys I have stopped in an albergue until I have been well enough to continue or to travel home. In the latter case I returned at a later date to resume my journey from the same place. I cannot imagine a situation when I would send my bag ahead. If I am in such a poor physical condition that I am unable to carry the trivial amount of gear necessary for an albergue-based Camino then I should be at home recuperating rather than "soldiering on" on a Camino.

 

[J Willhaus]

The only problem with this is that sometimes, due to injury, a pilgrim may need to ship their bag ahead and I would hate for an injured pilgrim to be turned away because their backpack was forwarded in order for them to be able to keep walking.


This one I like - but can't imagine how hard it must be to do. Unless they are going to have significantly more policia policing the paths.... seems like an impossible task to make any headway to reduce graffiti or other defacement on the Camino.

Certainly I would try to help a pilgrim find refuge if we could not provide it. Its only 11 albergues. If you need to ship your bag then you should send it somewhere that doesn't have this restriction.

 

[trecile]

Some years ago my friend Johnnie Walker went to Japan and walked the Shikoku 88 temple circuit. He posted about it on his personal blog at the time. The very first response was a question - Is there a luggage transfer service? Because otherwise I'm not interested.

We see similar questions here all the time - "is there luggage transfer on the Salvador, Lana, Levante, etc.?" I think that one needs to accept that not every route is possible without carrying a backpack. I'd love to do the Pacific Crest Trail, but I'm not interested in carrying camping gear, and they haven't built huts every 10-15 miles to accommodate me, so it won't be possible for me, but I'm not whining about it.

The only problem with this is that sometimes, due to injury, a pilgrim may need to ship their bag ahead and I would hate for an injured pilgrim to be turned away because their backpack was forwarded in order for them to be able to keep walking.

There are plenty of places that do accept transferred bags where injured pilgrims can stay.

 

[JabbaPapa]

The FICS managed albergue where we worked last summer did not accept pilgrims who received vehicle support meaning you should be walking and carrying your own pack.

The long standing exception to that particular rule is pilgrims with a disability.

 

[dick bird]

Sorry if this point has already been made, but the issue is not just about who is or isn’t a pilgrim: it’s also about the purpose of an albergue. Albergues exist to help pilgrims who might lack resources or who want to travel in a simple, uncomplicated and perhaps challenging way. Clearly this doesn’t apply to someone who is paying to have a suitcase transported for them. The municipales and donativos are nearly always subsidized by the local community, again not for the sake of the well-resourced traveller. Finally, dealing with luggage puts an extra burden on the hospitaleros who are often volunteers and unpaid. So am I in favour of the suitcase ban? Absolutely.

 

[WalkinRon]

I walked SJPP to Leon last year and am planning the second half of the Frances for next year. I always stayed in my own room with bath. I really enjoyed the places that had both private and group accommodations with a communal dinner for all. I was always welcomed as a pilgrim and not once was my cover blown as a tourist trying to pass as a pilgrim.

Now, as I plan next year's Camino I'm considering doing without the suitcase. I get the impression that there's even more accommodations, cafes, bars, shops, etc. on the second half. I suppose I could even do without my backpack too... I could just get on the plane with my ATM card in one pocket and credit card in the other--the minimal definition of "all packed and ready to go!" Of course, the essential element of such a plan is my cell phone.

Did "real pilgrims" have cell phones?

 

[dougfitz]

FICS does not mince words. They are quite vocal about what they believe a pilgrim is and isn't.

They do, but this doesn't read like it was from FICS. It sounded more like the Spanish Federation of Associations of Friends of the Camino de Santiago has made this decision.

 

[Flatlander]

Please forgive my petty and possibly off-topic quote but I'd like it recorded for posterity.....

The pilgrim travels with his belongings in a backpack, the tourist with his suitcase, which makes no sense on a natural path that is done on foot, by bike or on horseback.

Not looking to fire up the usual debate.

Edited to fix quote apologies to @jeanineonthecamino

 

[dougfitz]

I don’t read Spanish, but does it say if someone is able to send a backpack forward to these albergues? Just not suitcases?

The credential clearly states, albeit in Spanish:

• Groups organised with support car or by bicycle are requested to seek alternative shelter to the pilgrim hostels.

Clearly, anyone using pack transport has joined what might arguably be the largest group organisation on the Camino, and are being asked to seek other accommodation, not the pilgrim hostels. Various associations are more or less strict on this, allowing some leeway outside of the busy periods. But I don't see the principle changing. You should not expect albergues run by voluntary associations to host pilgrims who use pack transport services.

 

[dougfitz]

Please forgive my petty and possibly off-topic quote but I'd like it recorded for posterity.....


Not looking to fire up the usual debate.

Please be careful. You have attributed to another forum member a quote that was in the newpaper article. These were not her words, and you shouldn't be suggesting they were.

 

[Flatlander]

Please be careful. You have attributed to another forum member a quote that was in the newpaper article. These were not her words, and you shouldn't be suggesting they were.

Thank you, I appreciate that.
I believe I've fixed the quote now.

 

[dick bird]

Not trying to derail the debate, but I seem to remember that there is a statue of an early 20th century pilgrim outside the albergue in Astorga with, that's right. a suitcase. Mind you, he is carrying it via a sturdy leather strap across his chest.

 

[markie6]

Not trying to derail the debate, but I seem to remember that there is a statue of an early 20th century pilgrim outside the albergue in Astorga with, that's right. a suitcase. Mind you, he is carrying it via a sturdy leather strap across his chest.

