Summer nights on CF and sleeping bags

camster · Mar 2, 2016

Yes. I'm starting another thread on this subject. I apologize
I do not know yet when I will be able to leave and do the Camino Francés, but I would like to do it in July/August. I have a sleeping bag (7C/45F) and a liner, but using only a liner irks me a little bit, since it is very thin and I have heard that what you sleep on isn't always the cleanest.
I would feel a bit more at ease in a sleeping bag, but I don't want to be too warm.
I'm the kind of person who's always cold anyway, a breeze chills me.
My question is, how low do the temperatures actually go in July and August during the night and have some of you brought sleeping bags during these two months on the Camino Francés?
Thanks!

Mark Lee · Mar 2, 2016

I've done the CF during the months of July and August, and if a liner is just too thin for you, sure a sleeping bag is a good alternative, but personally for me it would be the lightest weight summer bag I could find at a reasonable cost.
I've posted this website on here before. It's a weather website and you can check past year's highs and lows throughout Spain. www.wunderground.com
cheers

camster · Mar 2, 2016

Mark Lee said:
I've done the CF during the months of July and August, and if a liner is just too thin for you, sure a sleeping bag is a good alternative, but personally for me it would be the lightest weight summer bag I could find at a reasonable cost.
I've posted this website on here before. It's a weather website and you can check past year's highs and lows throughout Spain. www.wunderground.com
cheers

Oh, good site! Thanks for your impression regarding the sleeping bag, too.

alipilgrim · Mar 2, 2016

If your sleeping bag has a full, wrap-around the feet zipper, you could take that and use it unzipped over your liner like a blanket. It'd still give you the option to use it mummy-style when it's colder.

trecile · Mar 2, 2016

I'm just starting to research what to take for a September Camino, but I think that this down blanket would be good to use over a liner. It's 146 x 100 cm, only 197 grams.
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?cat_id=1206&p_id=1124593

trafferty · Mar 2, 2016

I have a bag the only has the insulation on one side and rated for 50 degrees. I figure I can flop it over when it gets too warm in june/july. It's called "big agnes" and weighs under 2 pounds. I got it at Moosejaw.

camster · Mar 2, 2016

alipilgrim said:
If your sleeping bag has a full, wrap-around the feet zipper, you could take that and use it unzipped over your liner like a blanket. It'd still give you the option to use it mummy-style when it's colder.

That's pretty much what I was thinking about doing. I wanted to use the liner under the sleeping bag to protect against bed bugs.

camster · Mar 2, 2016

trecile said:
I'm just starting to research what to take for a September Camino, but I think that this down blanket would be good to use over a liner. It's 146 x 100 cm, only 197 grams.
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?cat_id=1206&p_id=1124593

Yeah, it looks alright, not too warm. I still think the liner is too thin for my taste to have between me and the mattresses Unless beds aren't as bad as some pilgrims have suggested.

camster · Mar 2, 2016

trafferty said:
I have a bag the only has the insulation on one side and rated for 50 degrees. I figure I can flop it over when it gets too warm in june/july. It's called "big agnes" and weighs under 2 pounds. I got it at Moosejaw.

A two sided bag is a good idea too. So I take it people bring a sleeping bad even during the summer months. I thought I'd be the only pilgrim to carry one!

domigee · Mar 2, 2016

camster said:
Yes. I'm starting another thread on this subject. I apologize
I do not know yet when I will be able to leave and do the Camino Francés, but I would like to do it in July/August. I have a sleeping bag (7C/45F) and a liner, but using only a liner irks me a little bit, since it is very thin and I have heard that what you sleep on isn't always the cleanest.
I would feel a bit more at ease in a sleeping bag, but I don't want to be too warm.
I'm the kind of person who's always cold anyway, a breeze chills me.
My question is, how low do the temperatures actually go in July and August during the night and have some of you brought sleeping bags during these two months on the Camino Francés?
Thanks!

