Would appreciate feedback on walking with donkeys

[GAUVINS]

Hi.

Plans are to walk from the Puy-en-Velay to Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port, then to Irun to complete the walk via Camino del Norte + Primitivo. My wife, two daughters (5 and 10) and I. Starting from Le-Puy on July the 1st and probably sending the girls back home on August the 25th from Santander (we doubt we can cover the whole distance in time for them to be back in time for school).

We will walk with two donkeys because the girls are a bit young to walk such a distance.

We plan on camping as much as possible.

As we do not have any experience with donkeys, I would appreciate any feedback.

Thanks,

Stéphane

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

Hi.

Plans are to walk from the Puy-en-Velay to Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port, then to Irun to complete the walk via Camino del Norte + Primitivo. My wife, two daughters (5 and 10) and I. Starting from Le-Puy on July the 1st and probably sending the girls back home on August the 25th from Santander (we doubt we can cover the whole distance in time for them to be back in time for school).

We will walk with two donkeys because the girls are a bit young to walk such a distance.

We plan on camping as much as possible.

As we do not have any experience with donkeys, I would appreciate any feedback.

Thanks,

Stéphane

Hi Stephane, sorry I can't help you there but I wish you a great journey and a Buen Camino, Peter.

 

[Chacharm]

You don't have any experience with donkeys but you're planning a thousand km Camino with two donkeys?
Why?
I only saw people with donkeys twice. You'll need to make sure they have food and water (and sometimes shelter) every night and know how to check them for illness or injury and care for their feet. I don't know how young your daughters are but you should be aware that you'll likely need to stay mostly in hostels and hotels.
There are very few opportunities to camp. In most places it isn't allowed.
There was a young woman pacing me when I was on Camino. She had a 2 year old and an 8 month old with her and she was pushing a baby carriage. The 2 year old was wild with boredom and wanted to run and play but the mama was stuck with the carriage and the 8 month old. She was going a little crazy trying to keep both happy and keep that huge, laden cart moving every day. She was refused at several albuergues - the nuns and hospitaleros were uncomfortable having two baby girls in the place. And for good reason. In Astorga they exposed every peregrino to strep. They both had trouble sleeping in the albuergues and kept people up at night crying.

 

[Gerry Callaghan]

This could be quite a challenge.
I grew up with working donkeys on a small farm in the west of Ireland. Donkeys are wonderful, intelligent animals but their very intelligence makes them difficult to handle. They will quickly spot an inexperienced donkey handler and will develop strategies to show that they are the boss and you are their servant! A donkey may suddenly decide not to cross a bridge or take fright at a white line painted on the road. When this happens you have a choice, persuade the donkey that it's safe or change your route!

Donkeys need care, water a few times a day, fodder and water every evening. Carrying a bale of hay with you is inconvenient. Finding a person to sell you a replacement bale will be difficult in small villages and impossible in the towns and cities. You will have to carry an electric fence to prevent them wandering at night. Many albergues won't have a big enough garden to accommodate two donkeys. Farriers are now quite rare in rural Europe, what will you do if one of the donkeys casts a shoe on a climb?

My personal experience is about fifty years out of date so I'll refer you to Hannah Engelkamp's blog http://seasidedonkey.co.uk/
"The seaside donkey is a tiny adventure writ large. Starting in May 2013 I headed off around Wales, with Chico the eccentric donkey for company. The 1000-mile perimeter of Wales took five-and-a-half months to walk, and the blogs on this website tell the tale. "

If you have not worked with donkeys before you need a crash course in "donkeyology". You also need an old, experienced animal raw donkeys and raw handler is a recipie for disaster!

 

[cher99840]

While I admire your sense of adventure, I would think that a short journey with a donkey would be more appropriate first, to gain some experience of what a longer journey would entail.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I did a two week trek with donkeys, and it was a unique experience. The donkeys come first, so after you have tied them down, watered them, and fed them, you can join the rest of your family. This book tells you all you need to know: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00J1EU2MC/?tag=casaivar02-20

Well, not everything. Take a course in using a donkey! Animal rights activists tore into Moore after he wrote his book!

