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My glasses aren't designer by any stretch of the imagination but they still cost over $1,000 because the script is so complicated thanks to astigmatism in my right eye plus other complications.Re losing glasses? This one I do not understand ... if glasses are important and someone is going on a five week rucksack hike in a foreign country, then surely they buy two pairs of really cheap glasses and leave their designer ones at home? If they break or lose their glasses they have a back up pair, and if they take their prescription with them if they are twice unlucky they just get some cheap ones made at the next city ... or am I missing something?
The only constant in our lives is change.
I would add a good head torch. We did a bit of blundering around in the dark in the first couple of weeks on the VdlP trying to find the arrows.
And there you have it.....Hang on, if in life there no constant but only change then that would make change a constant
I thought that it was death and taxes.The only constant in our lives is change.
Did you say « Dragons »?When I started, the main problem was the dragons.
I thought those were the only certain things.I thought that it was death and taxes.
I walked the Frances in 2012 and have quite a few long distance walks under my belt now. I flit in and out of the forum, depending on what’s going on in life and tend to wander in more right before/after a trip.Last week, I celebrated my 70th birthday, and the 10th anniversary of my first Camino in 2013. Things HAVE changed since then. For one thing, there are tens of thousands more forum members. I think we recently exceeded 100,000 members.
Some of those members are long time veterans. Others are newbies. Some have done dozens of Caminos. Others are trying to do their first one.
However, and IMHO, people have STILL not gotten comfortable using the SEARCH function at the top, right corner of the web page, before asking the SAME BASIC QUESTIONS. Just use key-words for your search: sleeping bag, July, Burgos, walking poles, Madrid airport, etc. The reply will be huge. You can limit your search within the initial results. The forum search function is VERY ROBUST.
I say this because many of us veterans no longer immediately dive-in to repeat the same answers to the same questions we gave years ago. Things do not change that much from year to year. My view, and that of some other veterans I have communicated with on this issue, is that the lesser experienced pilgrims should search the hundreds of thousands of posts, before asking a particular question.
Those among us who have been there and done that are ALWAYS willing to help out with a new variant of an old question, provided the new variant of the question is unique enough to warrant a new answer. The Conversation or Private Message function exists so any forum member can ask another forum member a specific question that may not be of interest to the other 100,000+ members. I ALWAYS reply to my PMs - and quickly.
Lastly, I was 59 when I first learned of the Camino. Aged 60 when I arrived at Santiago the first time, walking from SJPdP on my first Camino.
Now, 10 years later, I am starting to see my mortality ahead of me. I intend to remain active as long as I can. But, over the past three-years, I have mourned the passing of more than a dozen, family members, friends, and former colleagues. The COVID pandemic, and the passage of years, have thinned out the proverbial herd a bit.
While I accept this as a fact of life, and I am well-aware that no one gets out of life alive, it is all very sobering. In fact, the Camino and this forum got me through the COVID thing over the past more than three years. When I have a bad day, I can always find something to do here to help someone else. Finding issues to reply to is never a problem.
While I continue to try to walk a Camino each spring and to volunteer at the Pilgrim Office each summer - usually around the Apostle's Feast - when they need the help the most, life sometimes gets in the way. I am currently the caregiver for my wife, who is gravely ill. So, no Santiago or Camino for me this season. Señor Santiago will still be there next year, and the years after.
What I am trying to impart here is that I, and some others, who are more "mature" persons, are still actively participating in the forum. We also try to keep our passion for the Camino - and all related things alive - in part by helping in the forum. However, we are not as keen to jump on every post in every thread. The consequence, is that it "appears" that we are not as active.
On the contrary, we are active. We are there, lurking in the background, reading the highlights every day. just more selective at what discussions we choose to dive into. As I become more senior, I am more deliberate at where I choose to offer assistance. I will always be here to help any pilgrim, for as long as my Savior gives me the strength, and internet connectivity.
Hope this helps clarify matters.
Tom
When I started, the main problem was the dragons.
At least not Dungeons, too.Did you say « Dragons »?
