Traveling in character

[William Garza]

A really..odd question
Have you ever seen a peregrino in character?
A monk, a dandy,a highwayman?
Just for the sport of it..or an authenticity, a search for how it may have been..or never been to travel cognito in costume.
Just a curious question of my imagination about how practical\impractical dress would have been..and shoes..oh boy...

 

[amancio]

I once saw a man with a sort of silky robe with A-line miniskirt in sort of a fuchsia colour... odd. Odd.

 

[HeidiL]

I've seen a few men in long robes, carrying tall staffs and what looked like blanket rolls, not modern backpacks.

One of them wore ill-fitting sandals that looked very home-made, the others all wore modern shoes.

 

[Deleted member 73526]

For me, the Camino is a chance to strip away all the nonsense, to be myself, and to encounter other people as they are, so walking the Camino "in character" is not something that I can easily relate to. Of course, I'd speak to a person in costume and I'd be interested to know what motivates them to do that. I guess they may be interested in historical re-enactment, or raising money for charity. Those seem like good reasons. But if it's just attention seeking ("Look at me! I'm as mad as a box of frogs, I am!") I probably wouldn't want to spend much time with that person.

 

[NualaOC]

I wear clothes that I'd never wear at home and don't care how I look ..... does that count?

 

[André Walker]

On my 2014 Camino I met a man who looked like a Hells Angel. Tattoos all over his arms, legs, chest and back, wearing a bandana.

Very fierce looking. At dinner it turned out he's a orthodox priest. When I told him I never would expect a priest to have tattoos like he did, he explained them. They were all either camino tattoos, biblical or spiritual.

This showed me -once again- not to judge a book by it's cover.

 

[Kathor1]

I wear clothes that I'd never wear at home and don't care how I look ..... does that count?

That was my first thought, too. Thousands and thousands walk today in character ☺. You can spot them from a mile. In fact, I told a few friends once that they didn't even need to attach a shell to their backpacks, anyone would recognise immediately that we were on the way to Santiago with one look at our backpacks, our trousers, our shoes, our shirts and jackets, our poles ...

 

[Kathor1]

Have you ever seen a peregrino in character? A monk, a dandy, a highwayman? Just a curious question of my imagination about how practical\impractical dress would have been..and shoes..oh boy...

I've never seen anyone dressed up in what we think is classical medieval pilgrim outfit and actually walking long-distance to Santiago. Nor do I even recall (Catholic) clergy, monks or nuns recognisable as such by their clothes. If there were any, they were either wearing civilian clothing or I didn't register it any more than I do in normal life.

I remember Steven Payne who posted a bit on this forum once. He is a re-enactor and wore a genuine outfit like people would have done at a time in the Middle Ages - not only in appearance but also in quality and quantity. He walked a pilgrimage trail to Canterbury and slept outside, despite cold and rainy weather. His leather shoes looked quite comfortable. Why do you think "shoes ... oh boy"? People were used to walking a lot more than most of us do today. They had good shoes. They didn't need to walk around for a while beforehand to get used to them. And there was no concrete or asphalt as road surface, many roads were not even hardened with stones. And we know from reports that there were shoemakers along the roads who could repair your shoes or sell you a new pair.

There are a few people who dress up to look like medieval peregrinos, for various reasons. But I think their clothes just look like that, the material is not genuinely similar. And it's only the layer of clothing that is visible.

 

[Kiwi-family]

On my 2014 Camino I met a man who looked like a Hells Angel. Tattoos all over his arms, legs, chest and back, wearing a bandana.

I’m really wondering about how he wore that bandana

 

[Kathor1]

Below is a photo of the shoes that a history student with focus on medieval history made and used for a pilgrimage to Santiago and Finisterre in the summer of 2012, in total 62 days and 1.400 km, based on the equipment of a pilgrim from the 14th century. He says that he needed to repair them frequently but never had a single blister, to the astonishment of many other pilgrims in contemporary shoes.

