Pilgrim death.

[Bernard duffy]

Spanish news are reporting the death of a 67 year old pilgrim hit by car near Arca,is this story correct ?

 

[ivar]

I did hear something on the radio this morning about this. I think it was a traffic accident. Pilgrim walking and a car hit him/her.

 

[jirit]

I wonder if it was at the same location two years ago, where the two gernan pilgrims were hit by a truck ?

 

[Bernard duffy]

Very sad news indeed.

 

[dougfitz]

My thoughts are with her friends and family in their grief.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Sad if true.

 

[Angelo]

Must be true. Sad story.

 

[JudyInTexas]

The article cited the Pilgrim not wearing a reflective jacket as a possible contributing factor. I've read many accounts of people walking on the shoulder of motorways very close to vehicles. I've never heard of anyone packing anything reflective to wear on these sections.

My thoughts are with her family and walking friends.

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

Very sad news and my toughts are with the family and friends , Peter .

 

[jirit]

A very sad day for the family and friends of this woman.

More on the same story

http://www.lavozdegalicia.es/notici...eabre-debate-seguridad/0003_201506S9C7995.htm

 

[Anniesantiago]

Very sad news. My thoughts are with the family

 

[Saramago]

I had read that as well. Very sad indeed. Also, my thoughts are with the 68 year old woman from Spain hit and killed by a double decker bus near me (NYC). That article is in the Wall Street Journal, May 20, 2015. We have many visitors from Spain. Very sad news all around.

 

[Harington]

The article cited the Pilgrim not wearing a reflective jacket as a possible contributing factor. I've read many accounts of people walking on the shoulder of motorways very close to vehicles. I've never heard of anyone packing anything reflective to wear on these sections.

My thoughts are with her family and walking friends.

Yep. I always take a hi-viz gilet, and a hi-viz strap for my rucksack. If you're not on pilgrimage in summer then mornings are pretty dark for early starts. It's common sense. I always pity the poor driver of a truck or car traumatised by hitting someone not adequately kitted.

 

[C clearly]

That is a sad event, and my sympathy goes to all concerned.

It is a reminder to us that traffic is the biggest hazard that most of us face - whether we are at home or on the Camino. I remember several threads on the need for high visibility wear, but it was probably last year as more people on the forum were planning their later fall walks, when the days are shorter. For example, this one: https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...-winter-or-high-vis-strips.22843/#post-223191

I find that I need to constantly remind myself to take special care as a pedestrian along roads.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

My thoughts are with the family. I plan to take my reflective vest, and this pilgrim's death has helped to teach me.

 

[dougfitz]

The article cited the Pilgrim not wearing a reflective jacket as a possible contributing factor. I've read many accounts of people walking on the shoulder of motorways very close to vehicles. I've never heard of anyone packing anything reflective to wear on these sections.

This has been raised on the forum before, particularly in reference to walking along roads when that is necessary. Perhaps someone with a good understanding of the local laws and regulations might enlighten us when there is a legal requirement to wear high visibility clothing, rather than it being good practice.

 

[mikevasey]

My thoughts to her family,friends and walking companions.

Vehicles fly through that whole stretch, there is a couple of places where you have options to stay on one side of the road or cross over( or go under) but you are not really certain which way the Camino will continue on to until after you have made your choice, I think it is the place before Santa Irene where you go under a bridge only to be taken to an albergue then have to cross back over the road, its at points like that they should make it clearer, but its nit picking at a time like this.

 

[jirit]

The reports indicate the accident occurred about ½ kilometre outside o pedrouzo.

There is a dangerous crossing of the highway N-547 at this same location where visibility is limited especially on wet and dark days. Pilgrims leave a small paved country road way and must cross the N-547 in order to continue along a forest path before reaching o pedrouzo.

Some I am sure choose to walk along the highway shoulder as a short cut to the town.

 

[NualaOC]

Such a sad story - my thoughts are with this lady's family and friends.

We walked along that road today. There are some dangerous road crossings and pilgrims really need to pay attention. This is especially the case for those of us used to driving on the 'other' side of the road. I often mistakenly look right, instead of left when I start to cross the road.