Just leave laterI will have to find a thread tha discusses how to pack one’s backpack silently, in the dark, when one has a CPAP machine in three parts.
I lost my very expensive multifocal glasses on my first Camino in 2007! Didn't even know the forum existed. Took a taxi back to before the place I thought I lost them - I had put them on the ground when I changed something I was wearing I think - and spent a couple of hours retracing my steps. Anyway - glasses lost - a bit blind for the rest of the week. Went to the optometrist in Santiago - ordered a new fashionable pair much cheaper than home. Still a bit sightless, walked to Finistere, took the bus back, picked up my glasses and flew home. I contemplated the lesson and decided it was a big nudge to see things differently - in a new light.People need different things at different stages of their journey. I spent almost a year lurking and learning before I left on my walk. I do see the need for on the walk assistance during the walk if you are missing items that can not be left behind. Glasses are important, especially prescription glasses. I know I paid $1500 for mine (I’ve got a lot going on in my prescription) and would be distraught if I left them behind.
Start as early as you can and have breakfast along the way. Transferring a pack sometimes will help take in the surroundings even more especially later in the walk, and arrive fresher.Remember all the posts about blisters!!!. It was like every pilgrim had his or her own remedy. Well for new pilgrims. I started the Camino in Roncesvalles in 2007 age 63 and I got blisters and treated them with needle and thread and betadine and compeed. In fact I threaded my needles at home because the lighting in some crowded albergues was bad. After a few years I pondered 'why did I get blisters in Spain and not in Ireland?' 'Sweaty feet' was the answer so I decided prevention was better than cure and each morning on Camino, before putting on my socks I put antiperspirant on to my feet and I don't get blisters any more. If anyone could give me a tip to prevent exhaustion when walking in 28 degrees I would be very grateful.!
I guess I’m in your class. Just arranged my first Camino. I’m 78 and going from Sarria to SNtiago de Compostel. I’ve made it into a nine day trek because there is so much to see along the way and I want the time to go off trail and see all I can see. I’ve made arrangements at small B&Bs and hotels for en-suite private rooms because I sleep with a Cpap and I could see no alternativ. I’m 78 and heathy and walk several miles three or four times a week so I think I’ll be able to do 10 without too much difficulty. Any suggestions.I am the “Ensuitepilgrim “ - I have had the experience of basic albergues when nought else was available- and I resolved never to use them again; I am able to use private albergues or small hotels and when organising many Caminos for my friendship groups I find this is the only way it is feasible- I don’t use private companies.
I use Booking.com, mainly or e- mail for accommodation and the wonderful Correos for luggage transfer. Average age 72….and counting . No rustling bags,wakeful head torches, nor wondering where I can lay my head after a day’s sauntering. It keeps small villages alive,too. AND
- We’re not taking up bunk beds that needier Pelegrinos seek. Yes, in 20 years on various Caminos there have been changes, but all the “ nostalgia”…well? The Frances bears the brunt of all the moons and groans above. Plenty of alternatives. Buen Camino to you all..on foot,on bikes, on horseback or wheelchair.
Yes,more an addition than a replacement.I am on here only for at max 5 years but during that time I did not see a tremendous change. People still seem to have the same problems. Yes, sometimes I see questions where I think this is a different type of pilgrim than I am, but that is OK.
Also, on my last Camino in May I met mainly people who carried their own luggage, who suffered from blisters, from closed albergues and knee-pain, blisters, dehydration, too much rain and you name it.
Yes, I also had the feeling that between Melide and Santiago there were more people with nicely done hair, aftershave and fashionable clothes and tiny day-packs than 4 years ago, the majority was suffering as always
I would agree a new type of pilgrim (or whatever you like to call him) has arrived especially on the Francés, but this is more an addition, not a replacement I think.
Yes,simple really.Things change,well there's a surprise-not! I remember when snooker coverage was in black and whiteAs with any community or group of people, things change... some like it, some don't. But the change is alway there. Pilgrims walking into Compostela 100 years ago would not like that fact that pilgrims these days take an airplane to get home... a 100 years ago, people took a boat of walked home again.