 

[Kathor1]

Andreas Moitzi, the history student from Austria, also says, and this goes perhaps to the core of the OP's question, that he was very recognisable and that many people thought that he did this to put himself into the situation of a medieval pilgrim. But this wasn't the case, quite the contrary, as he explains: any such attempt is doomed to fail because so much has changed since then: religiosity, mentality, physical condition, infrastructure and so on and so on. The medieval outfit was not the reason why he went on pilgrimage to Santiago, it was just his chosen mode of making the journey.

 

[grumerz]

Came across these three fellows on th CF in 2016, somewhere before Santiago de Compestella. They were dressed the part, albeit in conventional footgear. They related they were coming from England, had been doing similar "walks" together for over thirty years and made every effort to live as did their fellow travelers, several centuries ago. After they graciously allowed me to take their picture, the grizzled fellow on the left reached under his tunic and withdrew his own camera; which was far more complex than my own. Visage of true history now destroyed, I wished them all a "Buen Camino!" and watched them plod off happily, humming an indecipherable tune.

 

[Moorwalker]

A really..odd question
Have you ever seen a peregrino in character?
A monk, a dandy,a highwayman?
Just for the sport of it..or an authenticity, a search for how it may have been..or never been to travel cognito in costume.
Just a curious question of my imagination about how practical\impractical dress would have been..and shoes..oh boy...

I've done quite a lot with historical re-creation societies. Early to mid-medieval dress is remarkably practical and comfortable to wear, the main difference that people notice is that it's a lot heavier than modern clothing. I've slept many a night wrapped in my cloak too, and felted wool is surprisingly water-resistant.

Medieval pilgrims wouldn't have been able to carry complete changes of clothing, although it would be perfectly practical to carry a spare under-garment made of lightweight linen.

Shoes are less easy, partly because it's quite difficult to get good medieval shoes made, but also that most people's feet nowadays are not accustomed to unpadded footwear. Again, I've walked substantial distances in soft turnshoes with a thicker leather sole and the only real disadvantage is that they wear out quickly

 

[RJM]

I saw a peregrino on the Frances once who was walking while wearing one of those brown pilgrim robes type clothing. He even had one of those gourd sticks. I did notice he did have a set of modern trail runners on his feet, though. I made the comment to him his choice of footwear was not authentic. He told me he was traditional, but not stupid lol.

 

[Juspassinthru]

Father Joyful, Camino Francés, May 2017
Note the bare feet

 

[Turga]

Below is a photo of the shoes that a history student with focus on medieval history made and used for a pilgrimage to Santiago and Finisterre in the summer of 2012, in total 62 days and 1.400 km, based on the equipment of a pilgrim from the 14th century. He says that he needed to repair them frequently but never had a single blister, to the astonishment of many other pilgrims in contemporary shoes.

Perhaps in those days they made shoes to fit feet, not shoes to make feet fit fashion

 

[William Garza]

Father Joyful, Camino Francés, May 2017
Note the bare feet

View attachment 61258

What a beautiful human!

 

[Kathor1]

Father Joyful, Camino Francés, May 2017
Note the bare feet

Father Joyful? Erm, well, ok ... https://www.trailjournals.com/journal/entry/565840 . There was of course also Zapatones. Some of you must have taken a photo of him.

What I noticed with interest is the fact, that the three people in @grumerz' photo as well as the two people I mentioned earlier who had studied medieval pilgrim clothing and spent a lot of time to procure it or make it themselves did not wear the brown robes peregrino outfit that is imprinted on your retinas ...

 

[Juspassinthru]

Father Joyful? Erm, well, ok ... https://www.trailjournals.com/journal/entry/565840 . There was of course also Zapatones. Some of you must have taken a photo of him.

What I noticed with interest is the fact, that the three people in @grumerz' photo as well as the two people I mentioned earlier who had studied medieval pilgrim clothing and spent a lot of time to procure it or make it themselves did not wear the brown robes peregrino outfit that is imprinted on your retinas ...

We ran in to the good “Father” in Atapuerca and again in Burgos on May 31st 2017. Did he share with you who told him to walk the Camino? I read your blog post, at least his story was consistent.