He looks tired too but that hill into Astorga is quite tough at the end of the day. Lets not forget with regard to suitcases that some people are 3/4 of a world away from home and the camino is just a part of their trip

 

[David with new Kit!]

@jeanonthecamino -"The only problem with this is that sometimes, due to injury, a pilgrim may need to ship their bag ahead and I would hate for an injured pilgrim to be turned away because their backpack was forwarded in order for them to be able to keep walking"

I absolutely agree with you. Last year on the Norte my wife got shin splints after three weeks and we had to send her rucksack ahead to reduce the weight on her shin. With daily shin massages all worked out well.

 

[Anhalter]

@jeanonthecamino -"The only problem with this is that sometimes, due to injury, a pilgrim may need to ship their bag ahead and I would hate for an injured pilgrim to be turned away because their backpack was forwarded in order for them to be able to keep walking"

I absolutely agree with you. Last year on the Norte my wife got shin splints after three weeks and we had to send her rucksack ahead to reduce the weight on her shin. With daily shin massages all worked out well.

I would absolutely love to see a statistic on how many of those hundreds if not thousands of luggage pieces transported along the camino each day are from people with injuries or other "good reasons" (for lack of a better word).

From what i seen last year my gut says: not many.

 

[dick bird]

Just a reminder, this thread isn't about the pros and cons of or reasons for pilgrims having their backpacks transported. It's about whether albergues can or should refuse to accept transported suitcases.

 

[Kathor1]

It's about whether albergues can or should refuse to accept transported suitcases.

I thought the thread is about a new specific rule for a small set of 11 albergues on the Camino Francés?

I’d be curious to know which 11 albergues are concerned. And since the name Roncesvalles is mentioned - is Roncesvalles one of these albergues or not? As far as I understand it, Roncesvalles is not “under the direct control” of an Amigos association?

PS: And I’m merely curious - which is why I don’t say what I do personally with the backpacks and suitcases I own.

 

[Kathor1]

Not trying to derail the debate, but I seem to remember that there is a statue of an early 20th century pilgrim outside the albergue in Astorga with, that's right. a suitcase. Mind you, he is carrying it via a sturdy leather strap across his chest.

It is this statue (see below), right? I thought that it is supposed to be an emigrant. Of course, throughout the centuries there have been all sorts of travellers on this major road from east to west and from west to east and up north. And who would ask a Camino pilgrim “Quo vadis” - “Where are you going to” as the plaque at the foot of the statue says. Isn’t it obvious to all and sundry that the Camino Francés pilgrim goes to Santiago?

 

[Bradypus]

What a strange monument to the peregrino … I would have thought that it is supposed to be an emigrant.

Apparently it does represent a pilgrim. I read that the sculptor lived on the Camino and walking figures feature prominently in a lot of his work. The bronze sculpture was made as a replacement for an earlier piece in plastic which was burned by vandals. His suitcase doesn't look ideal for a walker but I'm sure it had some special significance for the artist!

CURIOSIDADES... LEÓN

www.lahornacina.com

 

[dick bird]

I thought the thread is about a new specific rule for a small set of 11 albergues on the Camino Francés?

I’d be curious to know which 11 albergues are concerned. And since the name Roncesvalles is mentioned - is Roncesvalles one of these albergues or not? As far as I understand it, Roncesvalles is not “under the direct control” of an Amigos association?

PS: And I’m merely curious - which is why I don’t say what I do personally with the backpacks and suitcases I own.

The article cites, in the last paragraph:

Camino Francés Federación está formado por las asociaciones de Jaca, Zaragoza, Saint Jean Pied de Port, Roncesvalles, Pamplona/Navarra, Estella, Puente la Reina, Los Arcos, La Rioja Logroño, la Cofradía del Santo, Burgos, Palencia, Sahagún, Mansilla de las Mulas, León, Astorga, El Bierzo, Sarria y la Fraternidad Internacional del Camino de Santiago.

That's 17 confraternities so applies to all the albergues they control plus FICS, so that's quite a few.

 

[Kathor1]

Apparently it does represent a pilgrim

I noticed that the official title is “El Caminante” and not “El Peregrino” though .

Ah, traditions! And in the distant Middle Ages, and I hasten to add “supposedly“ to be on the safe side, when they wrote in Latin and used “peregrinus”, they did not make the same clear distinction between traveler and pilgrim that we make. Of course, they did not have a word for “tourigrino” or even “tourist” either. Not even a distinction between travelling for business and travelling for leisure because there was not that much leisure time and leisure travelling possible for the common man let alone the common woman.

If we could just could turn back time, everything would be so much better, wouldn’t it.

 

[Kathor1]

That's 17 confraternities so applies to all the albergues they control plus FICS, so that's quite a few.

It says in post #1 of this thread: Amongst other business the member Amigos associations have decided to ban suitcases in the 11 albergues under their direct control. I am merely curious to know which ones are meant.

 

[dick bird]

It says in post #1 of this thread: Amongst other business the member Amigos associations have decided to ban suitcases in the 11 albergues under their direct control. I am merely curious to know which ones are meant.

The article says that 11 albergues are affected, but unfortunately doesn't name them. However it does point out that they are among the ones with the largest capacity. No doubt Jacotrans or Correos will inform you if you try to send your suitcase or backpack to one of them. I think the issue here is whether they are justified in taking this action and whether other organisations and albergues will follow suit.