Does this mean we have done something wrong ? If there is a victim ...If the culture of the camino has changed to its detriment then all must take the responsibility of it being a victim of it's own success.
Crikey,I haven't got a clue about what all those letters and numbers mean and I'm feeling more than a little bit inadequateYou need to get somewhere with a really healthy declination, like this spot in Aotearoa/New Zealand
You clicked here:
Latitude: 38° 19' 8.8" S
Longitude: 184° 1' 21.1" W
Magnetic Declination: +21° 13'
Declination is POSITIVE (EAST)
Inclination: 63° 49'
Magnetic field strength: 54067.7 nT
There are some islands that you probably cannot get too on your normal cruise liner to walk, like this:
You clicked here:
Latitude: 53° 8' 46.9" S
Longitude: 286° 29' 56.5" W
Magnetic Declination: -61° 55'
Declination is NEGATIVE (WEST)
Inclination: 70° 41'
Magnetic field strength: 51387.4 nT
Hmm, then it's probably a bit excessive to give you the full course in land navigation using a topographic map, compass and protractor that would make these things much clearer. Don't feel too bad. The forum test is being able to navigate from one side of Spain to the other using the maps in a Brierley guide. Superior marks go to those that did this before or without Brierley, and who don't rely on a mapping app in a smartphoneCrikey,I haven't got a clue about what all those letters and numbers mean and I'm feeling more than a little bit inadequate
Thanks for that @dougfitz! I'm now feeling comfortably smug. I walked my first two Caminos before Brierley's guide was first published. And my first Camino was in the last year before digital mobile phones and the World Wide Web reached the public. And I've never used the Blessed JB's guides on any of my Caminos. Do I get all three gold stars or just the one?
Thanks for that @dougfitz! I'm now feeling comfortably smug. I walked my first two Caminos before Brierley's guide was first published. And my first Camino in the last year before digital mobile phones and the World Wide Web reached the public. And I've never used the Blessed JB's guides on any of my Caminos. Do I get all three gold stars or just the one?
Well, I only get a basic pass on this! You would have thought that I might have devised a test where I at least got a star. But getting three - that's a real achievement.Thanks for that @dougfitz! I'm now feeling comfortably smug. I walked my first two Caminos before Brierley's guide was first published. And my first Camino in the last year before digital mobile phones and the World Wide Web reached the public. And I've never used the Blessed JB's guides on any of my Caminos. Do I get all three gold stars or just the one?
Don's recent thread about the flood of posts about lost glasses made me notice that there are many long time topics that seldom are posted now.
Whatever happened to the weekly. daily, or less threads and posts concerning pack weight and how to manage it?
Are most newer pilgrims much stronger than past ones? or....is the weight no longer a concern as many pilgrims are transporting their "luggage".
The conversations have greatly changed and many of the long time contributors are now missing in the forum. Much experience has been lost.
The OP is quoted above for convenience. I have puzzled about how the first sentence in the second paragraph of the OP might explain the last, but still don't understand. The last what - sentence in the OP? I don't get it.This is merely an observation.
Perhaps the first sentence in the second paragraph of the Original post goes some way towards answering and explaining the last.
That "cloud" of tags is still available. Go to the main Forums page here, scroll to the bottom to see "Camino tags". Click on any one of them to find posts on the topic.When I first joined this site, there was a brilliant side panel with key words such as boots, poles, bed bugs etc and clicking on them brought up the thread. Maybe it needs reinstating in some form to help newbies who don't know that the website can be searched?!!!!!
Don't be so dismissive of others! No number of really cheap glasses will give me the vision I need to see well at different distances. My regular glasses are carefully "designed" to meet my vision needs, not my fashion desires, and they are quite expensive. I do take a second pair (not quite the latest prescription, though) as a back up, but it would certainly be worth some effort to find my primary ones if I lost them.surely they buy two pairs of really cheap glasses and leave their designer ones at home?