 

[John Crawford Howell]

Father Joyful, Camino Francés, May 2017
Note the bare feet

View attachment 61258

Do you recall the name of the Pueblo where you took the photo, Juspassinthrough? Thanks, John

 

[Elle Bieling]

 

[JabbaPapa]

I've never seen anyone dressed up in what we think is classical medieval pilgrim outfit and actually walking long-distance to Santiago.

Then you've never met me ...

Nor do I even recall (Catholic) clergy, monks or nuns recognisable as such by their clothes. If there were any, they were either wearing civilian clothing or I didn't register it any more than I do in normal life.

I've come across a few, but truth is that many of them want to travel "incognito" -- also, depending on time of year, priests or deacons or seminarians may simply forgo their cassock purely because of impracticality in the heat.

Monks and nuns walking the Camino tend, in my experience, to keep their habits, but then the Rule of their Order can require them to.

 

[John Crawford Howell]

I saw him in a restaurantt in Logroño, but did not have an opportunity to speak with him.

 

[Juspassinthru]

Do you recall the name of the Pueblo where you took the photo, Juspassinthrough? Thanks, John

Atapuerca on May 30 2017

 

[JabbaPapa]

Not taken on Camino (note the absence of shell & backpack), but basically this is me :



I have lost the cape annoyingly, but I intend to replace it soon.

 

[John Crawford Howell]

Atapuerca on May 30 2017

Many thanks. I was in nearby Ages.

 

[Juspassinthru]

Many thanks. I was in nearby Ages.

We began our day in Agés, we stayed Albergue San Rafael

 

[Moorwalker]

What I noticed with interest is the fact, that the three people in @grumerz' photo as well as the two people I mentioned earlier who had studied medieval pilgrim clothing and spent a lot of time to procure it or make it themselves did not wear the brown robes peregrino outfit that is imprinted on your retinas ...

Medieval clothing was almost certainly a lot more colourful than most people think. For the poor people it would have been mostly natural wool colours so anything between light cream to dark brown. But natural dyes can produce a wide range of surprisingly bright colours so even poor people who made their own clothing might have dyed some pieces, or made colouful edgings or braids. Richer people may well have worn quite bright clothing especially if they could afford silk instead of wool or linen. There are plenty of medieval paintings and books showing bright colours, and even allowing for the artistic license of the painter that would suggest that people wore things other than brown. Since cloth was expensive (see below) most people would not have had multiple items of clothing nor would they have made or purchased special items to go on pilgrimage and so would have been wearing their ordinary,day to day clothes.

* I kept a record of how much time it took me to spin, weave (on a backstrap loom) and sew the fabric to make a knee length tunic, and it came to around 80 hours of work. Allowing for the fact that I would have been a lot slower than someone who did it all the time, you are looking at around a week of full time work to make a single garment. At average UK wages now that would equate to about £500 value for one garment. It's no wonder that people left blankets and cloaks in their wills, they were valuable gifts.

 

[JabbaPapa]

Medieval clothing was almost certainly a lot more colourful than most people think. For the poor people it would have been mostly natural wool colours so anything between light cream to dark brown. But natural dyes can produce a wide range of surprisingly bright colours so even poor people who made their own clothing might have dyed some pieces, or made colouful edgings or braids. Richer people may well have worn quite bright clothing especially if they could afford silk instead of wool or linen.

All good stuff, though the only source I'm aware of making anything like the full traditional pilgrim robes & cloak using the original type of wool provides them in brown, light grey, and black.

But you are absolutely correct that the richer pilgrims would flaunt that fact via their clothing.

There are plenty of medieval paintings and books showing bright colours, and even allowing for the artistic license of the painter that would suggest that people wore things other than brown. Since cloth was expensive (see below) most people would not have had multiple items of clothing nor would they have made or purchased special items to go on pilgrimage and so would have been wearing their ordinary,day to day clothes.

Some certainly would, particularly when they were being assisted by multiple servants brought along, but one should not forget that many pilgrims did seek a Camino defined by ascetism and/or simplicity, and so could deliberately travel less ostentatiously than they might have otherwise.