I think what you have is fine, take both... I would say that because that's what I did .
If it's very hot at night, just sleep in the liner on top of the sleeping bag...
I found it was often unpleasantly hot at night in albergues but then there was a heatwave in 2012....
I was glad to have the sleeping bag on some nights though, especially around Rabanal and walking to Fisterra where I really would have been cold without it. (But that's just me!). Others manage just fine with a liner, I always take both.
Btw, the liner is no protection against bed bugs...
Buen camino

normandog · Mar 2, 2016

camster said:
Yeah, it looks alright, not too warm. I still think the liner is too thin for my taste to have between me and the mattresses Unless beds aren't as bad as some pilgrims have suggested.

If you are worried about the beds not being as clean as at home, my trick was to use my rain poncho as a mattress liner. I just wrapped it over top, then spread out my liner. It was not protection for bedbugs, just a clean layer for my body to be on. The only downside was if i got a top bunk, and i rolled voraciously, it was a bit slippery. I never did fall out, but imagined every night that i was a mere rollover away from ending up as a bedpartner for my downstairs neighbour!

mspath · Mar 2, 2016

Always make sure your poncho is dry before using it on the bed! Furthermore in winter if there are no albergue blankets put your poncho beneath the bag to help block the cold air from rising.

Mark Lee · Mar 2, 2016

camster said:
Yeah, it looks alright, not too warm. I still think the liner is too thin for my taste to have between me and the mattresses Unless beds aren't as bad as some pilgrims have suggested.

I only stayed in albergues that had mattresses that were the type enclosed in plastic/rubber, and most of the albergues seemed to have that type. No way would I sleep on a conventional type, fabric covered mattress. It's nasty and funky and definitely an invitation for bedbugs.
Pick your albergues wisely and no problems.

Jo Jo · Mar 2, 2016

I have a great, 1lb, 45 degree, down sleeping bag. I am so glad I did not bring it on the Frances. A liner (treated with permethrin--for bed bugs) was more than enough, and by July 2014 almost all of the mattresses are the vinyl coated type (again, for bed bugs), so they were clean enough. Actually, I usually slept on top of my liner, not in it. Sleeping pilgrims stacked on bunk beds generate an incredible amount of body heat. And in the places it got cold, the alburgues had blankets (again clean enough, even for my doctor-wife who is very conscious of sanitation). Only place that was not true was Roncevalles. Were I to do it again, I'd take a light fleece blanket to Roncevalles, use it that night, and then just put it in the donation box the next morning before I left. YMMV.

Buen Camino,
Jo Jo

Mark Lee · Mar 2, 2016

Jo Jo said:
I have a great, 1lb, 45 degree, down sleeping bag. I am so glad I did not bring it on the Frances. A liner (treated with permethrin--for bed bugs) was more than enough, and by July 2014 almost all of the mattresses are the vinyl coated type (again, for bed bugs), so they were clean enough. Actually, I usually slept on top of my liner, not in it. Sleeping pilgrims stacked on bunk beds generate an incredible amount of body heat. And in the places it got cold, the alburgues had blankets (again clean enough, even for my doctor-wife who is very conscious of sanitation). Only place that was not true was Roncevalles. Were I to do it again, I'd take a light fleece blanket to Roncevalles, use it that night, and then just put it in the donation box the next morning before I left. YMMV.

Buen Camino,
Jo Jo

Yeah, did that too. I carried an inexpensive (about 3-5 euros), fleece blanket with me and used it a few times, and left it on an albergue donativo table.

trecile · Mar 2, 2016

I also found this super light (584 gm) rectangular bag on Amazon for $85. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00XCSUPMA/?tag=casaivar02-20

The same company also has a 440 gm mummy bag for $71.90
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00XE2SKG2/?tag=casaivar02-20

camster · Mar 2, 2016

Now, I thought the liner protected against bed bugs. The material apparently is woven too tightly and the bugs don't like it or something? That's what I've heard/read. This is not true??

trecile · Mar 2, 2016

camster said:
Now, I thought the liner protected against bed bugs. The material apparently is woven too tightly and the bugs don't like it or something? That's what I've heard/read. This is not true??

I believe that bed bugs don't like silk.