Me too. For years now I have worn varifocals which allow me to see pin-sharp at almost all distances. An accident on my most recent Camino left me wearing my spare cheap single-vision lens glasses for a couple of hours while a very helpful optician in Najera repaired my main pair. A dreadful experience (but thankfully short) after all these years of excellent sight! I did order a new pair on my return to the UK and now my spare pair are good quality varifocals too.I do take a second pair (not quite the latest prescription, though) as a back up, but it would certainly be worth some effort to find my primary ones if I lost them.
Your words speak for me, too.Also, there are a few of us holdouts who don't maintain a social media presence. No FB, no Instagram, no SnapChat, no TikTok....not even LinkedIn.
I didn't know about or use this forum prior to my first Camino, but have been distressingly ever-present since then, and have used it extensively prior to my hoped for 2nd.
Hmm. This forum is a social media platform. See wikipedia definition.There are a few of us holdouts who don't maintain a social media presence.
I don't need wiki to tell me I am a member of this social media platform; I already knew this forum is one.Hmm. This forum is a social media platform. See wikipedia definition.
It is exactly like some of the Travel Websites and\or Magazines - Dont go to <insert name of a big tourist attraction city here> Instead discover this quaint little peaceful gem....Those places most fond to me are best kept secret not to draw too much attention to them.
Hang on, if in life there is no constant but only change then that would make change a constant
And there you have it.....
We are constantly changing or changing constantly.
Or should that be adapting?
As one Emperor would quip "Too Many Notes"I thought that it was death and taxes.
However...Wikipedia is not a particularly reliable source of information. Anyone can post an opinion as fact and anyone can then edit that opinion. Thus...Wikipedia is a source of opinions, but not necessarily based on reliable facts.Hmm. This forum is a social media platform. See wikipedia definition.
Absolutely! However, I was looking for a definition of what "social media" generally means, so perhaps Wikipedia is not a bad place to look. There are other online dictionaries that have similar definitions for "social media", and my main point was that the Camino Forum seems to fit within them all.Wikipedia is not a particularly reliable source of information.
I shouldn't have been so lazy and made others work too hard.The OP is quoted above for convenience. I have puzzled about how the first sentence in the second paragraph of the OP might explain the last, but still don't understand. The last what - sentence in the OP? I don't get it.
My view is that over 5, 10 or 15 years, many forum members move on - for various reasons, some sad but others happy. I don't expect to be very active here on the forum in 15 years. However, the experience of these members is not lost - it is documented here on the forum, and many new members have learned and expanded upon it. We are fortunate that some old-time members continue to read and contribute occasionally.
I’m on the Camino now and am also thinking about them. Horrible shoes, no hot showers, and no sunblock. They must have just worn long everything and a hat. No yellow arrows, either. On the other hand, in a lot of places, the route they took was much easier than what we do now. They would have traveled on the route that is now occupied by the major roads, not looping around all these mountains and looking down at the valley level where the road is!I thought a lot of how hardcore those pilgrims were. As hard as it was to walk to Santiago, they had to walk home.
and no planes to take them back home....Horrible shoes, no hot showers, and no sunblock. They must have just worn long everything and a hat. No yellow arrows, either. On the other hand, in a lot of places, the route they took was much easier than what we do now. They would have traveled on the route that is now occupied by the major roads, not looping around all these mountains and looking down at the valley level where the road is!
However...Wikipedia is not a particularly reliable source of information. Anyone can post an opinion as fact and anyone can then edit that opinion. Thus...Wikipedia is a source of opinions, but not necessarily based on reliable facts.
Absolutely!
Broke my specs on the way up to Santiago on the Português, then they were utterly wrecked at Potomarín.Me too. For years now I have worn varifocals which allow me to see pin-sharp at almost all distances. An accident on my most recent Camino left me wearing my spare cheap single-vision lens glasses for a couple of hours while a very helpful optician in Najera repaired my main pair. A dreadful experience (but thankfully short) after all these years of excellent sight! I did order a new pair on my return to the UK and now my spare pair are good quality varifocals too.