 

[Kathor1]

No doubt Jacotrans or Correos will inform you if you try to send your suitcase or backpack to one of them

Having never used the services of Jacotrans or Correos nor having the intention of doing so in the near future I would not know but this sounds like a reasonable assumption.

But I’m confused: Are these 11 albergues among those who accept luggage (whether backpacks or suitcases) being sent to them or are they not accepting luggage at all anyway? I feel that a bit of clarification would be more useful to new peregrin@s than fundamental debate. We had one single thread recently where a poster said that he was informed by an albergue (I don’t know whether under private control or other control) where he had booked to stay for a night that they don’t accept suitcases being sent to them, only backpacks. It was a recent thread and something new that I had not heard of before.

 

[Former member 92300]

On the couple of occasions when injury has halted my Camino journeys I have stopped in an albergue until I have been well enough to continue or to travel home. In the latter case I returned at a later date to resume my journey from the same place. I cannot imagine a situation when I would send my bag ahead. If I am in such a poor physical condition that I am unable to carry the trivial amount of gear necessary for an albergue-based Camino then I should be at home recuperating rather than "soldiering on" on a Camino.

But sometimes just removing the extra weight allows you to soldier on... without causing further injury. There are plenty of injuries that can slow you down but aren't quite to the level of needing to halt your journey. But this requires knowing your body and understanding the injury. Knowing when to rest and when to continue and when to continue but ship your bag ahead - well - that can be tricky to know sometimes, but I personally have been able to make those choices successfully. I did ship my bag forward one day when I had an injury, just removing the excess weight allowed me to continue slowly progressing, resting when I needed to rest. I listened to my body and it said I can keep walking, but it would be better to not carry the extra weight. My body was right! I don't consider any amount of extra weight "trivial" - but moreso when an injury is involved.

 

[Former member 92300]

I would absolutely love to see a statistic on how many of those hundreds if not thousands of luggage pieces transported along the camino each day are from people with injuries or other "good reasons" (for lack of a better word).

From what i seen last year my gut says: not many.

LOL... I would agree with you. That said - it is still nice to have the option when an injury is involved. I personally think pilgrims should carry their backpacks, but nice to have an option to forward a bag if injured but still able to walk. And there are a few people who truly can only do a Camino with the support of bag transport due to illness/injury/disabilities I simply wouldn't want to see those people disenfranchised from the opportunity to complete a pilgrimage. Funny how my statement about INJURED PEOPLE sparked so much debate.

My opinion on people in general just forwarding their bags because they can or because it is easy or because they don't want to challenge themselves is different - but my opinion is irrelevant since luggage transport in general is permitted/available and it is their Camino, not mine.

But this thread is about suitcases in 11 specific albergues... which is a whole other topic.

 

[Former member 92300]

Please forgive my petty and possibly off-topic quote but I'd like it recorded for posterity.....




Not looking to fire up the usual debate.

Edited to fix quote apologies to @jeanineonthecamino

LOL... as stated in my original post. I didn't type whatever it was you fixed, I simply copied and pasted chrome browser translation. No apologies needed to me... if chrome browser translation made whatever translation error you corrected... I don't edit things I am copying/pasting/quoting... because then I am not copying/pasting/quoting - I would instead be making my own edits on their statement.

 

[henrythedog]

It seems entirely correct that any business can set out the service that they choose to provide, and in this particular case I welcome someone finally getting off the pot and making a stand. (That could be worded better, I admit).

However, the devil’s in the detail. If the associations were to maintain their longstanding principle of making exceptions for those with genuine disabilities, as cited by @JabbaPapa in #28 then how do they decide in advance of the purportedly disabled peregrino arriving? And what is a qualifying disability?

 

[Former member 92300]

It seems entirely correct that any business can set out the service that they choose to provide, and in this particular case I welcome someone finally getting off the pot and making a stand. (That could be worded better, I admit).

However, the devil’s in the detail. If the associations were to maintain their longstanding principle of making exceptions for those with genuine disabilities, as cited by @JabbaPapa in #28 then how do they decide in advance of the purportedly disabled peregrino arriving? And what is a qualifying disability?

This is exactly one of the reasons why I think further clarity would be helpful. Disabilities and injuries should be taken into account when rules are made/changed. But - to be successful, it requires clear guidelines for albergue hosts and pilgrims alike to follow. There are some disabilities/injuries that are more visible than others. Private albergues can do what they want as they are private businesses -but for access to municipal/religious albergues - clarity/guidance in a lot of what is or is not accepted is beneficial.

 

[nilesite]

I’m happy about this. As an hospitalera, you don’t want to deny entry to anyone who presents themselves looking for a bed for the night, but keeping the albergues for pilgrims walking with their backpacks ought to be the priority at least. And yes to sleeping bags too.

 

[WayWalker]

Several news sites today have reported on a meeting of the Camino Francés Federación in Saint Jean Pied de Port. Amongst other business the member Amigos associations have decided to ban suitcases in the 11 albergues under their direct control. A proposal which @Rebekah Scott posted here some months ago.

Las asociaciones del Camino de Santiago prohíben las maletas en los albergues que gestionan sus asociaciones, once en total

Las asociaciones del Camino de Santiago acuerdan ser "beligerantes" con los "atentados" contra la ruta jacaboea

www.noticiasdenavarra.com

Our night in Rabnal, there was a supposed Bollywood star as rumor had it, with two men supporting her walk. Her suitcases were spread all over the albergue bunks. That's when I started considering that there were many ways to do a Camino!