 

[when night falls]

Sad story indeed.
It should go without saying that wearing anything reflective is both good practice and common sense.
I live in the land of the midnight sun, but almost everyone in Sweden wears reflective bands of some kind both on clothes and on bags, even though the summer nights are rather bright here, with a blueish tone of light.
Excepted from common sense are of course the super cool teenagers.

 

[LesBrass]

View attachment 19152 The reports indicate the accident occurred about ½ kilometre outside o pedrouzo.

There is a dangerous crossing of the highway N-547 at this same location where visibility is limited especially on wet and dark days. Pilgrims leave a small paved country road way and must cross the N-547 in order to continue along a forest path before reaching o pedrouzo.

Some I am sure choose to walk along the highway shoulder as a short cut to the town.

We missed the arrows, we thought we had and we stopped and retraced our steps but still missed the path. We had to walk along the shoulder but felt it was wrong and dangerous... it wasn't until we were part way along that we saw pilgrims walking along the quieter track but we were close to the end of the section to turn back. Even without our error there were still a couple of dangerous crossings.

Very sad indeed for all concerned if this has cost this poor lady her life... also sad for those who walked with her, her family and also the driver... indeed everyone

 

[MTtoCamino]

Sad day.

Let's just keep trying to warn people of the road hazards. I was almost hit as well, my fault I had stopped along a very deserted secondary road. Sat just of the road on a bench for pilgrims it was surrounded by trees & brush. Stood up turned my back put on my pack took one step onto the road & car flew by within .25 meter. They could not see me until I took 1 step.
Stay aware at all times if you are near any road.

 

[Former member 22438]

The article cited the Pilgrim not wearing a reflective jacket as a possible contributing factor. I've read many accounts of people walking on the shoulder of motorways very close to vehicles. I've never heard of anyone packing anything reflective to wear on these sections.

My thoughts are with her family and walking friends.

Standard equipment during our 2 Portugese caminhos with a lot of walking on the hardshoulder of busy roads in 2013 and 2015 and the camino Ingles in 2014

I allways advise pilgrims to take safety vests with them here on the forum. Even yesterday in one of my posts. !

Sorry for the victim of the accident. She may rest in peace.

 

[William Garza]

Prayers for all those involved.

 

[natefaith]

Very sad to hear

 

[grayland]

There have been several threads in the past year or so advising that reflective vests are required by law now at dusk and dawn.
I recall tha Reb posted the actual requirements.

As a practical matter...I always take a lightweight reflective gear for road walking..not just a dusk and dawn.
Just makes sense.

 

[Anniesantiago]

Road-walking can be dangerous even with a vest on!
One year I was (literally) blown over by a semi truck passing me on the road.
I was walking facing the traffic, and never in a million years expected the wind to catch my pack and poncho and pull me over.
I was just lucky I wasn't thrown under the wheels.

I rarely tell other people to walk the road after that experience, unless I know it to be a very quiet road.

 

[jeffnd]

I saw a poster in a few albergues showing a rock and a shell character with Do's and Don'ts for the Camino. One of them was to walk with a reflective, high visibility vest. I kept thinking that was a really good idea. My jacket was brown and gray and my pack was dark green and gray. When I go back, I'm definitely bringing a vest.

This is such a sad situation.

 

[Former member 22438]

I saw a poster in a few albergues showing a rock and a shell character with Do's and Don'ts for the Camino. One of them was to walk with a reflective, high visibility vest. I kept thinking that was a really good idea. My jacket was brown and gray and my pack was dark green and gray. When I go back, I'm definitely bringing a vest.

This is such a sad situation.

When we walk in such a situation we allways walk facing the trafic and behind each other, I am in front , my wife behind me . I have the reflecting vest in the front , the vest of my wife hangs on her backpack because you also have to count with upcoming overtaking traffic on 2 lane roads from behind.
We also move our walking poles to the roadside to warn the drivers we are there.
Thanks God. We survided three caminos .but I agree it is dangerous.

 

[dougfitz]

the vest of my wife hangs on her backpack because you also have to count with upcoming overtaking traffic on 2 lane roads from behind.