And how would we know what "ACW" means? I googled, but the only likely definition was on Wikipedia.As a serious scholar of ACW
Not sure what this means, because if you read the article, you will see the evidence. This is a secondary source, true, but with a lot of references and links to actual studies. My only point here is to push back against the frequent perception that using wikipedia is like getting your facts from instagram and twitter.Re above: Evidence suggests Wikipedia is Accurate and Reliable
...and the source is....?
Broke my specs on the way up to Santiago on the Português, then they were utterly wrecked at Potomarín.
SHRUG
Went 4 or 5 months without, hated it, but the Camino provided.
I did it "tongue-in-cheek" implying that the source is "the internet"Not sure what this means, because if you read the article, you will see the evidence.
You're right... i googled ACW ang got 19,700,000 results incl. A-COLD-WALL, American Cord and Webbing & Advanced Converting Works among many others. Only Wiki suggested that it may refer to American Civil WarAnd how would we know what "ACW" means? I googled, but the only likely definition was on Wikipedia.
Don't expect those from other countries to understand this. These seem to be in-jokes for those members from the US, and perhaps not even all of them.You're right... i googled ACW ang got 19,700,000 results incl. A-COLD-WALL, American Cord and Webbing & Advanced Converting Works among many others. Only Wiki suggested that it may refer to American Civil War
(But wouldn't Honest Abe be a giveaway or do we have to google "Honest Abe"?
Wikipedia is generally reliable on generalities and on many topics of trivial nature -- but it's useless on anything of a contentious nature, where it becomes politicised, or if what you need is more in-depth and specialist, where it becomes useless.Not sure what this means, because if you read the article, you will see the evidence. This is a secondary source, true, but with a lot of references and links to actual studies. My only point here is to push back against the frequent perception that using wikipedia is like getting your facts from instagram and twitter.
Wikipedia itself has a highly footnoted discussion of its reliability.
Wikipedia is generally reliable on generalities and on many topics of trivial nature -- but it's useless on anything of a contentious nature, where it becomes politicised, or if what you need is more in-depth and specialist, where it becomes useless.
But it's usually good at least as a crib.
Perhaps used in this meaning: https://www.thefreedictionary.com/cheat+sheetA crib?
Just looked up Camino de Santiago on Wikipedia for a laugh. First thing you see is that in Jan 2023 is that the factual accuracy of the map is disputed.Wikipedia is generally reliable on generalities and on many topics of trivial nature -- but it's useless on anything of a contentious nature, where it becomes politicised, or if what you need is more in-depth and specialist, where it becomes useless.
But it's usually good at least as a crib.
The map is disputed because of its depiction of Austria adjoining Italy to the east, and not Croatia and Slovenia, which are not depicted. This might be justified in much the same way as we accept any schematic map as being a general representation, not necessarily being scaled to be dimensionally accurate. Unless you are a Croatian or Slovenian, when it might be annoying not to have your country depicted.Just looked up Camino de Santiago on Wikipedia for a laugh. First thing you see is that in Jan 2023 is that the factual accuracy of the map is disputed.
I think most on here would dispute it too.
So much for wiki's reliability.
I completely agree with JabbaPapa's assessment.
I was not talking about the wiki dispute. I was talking about missing routes. And what are all those routes in the UK about - what is that route that goes from Bristol to London north of Oxford? I've not heard of a camino there.The map is disputed because of its depiction of Austria adjoining Italy to the east, and not Croatia and Slovenia, which are not depicted. This might be justified in much the same way as we accept any schematic map as being a general representation, not necessarily being scaled to be dimensionally accurate. Unless you are a Croatian or Slovenian, when it might be annoying not to have your country depicted.
I fail to see how this is a reason to doubt Wikipedia's reliability. This is a matter of accuracy of the content, and as we have seen here, there is considerable scope for differing views about this. Reading the article's Talk page reveals a similar level of debate about the content as we seem to have here from time to time. More importantly, the debate over what might or might not be included is held in public, as we do too, and is not the province of some elite editorial team who don't discuss their reasons for including or excluding the material that is, or may not be, published.