 

[NancyZ]

My google chrome translated this paragraph:

"We are traditional Jacobean shelters that work for and for the pilgrimage to Santiago. The pilgrim travels with his belongings in a backpack, the tourist with his suitcase, which makes no sense on a natural path that is done on foot, by bike or on horseback. There are other accommodations that meet the needs of a tourist and we do not want to lose the essences that make the Camino de Santiago a unique and global phenomenon", they explain from the Camino Francés Federation.

I find this interesting as there is much debate on what does and does not make a pilgrim. I guess at least the Camino Frances Federation has taken a stand on this particular statement.

Just a thought…. In the beginning when pilgrims started walking to Santiago there were all types of pilgrims, pilgrims that had no means and walked carrying their belongings and then there were pilgrims who had there belongings carried by other people or maybe a donkey… There are all types of pilgrims…

I think this reflects the situation that there are many ways to make the pilgrimage to Santiago de Compostela, with different degrees of support and amenities. This has always been the case. I very much doubt that when Ferdinand and Isabela made their way on pilgrimage to Santiago, they walked and carried their own things (backpacks not having been invented yet). Nor do I think they (or their nobles who went on pilgrimage) stayed at pilgrim hospices along with the poorest pilgrims. I have no doubt whatsoever that they stayed at fine inns or the homes of fellow nobles. The Camino de Santiago has always provided the complete range.

It continues to, with a range of albergues, casas rurales, hostals, hotels and paradors available to pilgrims. From the outset, albergues were not intended to replace the other options for pilgrims, but to supplement them. And I put that "for pilgrims" in there intentionally. What makes one's journey to Santiago a pilgrimage is not the mode of one's travel, or the level (or lack) of luxury, but what is in one's heart when one sets out and/or when one completes the journey.

That said, just as the fine hotels and paradors have set themselves up to accommodate and support one kind of pilgrim, it makes perfect sense for the FICS albergues to set themselves up to accommodate and support another kind of pilgrim. And not accepting large suitcases is completely consistent with that.

Well said!! “What makes one’s journey to Santiago a pilgrimage is not the mode of one’s travel, or level (or lack) of luxury but what is one’s heart when one sets out or when one completes the journey.”

 

[KSAI]

Several news sites today have reported on a meeting of the Camino Francés Federación in Saint Jean Pied de Port. Amongst other business the member Amigos associations have decided to ban suitcases in the 11 albergues under their direct control. A proposal which @Rebekah Scott posted here some months ago.

Las asociaciones del Camino de Santiago prohíben las maletas en los albergues que gestionan sus asociaciones, once en total

Las asociaciones del Camino de Santiago acuerdan ser "beligerantes" con los "atentados" contra la ruta jacaboea

www.noticiasdenavarra.com

While I understand the rationale behind this, it ignores the number of handicapped individuals, including myself, who physically can’t carry a backpack. As someone who has a cage and eight screws holding up my neck, I am blessed to be able to walk at all. Three years ago walking wasn’t a given. That my physical condition somehow makes me less of a pilgrim is disappointing to hear. I finished the French Way solo last fall.

 

[lt56ny]

@Bradypus, your post has sparked something in me, so I will respond, even though I swore I would stay out of this debate.

For me, the saddest thing is that I see that so many people’s first instinct is to look for the way to make their camino the easiest, the most hassle-free, the most amenities-laden. And then they lose an opportunity to challenge themselves, to see exactly what they can do. I see that at home — Yes, you can walk up two flights of stairs and don’t have to take the elevator, but everyone takes the elevator without even trying to walk. And it’s the same on the camino — Yes, you can carry 15 pounds on your back and don’t need jacotrans, but people sign up for jacotrans and don’t even try to push themselves.

There is a huge difference, imho, between suffering and challenging yourself to see what you can do. I don’t think suffering needs to be a part of a camino, but I do think that the camino gives you a terrific opportunity to see just how very self-reliant you are.

I couldn't agree more with you. As always you articulate your thoughts so well and succinctly. There was a time that I was caught up in the definition of what a pilgrim. I have released those thoughts as it is a judgement and is really quite counterproductive. One reason I walk is to clear my mind of needless judgements. It was actually quite freeing to resolve my thoughts by now thinking I could really care less how each person choices to walk. (When it gets right down to it many things we all post here are just, plain and simple judgements. So get rid of them).
One thing I do believe is what you said that the camino should challenge. I personally do not believe a pilgrimage should be easy and taking elevators to your "pilgrims" room in the Parador. I know Kings and the wealthy through the centuries did "walk" this way. It is very difficult for me to articulate my thoughts about this as it is so much more of an instinctual feeling rather than an intellectual thought. One of the greatest lessons we can learn is the simplicity of living. Living isn't just easy. Pilgrimage should not be either. There is a profound importance that learning to live with so much less. That thinking I need a bed in a hotel or eating in Michelin restaurant or having two suitcases to carry your hair dryer, 3 pairs of shoes and 6 outfits, or a toiletry bag that weighs almost as much as my backpack is antithetical to the meaning of pilgrimage. If you want to have a suitcase or two go right ahead, I care not. But my thoughts about this was formed on my first camino when I arrived in Sarria early one day. There were far fewer albergues then., but Sarria to Santiago was still full of pilgrims. My albergue was empty but it was packed with suitcases and brand new backpacks stacked in the reception area. After 2 or three pilgrims came in the albergue said it was full. Later in the day I was standing outside my albergue and met more than a few pilgrims who I had seen since SJPP who were exhausted, some with injuries and limping who could not find a bed because the albergues were full. If I wasn't sick as a dog that day I would have given my bed and walked on. Later in the day people started walking in who had just started walking or were walking without packs who as Laurie said were perfectly capable of walking. If you want to have a suitcase that is fine. That is your choice, no judgements. I won't judge what the association's definition is. It is not for me. But I am really glad they made this new rule.