At average UK wages now that would equate to about £500 value for one garment.

An excellent appraisal ...

€600 is the price I've seen for a new one today in 2019.

 

[Kathor1]

the two people I mentioned earlier who had studied medieval pilgrim clothing and spent a lot of time to procure it or make it themselves did not wear the brown robes peregrino outfit

This is what their garments looked like:

 

[John Crawford Howell]

We began our day in Agés, we stayed Albergue San Rafael

I stayed at Albergue El Pajar. We may well have crossed paths; the Camino provides many possible storylines.

 

[Kathor1]

Did he share with you who told him to walk the Camino? I read your blog post, at least his story was consistent.

I didn't meet Father Joyful, I read up on him. I'm not sure that I need to know who told him to walk the Camino.

I have no issues with all this, the pilgrims population on the modern camino is multifaith in the widest possible sense, including no faith at all. It's just when I read "in character" in the first message of the thread I was thinking in a traditional Saint James pilgrimage context, not in the context of an Eastern religion inspired and California based contemporary spirituality (that's my best effort at describing it in a few words - I had a look at his FB page).

 

[Moorwalker]

All good stuff, though the only source I'm aware of making anything like the full traditional pilgrim robes & cloak using the original type of wool provides them in brown, light grey, and black.

SNIP

€600 is the price I've seen for a new one today in 2019.

You can buy pretty good wool fabric for around £15 per metre, up to museum quality reproduction cloth for about £40. Loose fitting clothing similar to early to mid medieval is pretty easy to make, I've even done it entirely by hand and it doesn't take all that long to sew. The best sources I know in the UK can be found at historical markets, there are several cloth vendors who attend regularly.

 

[Moorwalker]

That looks like proper cloth hose in the picture on the right, those are tricky to make and fit

 

[William Garza]

Not taken on Camino (note the absence of shell & backpack), but basically this is me :

View attachment 61265

I have lost the cape annoyingly, but I intend to replace it soon.

Killer!

 

[David]

A few years ago I met a young man dressed as a Crusader knight, chain mail, white surcoat with red cross, helmet, belted sword in scabbard (modern trainers).
On closer inspection the chain mail was 'film use', light synthetic, and the sword was made of painted wood.
He was very cheerful!

 

[Jeff Crawley]

A few years ago I met a young man dressed as a Crusader knight, chain mail, white surcoat with red cross, helmet, belted sword in scabbard (modern trainers).
On closer inspection the chain mail was 'film use', light synthetic, and the sword was made of painted wood.
He was very cheerful!

Came out of St Pancras railway station (in London) about two months ago to see six similarly attired gents - turned out they were supporters of the England cricket team . . .

 

[Jeff Crawley]

I met Marcelino Lobato down by the lake in Logrono back in 2003



He was handing out biscuits, nuts and walking sticks - I still have a hazelnut with "2003" written on it.

 

[Kathor1]

All this talk about chain mail reminded me of a fascinating shop with serious looking medieval garments and gear for aspiring knights "in character". The shop was close to the roads beaten by today's pilgrims. I'd need to look up where it was, perhaps in Logroño? And I'm of course also reminded of Tomás of Manjarin, and I'm wondering whether there are others, in addition to Tomás and Zapatones, who don't walk the Camino but live on the Camino "in character" or in costume.

And I am reminded of the pioneering trip of three men from Estella who went on pilgrimage from Roncesvalles to Santiago in the spring of 1963. The Estella association of the Friends of the Camino were one of the major driving forces behind the revival of the contemporary camino pilgrimage. Their trip stirred up great interest in the Spanish media at the time and helped to promote the Camino Frances.

 

[Kathor1]

That looks like proper cloth hose in the picture on the right, those are tricky to make and fit

I had to look up what "cloth hose" means. The website of the Austrian pilgrim is in German and he talks about Beinlinge. Looking at the explanation of his sewing work and also at his photos in general, I think he had both of these to cover his legs and perhaps wore them alternatively:



Walking "in character" isn't as easy as one might think ☺. It definitely requires a lot of preparation and a talent for handiwork. I really appreciate the expertise that you bring to this thread, @Moorwalker!