It is not only a US thing. I notice occasional in-jokes from members of other countries, as well. I think we all do it sometimes unknowingly, not thinking of the full spectrum of all who may be reading them and lack the understanding. I have googled words and phrases many times to figure what they mean.Don't expect those from other countries to understand this. These seem to be in-jokes for those members from the US, and perhaps not even all of them.
I agree, but that wasn't what I suggested in this case. And yes, we are probably all guilty of doing it from time to time. It is in the nature of the English language that there are national and regional differences in meaning that lead to misunderstanding, but might also be exploited for comic effect!It is not only a US thing.
An oxymoron, surely.wisdom may exist on social media
Aka ´hack´ or cheat or short cutA crib?
Except that those pilgrims would have to veer off those roads in order to avoid the toll collectors and areas with reports of highway robbers. They’d turn into the woods and hills to avoid those and instead face wolves and other dangers. They would have followed directions given by returnees or by locals (if they understood them - of course, go back far enough and Latin would have helped).I’m on the Camino now and am also thinking about them. Horrible shoes, no hot showers, and no sunblock. They must have just worn long everything and a hat. No yellow arrows, either. On the other hand, in a lot of places, the route they took was much easier than what we do now. They would have traveled on the route that is now occupied by the major roads, not looping around all these mountains and looking down at the valley level where the road is!
To reply to this and turn it back to the original question, the camino as we see it now may actually be closer to what it was in mediaeval times. Back in the day, there would have been a huge range of types of pilgrims from the most exalted and wealthy travelling in the luxury and comfort to which they had always been accustomed, to the humblest and poorest travelling with the dogged resistance that had kept them alive since birth, with not a few marginal types begging or worse, preying on their fellow pilgrims. As for how seriously they took their pilgrimage, again there would have been a wide range if Geoffrey Chaucer is anything to go by. At least the camino is a lot safer now with the Guardia Civil probably doing a much better job than the Knights Templar. The ease and safety have made the camino less of an adventure than it used to be, and the internet has meant information is easier to find and so are bookings and reservations. but you can still walk and stay in albergues and meet other pilgrims, that hasn´t changed, and at the risk of incurring the wrath of henrythedog, may I suggest other caminos? Spain is an endlessly fascinating country and you don´t get much idea of it by walking the Camino Francés. We can´t turn the clock back, as Marcel Proust pointed out at some length but there are endless new experiences to be had if we know where to look, and after 71 years I´m still trying to figure that out. Buen camino.Except that those pilgrims would have to veer off those roads in order to avoid the toll collectors and areas with reports of highway robbers. They’d turn into the woods and hills to avoid those and instead face wolves and other dangers. They would have followed directions given by returnees or by locals (if they understood them - of course, go back far enough and Latin would have helped).
They may have been far more ‘comfortable’ with sleeping on the ground than we are today.
Yeah, actually it means that in the rest of the anglophone world. ´Crib´ as a form of cheating is pretty well English schoolboy slang, pretty old fashioned and I doubt if my sons would know what it meant. Stands back and waits for deluge of contradictions from fellow forum members.Baby crib.
Oh yes, another crib; slang for our home, dwelling, apartment or flat.nor would I have invited many pilgrims back to my crib
An oxymoron, surely.
Aka ´hack´ or cheat or short cut
Are there even more definitions? "And the beat goes on."Speaking of which, are crib notes still available for college kids to purchase?
I've not even glanced at it, but I greatly doubt that if I looked at their Camino article, I might be motivated to do anything other than rip it to shreds.I fail to see how this is a reason to doubt Wikipedia's reliability.