 

[annakappa]

Sorry if this point has already been made, but the issue is not just about who is or isn’t a pilgrim: it’s also about the purpose of an albergue. Albergues exist to help pilgrims who might lack resources or who want to travel in a simple, uncomplicated and perhaps challenging way. Clearly this doesn’t apply to someone who is paying to have a suitcase transported for them. The municipales and donativos are nearly always subsidized by the local community, again not for the sake of the well-resourced traveller. Finally, dealing with luggage puts an extra burden on the hospitaleros who are often volunteers and unpaid. So am I in favour of the suitcase ban? Absolutely.

Well Dick Bird, you’ve hit the nail on the head!
“ Albergues exist to help pilgrims who might lack resources or who want to travel in a simple, uncomplicated and perhaps challenging way”.

 

[J Willhaus]

There are still plenty of places which accept luggage and people who are shipping bags. There were 17 groups represented at the meeting and this article indicated only 9 albergues will not accept suitcases so apparently not everyone was in agreement. Each municipality and/or group will likely still make their own decisions on many rules and topics. The meeting was about much more than the suitcase issue. These are people who want to protect and preserve the Camino and care deeply about it.

 

[Kathor1]

And yes to sleeping bags too.

I am frankly surprised that this is mentioned as a requirement only now. In the Alps, on Alpine huts for mountain walkers, light sleeping bags / liners have been a requirement for hygienic reasons for as long as I remember i.e. at least during the past 50 years. There’s actually a word for it: literally hut sleeping bag. Often a whitish colour and made of cotton.

 

[NomadJMJ]

At the risk of being banned... the Camino de Santiago is a spiritual pilgrimage. We walk to listen for God. We walk to venerate the remains of one of Jesus' inner circle, St. James the greater... however we travel it.

 

[gypsy9]

I’m on the CF and I appear to be in the minority:not planning with pre booking and carrying my own backpack. After a day of heavy rain, I Stopped at noon in a newer albergue and thankfully have a bed. Reception floor area was covered with large suitcases and shiny backpacks. It’s not a judgement, but an observation. This is how it is now. It’s also a very lucrative business as many opt to forward luggage (for whatever reasons)

Municipals also take reservations and accept luggage transfer. I understand they also keep some beds for people like myself, but I’m not sure how many. I’m all for the ban on cases in some albergues.

My only option seems to be this: arrive at opening time.
It’s doable
The CF is not crazy busy. I find I can have quiet times walking
Albergues do fill up in the evening…

 

[kathanne]

If the albergues have decided to ban suitcases, then maybe their ideal is for the pilgrim to carry their rucksack all the way, unless there was good reason.
When I first decided to walk the camino, I was initially attracted by the many companies which offer organised self-guided walks. Most had a basic package that included transferring your bag to your next accommodation.
Most people have a strong sense of how to be a pilgrim. I think it difficult to use such companies on a pilgrimage. You should aim to do as much as the organising yourself.
I would have liked to rely on staying at public albergues, but could not leave it to 'chance' of a bed for the night.

 

[SBurgess]

I have so much to say but many of my thoughts have already been stated. So I will simply state: I agree with the decision, applaud it, and sincerely hope it is accepted by all alberques.

 

[LTfit]

They do, but this doesn't read like it was from FICS. It sounded more like the Spanish Federation of Associations of Friends of the Camino de Santiago has made this decision.

You're right. FICS has been mentioned several times but FICS is just one of the Camino Associations that make up the new Federation. If I recall, there are about 18.

 

[LTfit]

Municipals also take reservations and accept luggage transfer. I understand they also keep some beds for people like myself, but I’m not sure how many. I’m all for the ban on cases in some albergues.

Which municipals accept reservation? This is news to me.

And some accept luggage transfeer, definitely not all.

 

[dougfitz]

The Federation’s requirement will include ‘rucksacks only’ and also the need to carry one’s ‘own sleeping bag’; which seems sensible given that they are necessary for their albergues.

There is no mention in the article as to whether the prospective peregrino need turn up carrying the rucksack or have it delivered; but I could hazard a guess.

The Spanish Federation of Associations of Friends of the Camino de Santiago has a web page explaining their rules of use for shelters and refuges. Here is the page link. I don't think it has yet been updated to reflect the decision to ban suitcases.

 

[lt56ny]

While I understand the rationale behind this, it ignores the number of handicapped individuals, including myself, who physically can’t carry a backpack. As someone who has a cage and eight screws holding up my neck, I am blessed to be able to walk at all. Three years ago walking wasn’t a given. That my physical condition somehow makes me less of a pilgrim is disappointing to hear. I finished the French Way solo last fall.

I read the article and there is no mention of people who transport their backpacks. There are some muni/municipals do do not accept transported backpacks. I carry mine but I do not believe there are many that don't. I am sure others know better than I regarding this subject.