Mark Lee · Mar 2, 2016

camster said:
Now, I thought the liner protected against bed bugs. The material apparently is woven too tightly and the bugs don't like it or something? That's what I've heard/read. This is not true??

I have never encountered them, but I imagine that if there is one crawling up onto your poor, unsuspecting, sleeping body, blissfully deep in REM sleep, it would crawl around and find an opening, say at the top of the sleeping bag or liner, and make contact with you via that portal. They pick up your location by your body heat and the carbon dioxide you emit.
I suppose if you were totally encased in some sort of bag, with no openings, you would never get bitten. They are not so small enough that they can crawl through the pores of fabric.
Honestly, don't sweat them. I never have.

naplesdon · Mar 2, 2016

trecile said:
I believe that bed bugs don't like silk.

That is probably an urban myth. I've been bitten using a silk liner. I think they like blood.

domigee · Mar 2, 2016

biarritzdon said:
That is probably an urban myth. I've been bitten using a silk liner.

Me too, on my second camino. Because I reacted quite badly to the bites (not everyone does so don't worry unduly) I now carry an 'anti bedbug sheet'.
I can't say whether it works or not because I am now much more aware and thoroughly check the room and mattress before staying. If I find any evidence of bugs, I walk on.
It just psychologically works for me, I feel safer but it adds 100gr to my pack. I really do think that 'we carry our own fears'

camster · Mar 2, 2016

biarritzdon said:
That is probably an urban myth. I've been bitten using a silk liner. I think they like blood.

lol! man, I was hoping to be reassured! So you had to clean everything you had, etc?

camster · Mar 2, 2016

domigee said:
Me too, on my second camino. Because I reacted quite badly to the bites (not everyone does so don't worry unduly) I now carry an 'anti bedbug sheet'.
I can't say whether it works or not because I am now much more aware and thoroughly check the room and mattress before staying. If I find any evidence of bugs, I walk on.
It just psychologically works for me, I feel safer and it adds 100gr to my pack. I really do think that 'we carry our own fears'

Ok, what's this 'anti bed bug sheet'.... And how do you check for 'traces'. I read someone sprays mosquito spray on the mattress, but are there other signs besides seeing them?

naplesdon · Mar 2, 2016

I saw the comment about mosquito spray the the other day and I had never heard that before; DEET and Permithrin are totally different chemicals as far as I know. I was never bitten by bedbugs during the first 4 Camino I did.
Last year I think I ran into them 2 times but they don't affect me enough to freak out about the bites or cause me to suspect I was transporting them with me, probably my bad for not being more proactive to protect my fellow pilgrims. Then these bites last year could easily have been mosquito bites.
The anti bed bug sheet is something handed out at many albergues, you should inspect your mattress for signs of infestations. Bed bugs seem to thrive in environments where there is lots of wood and shade.
I stayed at Granon two years ago and was not bitten, but later met several people who spent the same night there and said they were. This is not meant to be a knock on Granon because these folks could have easily picked them up several nights before.
There are some very good threads on this forum about bed bugs.

Leigh J Christensen · Mar 3, 2016

camster said:
That's pretty much what I was thinking about doing. I wanted to use the liner under the sleeping bag to protect against bed bugs.

A liner will not protect against bed bugs. Your liner as well as your sleeping bag (if there is a serious infestation) will become infested as well. You can see bedbugs as well as signs of bed bugs. I worried about the same thing because I had read about it but after more research have concluded the risk is "very" low. You can get bed bugs from your airplane seat or at the airport from setting a bag down in the wrong place at the wrong time. But again, the risk is "very" low, so low that it is not worth worrying about. I think I'd worry more about a chain hotel in a large city than the Albergues. Always carry a small flashlight or headlamp and inspect where you're going to put your gear or sleep. That is your best defense and I "always" do this in any hotel.

koilife · Mar 3, 2016

Leigh J Christensen said:
. . . after more research have concluded the risk is "very" low. You can get bed bugs from your airplane seat or at the airport from setting a bag down in the wrong place at the wrong time. But again, the risk is "very" low, so low that it is not worth worrying about.