 

[mspath]

For a nineteenth century evocative account of walking with a donkey check out Robert Louis Stevenson's "Travels with a Donkey". See more here --
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/chemin-de-robert-louis-stevenson.25773/

 

[VSB]

The pilgrim refuge Adosanes (along the Vezelay route but I forget exactly where now - perhaps someone can remember?) is attached to a donkey sanctuary - hence the name, 'behind the donkeys'. The owners told of trying to walk to Santiago with donkeys, but finding it was too far for the animals. When I was there, they were looking after a donkey left by another pilgrim who also found it was too far for the poor beast of burden. I'm not an expert myself, but perhaps there are some on this forum who could give a definitive answer. However, my understanding is that it is not possible, or fair, to take a donkey on such a long journey. I'm sorry to have to give you such negative feedback, and I must say I admire your determination to make this camino work for you. I hope you'll find a way

 

[VSB]

Found it - Adosanes is in Benevant l'Abbaye. Here is a link: http://www.ânes.net/randonner_ane/Limousin.htm. I know it's not on the route you're looking at, but you might find some useful information. I'm sure there are other similar enterprises closer to the Le Puy route. Either way these are the people who can give you some hard facts about walking the camino with donkeys. Best of luck!

 

[Kiwi-family]

OK so you've got lots of negative feedback! Can I add something positive? Last year I walked 1,500km with four kids aged 8-13. You might be surprised how well children can walk;-) We walked for a few days with a French man and his donkey - it was a novelty to us, but a others have said, animals take more effort and care than the children. Could I encourage you to consider letting your children walk? By the way, I did not see anyone riding a donkey - they still walked alongside.
We walked our first camino when our youngest was six. The key is to stick to distances that the children can manage - do not push them too far. (at the same time, I will add that they managed more than we anticipated they would). You may hear some doom and gloom about walking with children, but my experiences have been superb and I am so pleased we made hiking part of our family culture.
All the best.

 

[CarlaH]

OK so you've got lots of negative feedback! Can I add something positive? Last year I walked 1,500km with four kids aged 8-13. You might be surprised how well children can walk;-) We walked for a few days with a French man and his donkey - it was a novelty to us, but a others have said, animals take more effort and care than the children. Could I encourage you to consider letting your children walk? By the way, I did not see anyone riding a donkey - they still walked alongside.
We walked our first camino when our youngest was six. The key is to stick to distances that the children can manage - do not push them too far. (at the same time, I will add that they managed more than we anticipated they would). You may hear some doom and gloom about walking with children, but my experiences have been superb and I am so pleased we made hiking part of our family culture.
All the best.

During my Camino (May-July) last year I also met up with a French man (Francois) and his donkey (Deus) - was this the same man you walked with for a few day? Francois and Deus had walked from Bordeaux, the first time I met them was late afternoon in Puenta de la Reina, there was a terrific storm during the night - leaving town in the morning I noticed a donkey standing alone under a tree with a broken tether around it's foot, I was convinced it was Theos and waited with him...20 min later Francois comes running towards the bridge, saw Deus , threw his arms around him and cried, apparently Deus bolted during the storm (they were staying on a farm on the outskirts of town) and Francois had been up since midnight walking the town flat looking for Deus... we crossed paths a few times and the last time I saw him was in Viana, Deus had an injured hoof and Francois was not sure they would be able to finish and get to Santiago - I never saw him again and do so hope that they did get to finally get to Santiago!
I think that the daily walking is hard on a donkey...and that finding places to stay at the end of the day would be a challenge... I'm not sure I would want to put a donkey through this

 

[newfydog]

I would recommend the Stevenson trail, where there are many companies providing well trained donkeys and shuttle and support. Donkeys are wonderful but a lot of resposibility. You need two people per donkey, one to push and one to pull!