 

[BillandRobin]

My google chrome translated this paragraph:

"We are traditional Jacobean shelters that work for and for the pilgrimage to Santiago. The pilgrim travels with his belongings in a backpack, the tourist with his suitcase, which makes no sense on a natural path that is done on foot, by bike or on horseback. There are other accommodations that meet the needs of a tourist and we do not want to lose the essences that make the Camino de Santiago a unique and global phenomenon", they explain from the Camino Francés Federation.

I find this interesting as there is much debate on what does and does not make a pilgrim. I guess at least the Camino Frances Federation has taken a stand on this particular statement.

Let’s see if the Federation is willing to outlaw GPS and phones that make it totally unnecessary to interface with local residents when you become lost. There was once a time when that was part of the experience of being a pilgrim, getting lost and asking for help.

 

[Kathor1]

The Spanish Federation of Associations of Friends of the Camino de Santiago has a web page explaining their rules of use for shelters and refuges. Here is the page link. I don't think it has yet been updated to reflect the decision to ban suitcases.

But the “Camino Francés Federación” and the “Federación Española de
Asociaciones de Amigos del Camino de Santiago” aren’t the same organisation? There is also the fairly new “Asociación de Municipios del Camino de Santiago”.

In fact, the distant armchair observer wonders why there is a need for numerous umbrella associations and federations for the local and regional Camino amigos. I’ve been looking for the website of the newly formed Camino Francés Federación. Do they have one and if so what’s the link?

 

[Philtration]

He looks tired too but that hill into Astorga is quite tough at the end of the day. Lets not forget with regard to suitcases that some people are 3/4 of a world away from home and the camino is just a part of their trip.

Isn't it obvious to everyone? The statue is a tribute to the early Jacotrans service. He's carrying the suitcase of a wealthy pilgrim!!

 

[Amused212]

I agree. I don't think that they needed to make a distinction between pilgrims and tourists, as I believe that whether one is a pilgrim or not depends on the intention of the individual, not how they carry their belongings. They could have just made the rule without the judgment.

Edited to add: I think that it's a good decision to not allow suitcases in these types of albergues. There are plenty of accommodations for those who are having suitcases sent ahead, and I'm happy that these albergues will be available only to those carrying their own backpack.

I agree with the decision to not allow suitcases in these albergues as long as it is clearly identified which ones are on this list. There should be plenty of other lodging options for those who have a need to transport a suitcase though the options are likely to be more expensive. Regarding the definition of tourist, I can't comment but I do want to share a story.

In 2019 my daughter and I set out to walk from SJPP to Burgos. The plan was to do the Frances in three states because of her work schedule. At that time, our airline would not allow hiking poles on the plane so we checked one suitcase with both sets of poles and, as long as we had the suitcase, threw in some extra clothes for when we were done. We picked a hotel in Burgos and had our suitcase sent there. We carried our packs with what we needed and I believe we had the correct "intent" to label us pilgrims. In Burgos, I decided I wanted to continue on. I had an extra 9 days I could walk. Wasn't sure how far that would take me, no end point seemed obvious, plus I had met some people I hoped to walk with. But I had a suitcase. I had it forwarded and used small hotels or private albergues. I was embarassed about the suitcase PLUS my pack (which I carried). I ended in Leon. If I hadn't been making decisions on the fly maybe Leon would have popped up as an obvious end point and I could have just shipped it there. My question: did I become a tourist in Burgos when I started forwarding the suitcase?

 

[C clearly]

I think the issue here is whether they are justified in taking this action

That is not for the forum members to decide. This thread is a broader discussion of our opinions on their decision and its implication.

Let’s see if the Federation is willing to outlaw GPS and phones that make it totally unnecessary to interface with local residents when you become lost. There was once a time when that was part of the experience of being a pilgrim, getting lost and asking for help.

This is a stretch of logic and interpretation of tradition that I haven't seen before!

 

[trecile]

Municipals also take reservations and accept luggage transfer.

Some municipals take reservations, but most do not.

My question: did I become a tourist in Burgos when I started forwarding the suitcase?

Did your intention change?

 

[John Sikora]

I will take a little contrian view here. I really support the idea of municipal albergues taking a stand about transported suitcases. That makes sense given the logistics of handling the bags and the limited resources that those albergues usually have. Many people have taken advantage of the cheap beds that the albergues offer but burden down the process with their luggage.

What I take great offense at is the narrow definition of a "pilgrim". So, if I have a suitcase, I am by definition not worth of being called a pilgrim in their eyes. That is just bureaucratic arrogance at best. What they should have said is that the albergues are designed and directed to provide a particular type of pilgrim experience (perhaps a more original and pure experience but still one type) so restrictions have to be put in place to enable this experience. This doesn't denegrate from those pilgrims that choose to or cannot walk without the requirement for a suitcase. But they chose the zealot approach instead.

 

[Marc S.]

I’ve been looking for the website of the newly formed Camino Francés Federación. Do they have one and if so what’s the link?

I think this is it

CAMINO FRANCÉS FEDERACIÓN /// El camino de santiago

Camino Peregrino

caminofrancesfederacion.com

 

[Marc S.]

But the “Camino Francés Federación” and the “Federación Española de
Asociaciones de Amigos del Camino de Santiago” aren’t the same organisation?

I think they are not. One is based in Logrono, the other in Carrion les Condes. And there is the other one in Jaca.
The distant armchair observer is wondering indeed ..

 

[J Willhaus]

I think they are not. One is based in Logrono, the other in Carrion les Condes. And there is the other one in Jaca.
The distant armchair observer is wondering indeed ..