Yep.To reply to this and turn it back to the original question, the camino as we see it now may actually be closer to what it was in mediaeval times. Back in the day, there would have been a huge range of types of pilgrims from the most exalted and wealthy travelling in the luxury and comfort to which they had always been accustomed, to the humblest and poorest travelling with the dogged resistance that had kept them alive since birth, with not a few marginal types begging or worse, preying on their fellow pilgrims. As for how seriously they took their pilgrimage, again there would have been a wide range if Geoffrey Chaucer is anything to go by. At least the camino is a lot safer now with the Guardia Civil probably doing a much better job than the Knights Templar. The ease and safety have made the camino less of an adventure than it used to be, and the internet has meant information is easier to find and so are bookings and reservations. but you can still walk and stay in albergues and meet other pilgrims, that hasn´t changed, and at the risk of incurring the wrath of henrythedog, may I suggest other caminos? Spain is an endlessly fascinating country and you don´t get much idea of it by walking the Camino Francés. We can´t turn the clock back, as Marcel Proust pointed out at some length but there are endless new experiences to be had if we know where to look, and after 71 years I´m still trying to figure that out. Buen camino.
Really. It would appear from this that you will never know how good or bad it might be. It seems you are prepared to be guided by your prejudices, rather than actually discovering whether the contributions of others, who might be just as erudite about the Camino as the members of this forum, have created a contribution that is worth reading.I've not even glanced at it, but I greatly doubt that if I looked at their Camino article, I might be motivated to do anything other than rip it to shreds.
Specialist discussion of the Camino in here is FAR more pertinent than whatever superficial nonsense might have been typed about it in that place.
I doubt that exciting me towards an actual critique might produce what you imagine.Really. It would appear from this that you will never know how good or bad it might be. It seems you are prepared to be guided by your prejudices, rather than actually discovering whether the contributions of others, who might be just as erudite about the Camino as the members of this forum, have created a contribution that is worth reading.
But bad edits can be quickly corrected. I remember a fact check comparison between Wikipedia and the Encyclopedia Britannica (back when the latter was still a thing). Wikipedia fared well. One of the factors was that errors (they both had them, no matter how many editors EB had, or how qualified the article authors were, errors still crept in) were fixed more quickly, whereas in EB, as a fixed print product, they tended to stick around.However...Wikipedia is not a particularly reliable source of information. Anyone can post an opinion as fact and anyone can then edit that opinion. Thus...Wikipedia is a source of opinions, but not necessarily based on reliable facts.
"...Criticisms of Wikipedia include assertions that its openness makes it unreliable and unauthorative. Because articles don't include bylines, authors aren't publicly accountable for what they write. Similarly, because anyone can edit any article, the site's entries are vulnerable to unscrupulous edits. "
The original source was an article published in Nature, a peer-reviewed journal in 2005. I don't have the exact citation but it shouldn't be too hard to find.Re above: Evidence suggests Wikipedia is Accurate and Reliable
...and the source is....?
As a serious scholar of ACW I have to go with
"Don’t believe everything you read on the internet"
Abraham Lincoln
Wait - are you saying "we all are just rambling on with nowhere to go?"Kind of refreshing to have a rambling thread that really goes no where and offends no one.
We need a destination for it to be a pilgrimage.Wait - are you saying "we all are just rambling on with nowhere to go?"
That's ....FFENSIVE!!!!
I was just thinking exactly the same! One of the things I've always loved about this forum is the way discussions can meander back and forth from the original topic, mostly without getting too heated. Some fascinating information can be shared, and the world expands just a little. It's lovely to see that some things don't change!Kind of refreshing to have a rambling thread that really goes no where and offends no one.
That's what my mama used to say, but OTOH, she did have a very sheltered life on the farm, and didn't experience much otside that prior to marriage and then raising five kids. She didn't know how to ride a bike or drive a car.what you dont know you dont miss
No, we just need to be looking for it...We need a destination for it to be a pilgrimage.
through the rosey-colored (preferably lost) glasses!No, we just need to be looking for it...
I think you will find that Bristol was a place to get a boat. But anyway, all pilgrims started from home so there are as many camino routes as there were pilgrims.I was not talking about the wiki dispute. I was talking about missing routes. And what are all those routes in the UK about - what is that route that goes from Bristol to London north of Oxford? I've not heard of a camino there.
Provided Ivar can find someone willing to take over. I have a large site full of genealogy and family history (all relatives, not general). Not one of my relatives has responded to any of my several queries for someone to take it over. Not even the ones that have genealogy as a hobby.For me, it is not a problem, because the forum will outlast me, …
I think we are also constantly charging! 1And there you have it.....