I was going to ask how you dealt with the traffic apprcoaching from the rear. Thanks for letting us know

 

[Stephen Nicholls]

ALWAYS walk facing oncoming traffic. In some parts of Spain the police will actually stop you if you're on the wrong side.
On some caminos it's virtually impossible to even walk along the 'break-down' lane to the left of the road [see photo] .

[Photo of the remote Ruta del Ebro]
Wear a reflective jacket! They weigh next to nothing. I admit I sometimes don't - but I should!!

 

[Stephen]

Sad news. My thoughts and prayers are with her family.

 

[Bernard duffy]

Road-walking can be dangerous even with a vest on!
One year I was (literally) blown over by a semi truck passing me on the road.
I was walking facing the traffic, and never in a million years expected the wind to catch my pack and poncho and pull me over.
I was just lucky I wasn't thrown under the wheels.

I rarely tell other people to walk the road after that experience, unless I know it to be a very quiet road.

Same thing happened to me last year on the Camino,went into the ditch,felt so sorry for the pilgrims behind me who thought i'd been hit and rushed to my aid expecting a body,and found an Irish leprechaun instead

 

[Anemone del Camino]

View attachment 19152 The reports indicate the accident occurred about ½ kilometre outside o pedrouzo.

Half a km from Pedrouzo probably makes this the place where you come up a hill a d see all sorts of arrows, signs and spraypaint confusing you as to where to go. Left to the albergue it says, but what if it is not the albergue you want but a bar? Across the street to the Camino, but in reality if you walk towards the albergue you will also be on the Camino at the end of the village. Even if I had been at that spot before all those sighs confused me and I
at the intersection hesitating.

Plus, the road to the left splits, so you have a. It of road to cross, then a but of grass, 2 feet, then road again and you have to guess where the traffic is comming from.

This is one place where taking everyone through town would be best, and where signage of commercial enterprises should be removed.

I see more and more people wearing hi viz coulours, make your hat the high viz item and you won't have to carry an extra item, and you can wear it all day.

Finally, when getting to a crossing, especially after a hill, ,ake sure you have caught your breath so you can quickly react should anything happen while crossing a road, even if it just tripping.

 

[sulu]

This has been raised on the forum before, particularly in reference to walking along roads when that is necessary. Perhaps someone with a good understanding of the local laws and regulations might enlighten us when there is a legal requirement to wear high visibility clothing, rather than it being good practice.

It is a legal requirement to wear reflective clothing when walking or cycling on a road in poor visibility, but it is also a legal requirement for drivers to carry a reflective jacket in their vehicle and to wear it if their car breaks down and they get out, regardless of visibility. Round me people wear reflective jackets when they walk in bright sunshine.

 

[wayfarer]

It sounds like the same place the two German pilgrims were killed in 2013 and if so it really is a dangerous place to cross. We passed there two days after that tragedy.
My condolonces to the family.

 

[GettingThere]

This is so sad. We walked this section on Sunday too. Visibility would have been excellent, it was clear and sunny. However Pedrouzo was holding its Corpus Christi festival and for most of the day they were setting off some kind of fireworks - not sure exactly what they were a they seemed to be launched from hand-held devices of some kind. Anyway they were incredibly loud, really like big explosions every few seconds at times - if that was going on it would have been easy to be distracted while crossing that road. And of course a lot of traffic heading into and put of the town. Very sad indeed if the festival activities contributed in any way to this tragedy.

 

[grayland]

Here is a earlier thread discussing the requirement to wear high viz vests in low light conditions.

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/reflective-jackets.11793/

 

[Kitsambler]

If that is a known dangerous crossing, and the local authorities won't add warning signs on the roadway, might it be possible to post a warning placard on the Camino path itself? "Warning: Hazardous Crossing Ahead" with a schematic map of the pilgrim route through the intersection? We see many such placards in photos of the Japanese pilgrim route.

 

[jirit]

It sounds like the same place the two German pilgrims were killed in 2013 and if so it really is a dangerous place to cross. We passed there two days after that tragedy.
My condolonces to the family.