This is the French Camino Association that apparently had the meeting. There is another body Spanish Federation of Associations of Friends of the Camino de Santiago that has representation for the amigo groups throughout Spain and not just the CF. The Jaca group would be considered on the French way through Aragon and therefore a part of the CF. I am not an expert or a member of these groups, but we have volunteered for both the FICS and HOSVOL albergues. Each one has some differences in rules, but the ones Phil and I have worked at don't accept pack/luggage transfer or reservations. That does not mean that all municipal/association albergues have these rules. We are members of the American Pilgrims on the Camino which has agreements with various Spanish groups and trains hospitaleros for various types of albergues and different types service on the Camino.

 

[asl]

No doubt there are a myriad of pilgrims who may be challenged to carry a full-pack (based on 10% guide) for the duration of their Camino. Having had back surgery, I am unsure whether I can. For this reason, I have had plans to lighten the load by having a separate pack sent forward. If it needs to be a backpack or duffel rather than a suitcase, that will work. If not, then could be interesting for me come September.

 

[Former member 92300]

Which municipals accept reservation? This is news to me.

It sounds like some have been accepting reservations recently with the high pilgrim numbers. I can't confirm - but I have read that some have been doing this on a couple Camino websites.

What I can confirm is that in June/July 2021 some municipals and religious albergues who normally don't accept reservations were accepting them when Spain reopened. This was due to COVID and Spain had JUST reopened. Perhaps they do this periodically when there are too many people? I don't know. I just know there were quite a few who asked me if I had reservations and one or two of them weren't full when I arrived but I didn't have a reservation so I had to look for another place. (I know one was a municipal - the other I can't remember if it was municipal or private).

 

[Kathor1]

I think this is it

CAMINO FRANCÉS FEDERACIÓN /// El camino de santiago

Camino Peregrino

caminofrancesfederacion.com

Thank you, @Marc S. You found something on the web that I had not yet found ... .

There is pretty little content on the website of the Camino Francés Federación. An entry from February 2023 shows something that I can only identify as a mock news magazine. The title is "La Invasión", edition is "Año 2022 / Volume 1 / Nr 0" and says "Precio 0 pts. Impresión: Astorga".

It is not a pdf and the print is so tiny that I can't read the articles (mock articles or real ones?). Maybe I'll have a look at it with the help of some webpage tools.

Not sure what to make of it all ...

 

[dougfitz]

Do they have one and if so what’s the link?

I find it confusing, too. And no, I don't know whether or not they have a web page.

 

[gypsy9]

Every municipal I have stayed in has accepted luggage. I’ve seen it on arrival (and reservations)
Hornillos del Camino
Sanbol (I walked with this person)
Riego de Ambros
Castrojeriz
To name a few…whether stipulated or not

 

[henrythedog]

You found something on the web that I had not yet found ... .

I’ll be offline for a short while; I need to buy a lottery ticket; clearly it’s an extraordinary day.

 

[David Tallan]

This is exactly one of the reasons why I think further clarity would be helpful. Disabilities and injuries should be taken into account when rules are made/changed. But - to be successful, it requires clear guidelines for albergue hosts and pilgrims alike to follow. There are some disabilities/injuries that are more visible than others. Private albergues can do what they want as they are private businesses -but for access to municipal/religious albergues - clarity/guidance in a lot of what is or is not accepted is beneficial.

I am by no means omniscient, but I am having trouble imagining a disability or injury that would require one to pack one's belongings for shipping from albergue to albergue in a suitcase instead of a backpack.

If one knows one never is going to carry it it may be more sensible and efficient. But if someone with a disability or injury really wants to use one of these 11 albergues, surely they can store their belongings in a backpack.

Or am I missing something?

 

[David Tallan]

I am frankly surprised that this is mentioned as a requirement only now. In the Alps, on Alpine huts for mountain walkers, light sleeping bags / liners have been a requirement for hygienic reasons for as long as I remember i.e. at least during the past 50 years. There’s actually a word for it: literally hut sleeping bag. Often a whitish colour and made of cotton.

They were a requirement in IYHF youth hostels 50 years ago, too.

 

[henrythedog]

Or am I missing something?

No; I don’t think you are missing anything.

Bearing in mind that this is a report of the meeting written by a 3rd party; it is not at all clear what has been resolved.

Specifically the article distinguishes between a suitcase and a rucksack; but doesn’t mention bag transport.

Perhaps we should wait for the association to state the position with more clarity?

 

[Hiking Joe]

Astorga , status of a pelegrino

 

[Former member 92300]

I am by no means omniscient, but I am having trouble imagining a disability or injury that would require one to pack one's belongings for shipping from albergue to albergue in a suitcase instead of a backpack.

If one knows one never is going to carry it it may be more sensible and efficient. But if someone with a disability or injury really wants to use one of these 11 albergues, surely they can store their belongings in a backpack.

Or am I missing something?

I wasn't referring to backpack vs suitcase - I was referring to J Willhaus statement that "The FICS managed albergue where we worked last summer did not accept pilgrims who received vehicle support meaning you should be walking and carrying your own pack."

Her statement wasn't that backpacks were accepted and suitcases were not - it was that they didn't accept pilgrims who received vehicle support (transport of bag). I have no issue with albergues not accepting luggage transport as a whole - but I personally feel Exceptions are needed for those with disabilities. But if there are other albergues nearby that is less of an issue. Not all towns have multiple albergues. Many - depending on the route - may only have 1 albergue. It would be a shame for a pilgrim to not be allowed to stay in the only albergue in a town because they have a disability/injury and couldn't carry their pack due to disability/injury.