I'd like to respectfully disagree. The likelihood of encounter on Camino is clearly greater than that of an airplane seat or chain hotel.

It's nothing to fear, but it's real, and it's really inconvenient when it happens. Prudence, inspection, and due care are still the best prevention.

GreatDane · Mar 3, 2016

My son and DIL got bedbugs in June on an international flight flying in First Class (they got a free upgrade to first class I think because they are cute). Spent their first day in Barcelona getting rid of them.

camster · Mar 3, 2016

I'm still wondering what the myth is behind the liner, then. Because if it's not of any value to prevent bedbugs, I won't bring it. I thought it would help prevent them from trying to get to my bag.
I'm also wondering how low the temps can go at night during the summer months on the Francés.

koilife · Mar 3, 2016

GreatDane said:
My son and DIL got bedbugs in June on an international flight flying in First Class (they got a free upgrade to first class I think because they are cute). Spent their first day in Barcelona getting rid of them.

Not saying it doesn't happen, but the question is one of likelihood. I have flown almost 50% of the time on business for many years now, and am constantly in different hotels, airlines, cities, etc. (in fairness, all in the US and Canada), and I have never seen it firsthand. I know it does happen, but it is rare by comparison. Set that against the number of firsthand accounts of this occurring on the Camino, the active measures and training hospitaleros receive to deal with it, and it should be immediately evident that the likelihood is much higher on the Camino itself.

On my first Camino, in conversation with the hosts of a pension about albergues to not to miss (they were former pilgrims and deeply embedded in the extended CF community), they mentioned a number of them, and then specifically noted two that they said not to miss in the future, but to skip right now because they were dealing with outbreaks. We talked some about it, and they simply stated that it's a fact of life that occurs with sufficient regularity that prudent vigilance and appropriate precautions are called for.

For my part, I will be paying more attention to my albergue bed than the plane seat that gets me there. But I won't hesitate to go back again and again.

domigee · Mar 3, 2016

camster said:
I'm also wondering how low the temps can go at night during the summer months on the Francés.

In July/August 2012 there was a heatwave and it was around 35 deg during the day, probably down to high twenties at night. Very uncomfortable to sleep, anyway.
Leaving Rabanal early morning though, it turned COLD and the wind made it worse on one side of the mountain. We had coffee in an albergue mid-morning and the thermometre outside said 4 deg. So it must have been colder when we set off.
That's the coldest temperatures I've had in Summer on the Camino francés (but I've only walked it twice).
From Santiago to Finisterre, I was also cold in the evenings, again because of the wind. But I have no idea of the exact temperatures...
2013 was both less cold and less hot, if that makes sense

camster · Mar 3, 2016

domigee said:
In July/August 2012 there was a heatwave and it was around 35 deg during the day. Leaving Rabanal early morning though, it turned COLD and the wind made it worse on one side of the mountain. We had coffee in an albergue mid-morning and the thermometre outside said 4 deg. So it must have been colder when we set off.
That's the coldest temperatures I've had in Summer on the Camino francés (but I've only walked it twice).
In Galicia after Santiago I was also cold in the evenings, again because of the wind. But I have no idea of the exact temperatures...

Wow, that's colder than I expected! I'll make sure to bring my sleeping bag, then. And have warmer layers for sure, for the early morning walks!
How about the wind, are there windier spots on the camino?

domigee · Mar 3, 2016

camster said:
I'm still wondering what the myth is behind the liner, then. Because if it's not of any value to prevent bedbugs, I won't bring it. I thought it would help prevent them from trying to get to my bag..

Temperature-wise, you're more often likely to only need a liner to sleep in than a bag....

camster · Mar 3, 2016

domigee said:
Temperature-wise, you're more often likely to only need a liner to sleep in than a bag....

hmm. I'm torn, because it's so thin (it will feel to me like I'm sleeping directly on the matresses). I'll have to hink about it before I go.

domigee · Mar 3, 2016

camster said:
Wow, that's colder than I expected! I'll make sure to bring my sleeping bag, then. And have warmer layers for sure, for the early morning walks!
How about the wind, are there windier spots on the camino?