EDITED
Actually I thought the same thing that it was the same place, but in fact the two german pilgrims were hit further east just in front on this bus shelter beside the albergue in the photo.

there are a number of locations where pilgrims must cross this highway or walk along beside it

 

[Pabloke]

Here is a earlier thread discussing the requirement to wear high viz vests in low light conditions.

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/reflective-jackets.11793/

If someone is interested, this is the Law:

http://noticias.juridicas.com/base_datos/Admin/rd1428-2003.html

Ley sobre tráfico, circulación a motor y seguridad vial. Law on traffic, motor traffic and road safety.

This is exactly what it says:

Artículo 122 Circulación por la calzada o el arcén
1. Fuera de poblado, en todas las vías objeto de la ley, y en tramos de poblado incluidos en el desarrollo de una carretera que no disponga de espacio especialmente reservado para peatones, como norma general, la circulación de éstos se hará por la izquierda (artículo 49.2 del texto articulado).

Artículo 123 Circulación nocturna
Fuera del poblado, entre el ocaso y la salida del sol o en condiciones meteorológicas o ambientales que disminuyan sensiblemente la visibilidad, todo peatón, cuando circule por la calzada o el arcén, deberá ir provisto de un elemento luminoso o retrorreflectante homologado y que responda a las prescripciones técnicas contenidas en el Real Decreto 1407/1992, de 20 de noviembre, por el que se regulan las condiciones para la comercialización y libre circulación intracomunitaria de los equipos de protección individual, que sea visible a una distancia mínima de 150 metros para los conductores que se le aproximen, y los grupos de peatones dirigidos por una persona o que formen cortejo llevarán, además, en el lado más próximo al centro de la calzada, las luces necesarias para precisar su situación y dimensiones, las cuales serán de color blanco o amarillo hacia adelante y rojo hacia atrás y, en su caso, podrán constituir un solo conjunto.

Basically what has been said already. Walk on the left side when out of town and use homologated bright or retroreflective elements between sunset and sunrise and in low visibility conditions. These elements must be visible to approaching drivers at a distance of 150 meters.

 

[Pabloke]

http://www.lavozdegalicia.es/notici...-atropellada-pino/00031433682719271746629.htm

This article says that she was crossing the road and that that point is not considered as dangerous.



Pedestrians are never safe enough on the road. We must be as careful as possible, life is the best we have.

 

[Bohemiana]

View attachment 19152 The reports indicate the accident occurred about ½ kilometre outside o pedrouzo.

There is a dangerous crossing of the highway N-547 at this same location where visibility is limited especially on wet and dark days. Pilgrims leave a small paved country road way and must cross the N-547 in order to continue along a forest path before reaching o pedrouzo.

Some I am sure choose to walk along the highway shoulder as a short cut to the town.

I know this is not where she was hit but I remember this exact spot very well. It's very confusing because there's a map before the road and then it's unclear if you should cross the road or walk down the road to the left. Either way, it was a busy road when we got there about 2:00 p.m.

Many times as I was walking on roads I wondered to myself why the Spanish government doesn't do more to widen the shoulders of the roads for pilgrims to walk. So many times we were walking on the side of the road with only 1-2 feet of space. With 200,000 pilgrims walking per year, I think it is worth the investment in dangerous areas. The road out of Leon was particularly narrow, with lots of traffic and many cars didn't budge despite plenty of room down the middle of the road.

I feel terrible for that woman's family. The Camino should be a joy, not a sorrow.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Actually I thought the same thing that it was the same place but in fact it was further east just in front on this bus shelter beside the albergue in the photo.

there are a number of locations where pilgrims must cross this highway or walk along beside it

View attachment 19208

If that is where she was hit, and the building shown is the public albergue in Santa Irene, while the road is wide you can see traffic coming both ways from far away giving you plenty of time to cross. And the only reason you would be crossing would be is you stayed at one of the albergues, otherwise you do not need to go under the road to then cross it, you can just keep walking straight. But Sta-Irene is 3km before Pedrouzo, not 500 m.

 

[jirit]

If that is where she was hit, and the building shown is the public albergue in Santa Irene, while the road is wide you can see traffic coming both ways from far away giving you plenty of time to cross. And the only reason you would be crossing would be is you stayed at one of the albergues, otherwise you do not need to go under the road to then cross it, you can just keep walking straight. But Sta-Irene is 3km before Pedrouzo, not 500 m.