 

[Rebekah Scott]

And donkeys are SLOW. They walk at about 3 km. per hour. That is slower than the average person. And there's no good way to speed them up!
Still, many many people walk the camino every year with donkeys. Most of the people (and donks) are French... there's a French donkey livery service that rents out camino-wise donkeys and picks them up again at the end of the trail. It is NOT cheap, and you have to pay for the donkey's feed on top of the rental fee.

 

[newfydog]

A nice donkey on the Stevenson Trail. They spent hours caring for it.

:



Our donkey:

 

[LesBrass]

there is another book... which I read maybe 7 or 8 times before I walked my camino... http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0099471949/?tag=casaivar-21
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Spanish-Steps-Travels-With-Donkey/dp/0099471949
It's not exactly PC but I guess it was from the heart and it made me giggle... a lot. My husband gave me the book in the hope that the hardships Tim faced would put me off the idea of walking but it actually did the opposite.

it's worth a read

 

[VSB]

The OP is walking from Le Puy to Santiago via Irun, a journey of nearly 2,000km. It's rather more than any of the other examples raised here. Yes, two or three weeks on the Stevenson, or on four on the Camino Frances, might just be possible with a donkey. Doubtless there are yet more examples of people who've done it. But please, think again about the strain you'd be putting on two animals travelling with you for around three months. There might be another way to ease the burden on your children, though. Perhaps those who have walked with children could offer some practical advice on how to support them in their walk, to encourage the OP to look at how it might be done without relying on two donkeys?

 

[newfydog]

Here's a horse who has done the Camino twice. Notice he is not being ridden. The owner walks the first hour for him to warm up. He also has a full time caretaker driving the route with a horse trailer to take the horse to a nice pasture each night.

 

[GAUVINS]

Just came back to read feedbacks.

1. We are renting donkeys. (Lolita and Salomé). They did the Chemin already.

2. Miam Miam Dodo (French guidebook) lists tens of donkey friendly accommodations.

3. We were advised against trying the El Norte because of numerous river crossings. So we'll do the Frances instead.(if all goes well up to SJPP)

4. We have registered for "training" from an independent farmer. And will get a little more advice from the renter when we meet at le Puy.

5. Surprised by several posts (donkeys are very robust animals and they feed on grass). We expect to average 20km/day. The renter sees the kids to be the limiting factor. We are now planning to walk le Puy to SJPP with our daughters accompanied by Lolita and Salome. If all goes well (girls bonding with donkeys) we might take the cavalry to Santiago. Otherwise send the girls to their grand parents and the donkeys to their home fields. Or walk with the girls. (our 10-year old will have walked. Our 5 year old may have ridden Lolita)

6. Will certainly post a summary this Fall.

Thanks for the links. Will read

 

[GAUVINS]

This could be quite a challenge.
I grew up with working donkeys on a small farm in the west of Ireland. Donkeys are wonderful, intelligent animals but their very intelligence makes them difficult to handle. They will quickly spot an inexperienced donkey handler and will develop strategies to show that they are the boss and you are their servant! A donkey may suddenly decide not to cross a bridge or take fright at a white line painted on the road. When this happens you have a choice, persuade the donkey that it's safe or change your route!

Donkeys need care, water a few times a day, fodder and water every evening. Carrying a bale of hay with you is inconvenient. Finding a person to sell you a replacement bale will be difficult in small villages and impossible in the towns and cities. You will have to carry an electric fence to prevent them wandering at night. Many albergues won't have a big enough garden to accommodate two donkeys. Farriers are now quite rare in rural Europe, what will you do if one of the donkeys casts a shoe on a climb?

My personal experience is about fifty years out of date so I'll refer you to Hannah Engelkamp's blog http://seasidedonkey.co.uk/
"The seaside donkey is a tiny adventure writ large. Starting in May 2013 I headed off around Wales, with Chico the eccentric donkey for company. The 1000-mile perimeter of Wales took five-and-a-half months to walk, and the blogs on this website tell the tale. "

If you have not worked with donkeys before you need a crash course in "donkeyology". You also need an old, experienced animal raw donkeys and raw handler is a recipie for disaster!

Thanks for the link