I was just about fine walking with my summer layers on and I wore socks on my hands at some stage.... but I was glad to get on the other side of the mountain (no wind) as I realised I wasn't really equipped for such low temperatures...
What I do now is always bring some sort of head covering for warmth, even in Summer. A buff does the trick.

domigee · Mar 3, 2016

camster said:
hmm. I'm torn, because it's so thin (it will feel to me like I'm sleeping directly on the matresses). I'll have to hink about it before I go.

Are you bringing a sarong? You could always cover the mattress with it.
Decision, decisions

camster · Mar 3, 2016

domigee said:
Are you bringing a sarong? You could always cover the mattress with it.
Decision, decisions

lol indeed! something else to think about!

trafferty · Mar 5, 2016

camster said:
A two sided bag is a good idea too. So I take it people bring a sleeping bad even during the summer months. I thought I'd be the only pilgrim to carry one!

I know from camping I get cold easily and if I am cold I won't sleep or I will sleep with my shoulders all tense and won't get the rest I need for all that walking.

serg_zone · Mar 5, 2016

I've done the entire Camino without a sleeping bag in july-august. Obviously I do not recommend this. However I'd say what you have is fine. All albergues provide fleece or wool sheets you can just throw on top of your sleeping bad if it gets too cold. Also, I do not remember staying at any albergues which were dirty.

Mark Lee · Mar 5, 2016

serg_zone said:
I've done the entire Camino without a sleeping bag in july-august. Obviously I do not recommend this. However I'd say what you have is fine. All albergues provide fleece or wool sheets you can just throw on top of your sleeping bad if it gets too cold. Also, I do not remember staying at any albergues which were dirty.

I wouldn't say they all do. A lot of them do, but not all.

camster · Mar 6, 2016

serg_zone said:
I've done the entire Camino without a sleeping bag in july-august. Obviously I do not recommend this. However I'd say what you have is fine. All albergues provide fleece or wool sheets you can just throw on top of your sleeping bad if it gets too cold. Also, I do not remember staying at any albergues which were dirty.

Great, thanks for sharing your experience. I've pretty much decided that I'm going to take both items with me and have them if need be.

Mark Lee · Mar 6, 2016

camster said:
Great, thanks for sharing your experience. I've pretty much decided that I'm going to take both items with me and have them if need be.

Believe me, if you do your Camino in July and August, you definitely won't need both a sleeping bag and liner.

camster · Mar 6, 2016

Mark Lee said:
Believe me, if you do your Camino in July and August, you definitely won't need both a sleeping bag and liner.

lol stop confusing me! *sigh* I'll keep your comment in mind.

Mark Lee · Mar 6, 2016

camster said:
lol stop confusing me! *sigh* I'll keep your comment in mind.

ha ha....
Just trying to prevent the abandonment of another poor piece of equipment in northern Spain. It just ain't that cold in Spain that time of year. Really. Check that link I sent you on temps from last July-August.
If the bag is light and packable, just bring that.

trecile · Mar 23, 2016

http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?cat_id=1206&p_id=1124593

Mark Lee said:
Believe me, if you do your Camino in July and August, you definitely won't need both a sleeping bag and liner.

I'm going to be walking the Camino Frances the last 10 days of August through September. Do you think that a liner plus this small lightweight down throw blanket will be enough?
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?cat_id=1206&p_id=1124593?

Mark Lee · Mar 23, 2016

trecile said:
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?cat_id=1206&p_id=1124593
I'm going to be walking the Camino Frances the last 10 days of August through September. Do you think that a liner plus this small lightweight down throw blanket will be enough?
http://www.montbell.us/products/disp.php?cat_id=1206&p_id=1124593?

Oh yeah, that looks like plenty enough.
Last August-September I found it pretty warm at night the first half of the CF, but the second half there were some chilly nights after O'Cebreiro.
Remember too, you will encounter a lot of albergues with blankets available.
cheers

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