Sorry for the confusion but the photo shows the location is where the two german pilgrims were hit 2 years ago

 

[Saint Mike II]

View attachment 19152 The reports indicate the accident occurred about ½ kilometre outside o pedrouzo.
There is a dangerous crossing of the highway N-547 at this same location where visibility is limited especially on wet and dark days. Pilgrims leave a small paved country road way and must cross the N-547 in order to continue along a forest path before reaching o pedrouzo.

What's the chances we (pilgrims) could approach to local authorities to improve the signage warning pilgrims and making the routing a lot clearer and easier to understand??

 

[Lois Lane]

I did hear something on the radio this morning about this. I think it was a traffic accident. Pilgrim walking and a car hit him/her.

So sorry to hear this. Rest in Peace Pilgrim.

 

[Deleted member 30687]

Pilgrims vs cars
Why do we do it, the cars always win. I agree with the reflective jackets, lighting and any other thing that will make you more visible to traffic, however common sense is the biggest factor in keeping you safe. I have seen people run out in front of cars trying to cross and on narrow bridges with guard rails right next to the pavement people insist on crossing without regard to the traffic. I think when we are on pilgrimage we are pretty much on vacation and we think everyone should know that and give us special consideration. Those cars and trucks are being driven by mothers taking their children to school and trucks taking produce to market. They are just people doing the same things that happen everyday in your hometowns. Since we are on vacation when you approach a bridge or a crossing and there is traffic just stop and wait for traffic to clear. It never takes more than a few minutes. Your safety is so much more important than getting across that road or bridge. When we were children our parents and grandparents always told us to look both ways and make sure it is safe to cross. That's pretty good advice.

 

[Jeff Crawley]

It's a sad fact that hi-viz clothing gets less and less effective as more and more people wear it - a gang carried out a bank raid in Dublin and "blended in" because they wore hi-viz!
I work on the motorways in the UK. As standard my crews wear hi-viz long sleeved jackets and reflective banded yellow trousers and yet drivers still blast past at 100kph.
Walk on the side facing the traffic (left hand side of the road), stay behind any barriers and be ready to jump for it!

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Walk on the side facing the traffic (left hand side of the road), stay behind any barriers and be ready to jump for it!

Absolutely, and this is something you do not see those walking the lat 100km doing. So you end up with them on the right, the rest of us on the left, and the car ... not knowing where to go.

 

[BrianForbesColgate]

Requiescat in pace, peregrina ....

A roll of this could be used to add reflective stripes to packs, pack covers, pants, back of boots, front and back of hats, etc. There are versions of this that are sew-on as well, that will handle washings. http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/ScotchliteNA/Scotchlite/Products/~?N=4621

 

[templarsoul]

We leave in two days, and I can't begin to fathom such a loss during such a momentous occasion as the Camino. Condolences to her and her family.

 

[jirit]

The Association of Friends of the Camino de Santiago in the province of Lugo has prepared a document which reports 75 points on the road that need "urgent intervention" safety for walkers and has called for a protest that cut off road between Lugo and Santiago up to O Pino to criticize those accidents suffered by pilgrims.

More here:

http://www.teinteresa.es/galicia/a-...intervencion-seguridad-Pino_0_1382263102.html

 

[BrianForbesColgate]

It is a legal requirement to wear reflective clothing when walking or cycling on a road in poor visibility, but it is also a legal requirement for drivers to carry a reflective jacket in their vehicle and to wear it if their car breaks down and they get out, regardless of visibility. Round me people wear reflective jackets when they walk in bright sunshine.

NO WHITE AT NIGHT!
When was the last time you were surprised whilst driving, by someone at night walking or riding on the road, wearing dark clothes, and you thought to yourself, "Why aren't they wearing white." It seems white is not enough. When you see it you are already too close to avoid a collision. Watch and learn - as a driver, and as a pedestrian/cyclist.
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/ScotchliteNA/Scotchlite/Industries/Pedestrians/