 

[Jeff Crawley]

Coincidentally I was reading a prose version of the Canterbury Tales last night and came across the description of the Knight:

His clothes might have deceived you as to his rank. His habergeoun was bespattered with the mud of his latest journey, and his gipoun was but of fustian, yet his horse was a fine one.

It turns out that a habergeoun was a sleeveless chainmail vest, a gipoun a loose cassock and fustian is a thick cotton cloth.



Thank goodness for modern, hi-tech clothing!

 

[Kathor1]

@Jeff Crawley, I don't know whether you are interested in sock knitting but as someone who knows how to knit a sock with four needles I was intrigued to learn that knitted socks were a rarity for medieval people and/or a luxury item. Knitting with two or more needles was a fairly recent invention. Below is apparently one of the first images (at least for the area between the North Sea and the Alps) that show this new technology: Mary knitting a garment for baby Jesus.

Long discussions about what kind of socks to take with you or how many socks to wear must have been highly unlikely in medieval pilgrim circles.

 

[Moorwalker]

Walking "in character" isn't as easy as one might think ☺. It definitely requires a lot of preparation and a talent for handiwork. I really appreciate the expertise that you bring to this thread, @Moorwalker!

I learned mostly out of necessity. When I started hiking and camping a very long time ago (I'm in my mid 60s and was walking alone from age about 12 so back in the late 1960s) I couldn't afford to buy ready made kit so I learned to sew from my Mum and made most of my own stuff. I learned to knit socks from my gran because it was impossible to buy good wool socks in small sizes. I even made a tent for my O level needlework exam!

The historical stuff came about because I got involved in historical recreation. I hated history at school but I like cooking and eating, and I became interested in food history and that led to clothing history. And fighting was fun.

You don't need advanced skills to make most medieval clothing, partly because most of it is fairly loose fitting so it doesn't need fancy tailoring. Hose are the exception but even then, a bit of experimenting will produce something useable. The only thing that is a problem now is shoes, it's quite difficult to get authentic shoes that are made for proper walking.

 

[Jeff Crawley]

@Jeff Crawley, I don't know whether you are interested in sock knitting but as someone who knows how to knit a sock with four needles I was intrigued to learn that knitted socks were a rarity for medieval people and/or a luxury item. Knitting with two or more needles was a fairly recent invention. Below is apparently one of the first images (at least for the area between the North Sea and the Alps) that show this new technology: Mary knitting a garment for baby Jesus.

Long discussions about what kind of socks to take with you or how many socks to wear must have been highly unlikely in medieval pilgrim circles.

View attachment 61392

I had the privilege of walking part of my first CF with two teachers - one from Chile and one from Switzerland. The Swiss lady was knitting her friend a pair of socks while she walked. Watching somebody walk, talk, turn a heel and learn the words to "On Ilkley Moor Baht 'at" on the path to Foncebadon was a life changing experience!

I could never quite manage knitting with 4 needles - poor sense of balance I suppose:



Besides the MAGIC LOOP is the way to go for socks though I've yet to master knitting two socks on the one needle at the same time!

 

[Moorwalker]

I had the privilege of walking part of my first CF with two teachers - one from Chile and one from Switzerland. The Swiss lady was knitting her friend a pair of socks while she walked. Watching somebody walk, talk, turn a heel and learn the words to "On Ilkley Moor Baht 'at" on the path to Foncebadon was a life changing experience!

Besides the MAGIC LOOP is the way to go for socks though I've yet to master knitting two socks on the one needle at the same time!

Ooh that's a subject for debate! I worked out various loop methods when I was learning to knit back in the early 1960s and I much prefer using 4 needles for small items like socks or hats or sleeves. And I can happily knit while walking or watching television, or reading. I even did most of a sock the day after I had laser surgery for short sight so most of it was done with my eyes closed.