 

[gypsy9]

Recalling a few more recently—Rabinal del Camino and Just spoke with a pilgrim —pack and reservation at molinaseca parochial municipal
And of course Valcarloss, Roncesvalles, Burgos
Most not some

 

[trecile]

Astorga , status of a pelegrino

See posts #37 and #72 above.

 

[david46]

And just how little one really needs. It's an illuminating and freeing revelation.
A 15 pound or less pack is within most people's capabilities.

Yes. Read Johnnie Walker's book 'It's About Time' for an excellent take on that.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

I am on the Norte now and have reserved all lodging ahead, staying at private albergues, pensiones, and a few small hotels. I have seen luggage transport waiting for "arrivals" of owners a few times already. Their suitcases look quite big and seem to be rather high end luggage.
Here are the ones I saw today (6 of them) when checking in to the "Km101", where we had a reservation.

 

[dougfitz]

If the albergues have decided to ban suitcases, then maybe their ideal is for the pilgrim to carry their rucksack all the way, unless there was good reason.

I don't read this that way. @dick bird has said something about this recently, perhaps earlier in this thread. This is about how the associations support those pilgrims without the wherewithal to undertake a pilgrimage if their only options were to stay in hotels and similar commercial establishments.

My own view is that if someone can afford to pay for pack transport, in the main they don't need the support offered by traditional albergues. This includes transporting backpacks, but that doesn't appear to be the subject that was addressed at this meeting, only suitcases.

They were not, it seems, suggesting some ideal of a backpacking pilgrim either, just that their albergues will be focussed on those that need their support most, inasmuch as they can discriminate these from others walking the Camino.

Of course, there might be pilgrims who do carry their own backpacks that mightn't need the support these pilgrim associations offer in their albergues. That is another matter.

 

[Kathor1]

I am on the Norte now and have reserved all lodging ahead, staying at private albergues, pensiones, and a few small hotels. I have seen luggage transport waiting for "arrivals" of owners a few times already. Their suitcases look quite big and seem to be rather high end luggage. Here are the ones I saw today (6 of them) when checking in to the "Km101", where we had a reservation.
View attachment 146640

Interesting photo. But now I am getting even more confused. This is obviously not on the Camino Francés which is unique among the Caminos in Spain if I understand the Camino Francés Federación correctly. I found an establishment on Booking.com called Km101 in Baamonde and, again if I understand correctly, it is not an establishment that offers the "traditional Camino Francés hospitality" as it may be defined by the Camino Francés Federación, it just offers hospitality, correct?

If that's the one then "Km101 provides accommodation with terrace, around 29 km from Lugo Cathedral. This sustainable guest house is located 29 km from Roman Walls of Lugo and 31 km from Congress and Exhibiton Center. Guests can make use of a garden. The units in the guest house are equipped with a flat-screen TV. Featuring a private bathroom with a shower and free toiletries, units at the guest house also offer free WiFi."

 

[dougfitz]

My question: did I become a tourist in Burgos when I started forwarding the suitcase?

Only you can tell that. I might suggest not, but I don't read minds, and avoid any suggestion that I can.

Personally, the distinction that people try to make between tourists and pilgrims is completely unjustified. Unfortunately, it pervades the forum, and has become so ingrained that most people have stopped to think about what they are really concerned about in the behaviours and attitudes of what many used to call tourigrinos, to the point where actually asking what their concerns really are is almost pointless. The suggestion that tourists carry suitcases and pilgrims carry backpacks is just unhelpful in working out who is a pilgrim. What it can do, though, is provide a hospitalero with an easy way of determining whether or not someone might get a bed for the night.

 

[good_old_shoes]

View attachment 146639Astorga , status of a pelegrino

I guess if he has carried it all the way on his back it counts as a backpack? He's surely not using a luggage service .

But honestly, if someone really carried an old suitcase all the way instead of a comfortable backpack, I think that pilgrim would deserve priority for a cheap bed in a municipal because he/she probably couldn't even afford the most basic gear...

 

[trecile]

Personally, the distinction that people try to make between tourists and pilgrims is completely unjustified.

I agree, and it annoys me when people say that some people just want a cheap holiday.

Really? If I wanted a cheap holiday I'd find a campground by a beach somewhere and relax. I don't think that I'd walk 15 - 30 km a day and sleep in dorms with 20 snoring strangers!

 

[Camino Chrissy]

Interesting photo. But now I am getting even more confused. This is obviously not on the Camino Francés which is unique among the Caminos in Spain if I understand the Camino Francés Federación correctly. I found an establishment on Booking.com called Km101 in Baamonde and, again if I understand correctly, it is not an establishment that offers the "traditional Camino Francés hospitality" as it may be defined by the Camino Francés Federación, it just offers hospitality, correct?

If that's the one then "Km101 provides accommodation with terrace, around 29 km from Lugo Cathedral. This sustainable guest house is located 29 km from Roman Walls of Lugo and 31 km from Congress and Exhibiton Center. Guests can make use of a garden. The units in the guest house are equipped with a flat-screen TV. Featuring a private bathroom with a shower and free toiletries, units at the guest house also offer free WiFi."

I realize this is not a traditional albergue on the Camino Frances. I am only acknowledging my surprise after many Caminos that I happen to notice more and more luggage transport (not just pack transport) on the Caminos I have been walking on...the trend seems to be growing.