We are constantly changing or changing constantly.
Or should that be adapting?
Pilgrimage routes are or were not necessarily routes to Santiago. There are traditional pilgrimage sites all over Europe (and the rest of the world for that matter). In England, pilgrimages to Canterbury, Walsingham, Glastonbury and Reading were particularly popular. These are in addition to routes used to get to embarkation points for Rome, Santiago and the Holy Land.I was not talking about the wiki dispute. I was talking about missing routes. And what are all those routes in the UK about - what is that route that goes from Bristol to London north of Oxford? I've not heard of a camino there.
Apologies if this has appeared elsewhere.I was not talking about the wiki dispute. I was talking about missing routes. And what are all those routes in the UK about - what is that route that goes from Bristol to London north of Oxford? I've not heard of a camino there.
I was just thinking exactly the same thing. BZ!
If you look at the map that you link to, you do not find a route that goes from Bristol, then heads north of Oxford and then on to London. That is the route shown on the map of Caminos on the wiki page that I am querying. I'd never heard of it, and the pilgrimage page seems to confirm my impression.
I understood your question and thought: "Well spotted". I had never noticed it in this map that is so ubiquitous online. Like you, I wondered about it and had a look around. I think I found an explanation: It has to do with the way the Ways to Saint James have been represented in maps since about 1960 when interest started to grow in the medieval pilgrimage to Santiago.If you look at the map that you link to, you do not find a route that goes from Bristol, then heads north of Oxford and then on to London. That is the route shown on the map of Caminos on the wiki page that I am querying. I'd never heard of it, and the pilgrimage page seems to confirm my impression.
Btw, this discussion misses my original reason for posting, which was in response to Doug and wikipedia's reliability.
And this confirms what you thought and I hoped it might prove helpful.If you look at the map that you link to, you do not find a route that goes from Bristol, then heads north of Oxford and then on to London. That is the route shown on the map of Caminos on the wiki page that I am querying. I'd never heard of it, and the pilgrimage page seems to confirm my impression.
Btw, this discussion misses my original reason for posting, which was in response to Doug and wikipedia's reliability.
One of my long-ago ancestors died on his Camino. From what I was told, his body was carried by his companions the rest of the way, and buried in Santiago de Compostela.My heart goes out to those who never made it home. It reminds me that the scallop shell was the sign of the RETURNING pilgrim and NOT something to be picked up any time , anywhere.
Vaya con Dios
Samarkand.
Hi Artic-AlexI am on here only for at max 5 years but during that time I did not see a tremendous change. People still seem to have the same problems. Yes, sometimes I see questions where I think this is a different type of pilgrim than I am, but that is OK.
Also, on my last Camino in May I met mainly people who carried their own luggage, who suffered from blisters, from closed albergues and knee-pain, blisters, dehydration, too much rain and you name it.
Yes, I also had the feeling that between Melide and Santiago there were more people with nicely done hair, aftershave and fashionable clothes and tiny day-packs than 4 years ago, the majority was suffering as always
I would agree a new type of pilgrim (or whatever you like to call him) has arrived especially on the Francés, but this is more an addition, not a replacement I think.
Exactly, there is so much more than the FrancésHi Artic-Alex
I couldn't agree more. I had the same conversation with 2 pilgrims from Austria (not related) I walked with for many days.
They are like a new fashion accessory whilst I was covered in bruises, cuts and beard hadn't seen a trim in over 5 weeks so I looked pretty wild ha ha I also noticed they walked in packs and more or less took over anywhere they stopped and god forbid if you ended up in the same Albergue as them.
This was my 5th and last Camino walking the Frances route, I have felt the changes during the past 8 years some good some not so good, but what has changed more is myself. I lost the excitement I first had back in 2015 setting off for the first time, which lived with me until this year and I knew I wouldn't be walking the Camino Frances again.
Next year I am getting married so it's not possible but god willing I am still healthy enough I'm planning on walking the Camino Via de La PLata in 2025, now I'm excited again. Buen Camino Keith
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