 

[Jeff Crawley]

Ooh that's a subject for debate! I worked out various loop methods when I was learning to knit back in the early 1960s and I much prefer using 4 needles for small items like socks or hats or sleeves. And I can happily knit while walking or watching television, or reading. I even did most of a sock the day after I had laser surgery for short sight so most of it was done with my eyes closed.

But can you knit TWO socks at the same time on the one set of needles?
(nope, me neither!)

 

[Saint Mike II]

A really..odd question
Have you ever seen a peregrino in character?
A monk, a dandy,a highwayman?
Just for the sport of it..or an authenticity, a search for how it may have been..or never been to travel cognito in costume.
Just a curious question of my imagination about how practical\impractical dress would have been..and shoes..oh boy...

Back in 2015 I cycled the Frances and was thus able to visit Samos Monestira. From the village I followed Brierley's alternate route via Pascais & Veiga. Between these two villages I came across a pilgrim in a tattered robe, no foot coverings and hair that would have gotten him a part in the 1960's musical of the same name. If memory serves he had a small back pack and a "stave" about 1500/1800 mm (5 or 6 ft). I also ran into an American in Uterga who was dressed as a munk (I thought he was Rasputin's brother until he spoke)

 

[andywild]

I’m really wondering about how he wore that bandana

He was obviously a super cool kind of chap

 

[Jeff Crawley]

He was obviously a super cool kind of chapView attachment 61418

Oh that's a shame - never mind, you can always get somebody to Photoshop the smartphone and your hands off of the sunglasses lens.

 

[Kathor1]

I've always wondered whether the movie scene below is real or staged, ie based on real pilgrims or pure artistic licence. I've never seen anything like it on the CF. I couldn't remember whether it was Sheen or Buñuel, so I had to go to YouTube and let the Sheen movie run at double speed and without sound yet again.

There's a close up later on, interesting fashion ...

 

[Moorwalker]

But can you knit TWO socks at the same time on the one set of needles?
(nope, me neither!)

Do you mean one sock inside the other? Yes, it's not difficult once you learn how, but it needs concentration because one mistake means that the two are irrevocably joined together, so I don't.

 

[Blintintin]

i saw these two pereginas several times on CF Sept 2018. they travelled on donkeys. I snuck this photo of them as they toured Cathedral in Burgos...they were snapping photos using their medieval iPads!

 

[Jeff Crawley]

Do you mean one sock inside the other? Yes, it's not difficult once you learn how, but it needs concentration because one mistake means that the two are irrevocably joined together, so I don't.

No, side by side!



Two balls of yarn, not connected. Apparently you can knit them toe up or cuff down - I've only succeeded in two tubes! It means you knit the cuffs at the same time, turn the heels at the same time . . .

I remember my mother knitting a tubular scarf for my sister on two needles: odd stitches were for the front face, even stitches for the rear - looked really odd!

 

[Kathor1]

I'm not sure whether to like, love or haha the messages in the thread branch on unusual knitting methods. I'm fascinated in any case.

 

[Moorwalker]

No, side by side!

Two balls of yarn, not connected. Apparently you can knit them toe up or cuff down - I've only succeeded in two tubes! It means you knit the cuffs at the same time, turn the heels at the same time . . .

I remember my mother knitting a tubular scarf for my sister on two needles: odd stitches were for the front face, even stitches for the rear - looked really odd!

I've done that as an experiment, but I don't like working with long lengths of floppy cable. my fingers know how to knit with 4 needles so I just let them get on with it.

 

[JabbaPapa]

Pilgrims carrying their Cross in that way are extremely rare, but they do exist. Just don't expect to meet one.

 

[Kathor1]

Pilgrims carrying their Cross in that way are extremely rare, but they do exist. Just don't expect to meet one.

I wonder whether the movie scene from The Way was inspired by one of the local pilgrimages TO Roncesvalles that usually take place in May. These pilgrims look quite different from Camino pilgrims:

 

[André Walker]

I’m really wondering about how he wore that bandana

Well, luckily he wasn’t Scottish....

 

[Jeff Crawley]

Well, luckily he wasn’t Scottish....

I see what you mean.