Jeff Crawley
Veteran Member
- Time of past OR future Camino
- A "Tourigrino" trip once Covid has passed, so 2023
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I think it’s fair to say that Massachusetts is the equivalent of Portugal. Wonderfully nice people, until they get behind the wheel.The state is often abbreviated as Mass even in speech and that has led to increased general usage of the term folks in neighboring states have used for our drivers, Massholes.
Have you spent much time in Italy?I think it’s fair to say that Massachusetts is the equivalent of Portugal. Wonderfully nice people, until they get behind the wheel.
Or Athens….Have you spent much time in Italy?
Italy is by far the worst country in Europe for driving!Have you spent much time in Italy?
Yes, I can testify to the hostility to Athenians in the rest of the country.I think all countries do this to an extent don't they? We certainly do in New Zealand, (with regard to Aucklanders); and I've just gotten home after a short road trip with a friend where he was very derogatory towards the Berliners. Nor , might I add, is he alone in that regard.
When I lived and worked on the Greek islands the worst possible customer was somebody from Athens.... . For similar reasons to those described in the article quoted.
That is any foreigner, but I think it is especially the northern European foreigners who come to Spain for sol y playa (sun and beach). I'm not sure it is used equally for pilgrims, especially on the less walked pilgrim routes.Giris (not sure about the spelling), but that is any foreigner.
Romania is statistically the worst with 85 deaths per million inhabitants in 2022. Portugal is fifth with 63 and Italy tenth with 54. So be warned.Italy is by far the worst country in Europe for driving!
I spent about 4 years in a suburb of Boston. I actually played a janitor in a college play... they loved my Masshole character.Massholes.
My job at school was driving the student shuttle bus. When you are driving a big student bus down Mass Ave you just go and the other drivers get out of your way.I think it’s fair to say that Massachusetts is the equivalent of Portugal. Wonderfully nice people, until they get behind the wheel.
Don't try cycling across Romania - you will clearly observe driving that leads to that.Romania is statistically the worst with 85 deaths per million inhabitants
Romania is statistically the worst with 85 deaths per million inhabitants in 2022. Portugal is fifth with 63 and Italy tenth with 54. So be warned.
Yes David I agree. Guiri is not used for pilgrims. In relation to " fodechincho" is a marginal term in my opinion. Many Galegos don't know it. I visited Sanxenxo in May that is the touristic town with more Madrileños in summer by far and I realized speaking with locals that they were welcome.That is any foreigner, but I think it is especially the northern European foreigners who come to Spain for sol y playa (sun and beach). I'm not sure it is used equally for pilgrims, especially on the less walked pilgrim routes.
I can understand the sentiment. For those who do not directly benefit from the vast hordes now walking the major routes the presence of so many noisy and often demanding visitors may be a very mixed blessing. The novelty probably wore off a long time ago.Not sure exactly what they call us, but a tee shirt worn by a local in La Coruna on Sunday may give a clue. It said "Buen Camino" on top of an arrow that was in reality the top of the middle finger of the yellow hand !
So what countries are the top 10 so we can be forewarned?Romania is statistically the worst with 85 deaths per million inhabitants in 2022. Portugal is fifth with 63 and Italy tenth with 54. So be warned.
And Sicilians are the worst drivers in Italy. Talk about taking your life in your hands......Italy is by far the worst country in Europe for driving!
What we really need is accidents per miles driven.
Some of my best friends are JAFA’s!!I think all countries do this to an extent don't they? We certainly do in New Zealand, (with regard to Aucklanders); and I've just gotten home after a short road trip with a friend where he was very derogatory towards the Berliners. Nor , might I add, is he alone in that regard.
When I lived and worked on the Greek islands the worst possible customer was somebody from Athens.... . For similar reasons to those described in the article quoted.
2+ years in Naples (also the same in Gibraltar, Southern tip of Spain), how I laughed at the traffic … especially since most of the time I was on a motorcycle (R1200RT) that my predecessor(s) really didn’t want me to bring. Took me to Sicily for a month every Spring, to Athens for 2 weeks (to instruct), to Istanbul & Ankara for 2 weeks. Too late now to say “touchwood” (disabled, but not due to a traffic accident) but I hadn’t had an accident in over 30 years. After those experiences, you can smile at any event (unless fatal to others).Have you spent much time in Italy?
Especially in Palermo!Have you spent much time in Italy?
OUCH!Here in Palencia, I've heard pilgrims described as "tucuras" or "longostas." Locusts.
How apt…Here in Palencia, I've heard pilgrims described as "tucuras" or "longostas." Locusts.
It’s almost like the Spanish population are fed-up with tourism driving their economy; what with water pistols at dusk outside restaurants on the coast & folks actually having the cheek to complain about people (read young hikers, certainly not pilgrims in spirit) stealing their food (&/or livelihood).How apt…
Guirris I think, but as you say not specific to the CaminoGiris (not sure about the spelling), but that is any foreigner.
It's a word they use all over the country, I don't take it as being bad and think it is quite affectionate, as you say laughing at our funny habits.I am thinking again: the people who called me a guiri were from the Basque Country.They are still friends, by the way! So, I have no idea what Gallegos would call me...
I did my best to escape the description but I came to the conclusion that once a stranger, always a stranger.. Seriously, it is something that applies on different levels. They laughed at my style, at my accent... and try as I might, and I did, reading all around me, there is no substitute for being of the place, of the people. The funny thing is, the Spanish speakers I come across in Dublin who hear me speaking now can be astonished that I am not from Bilbao!
I quite agree. I have deep gratitude to my Spanish friends for their patience with my attempts to understand who they are, and why. And literature is a wonderful way to grasp that.It's a word they use all over the country, I don't take it as being bad and think it is quite affectionate, as you say laughing at our funny habits.
I learnt my Spanish as a boy trapped in Gibraltar (apart from Maroc, and one holiday in Lisbon that covered the “carnation flowers” peaceful overthrow of the government, excuse my memory but I believe that it was named after the flowers popped down the rifle barrels. A young girl gave me a white dove whilst I was there that I released in Gibraltar. Importing stuff wasn’t a problem in those days … a school chum’s dad was something in customs. The turbo-prop aircraft was Gib Airways) attending The Lourdes Comprehensive School. On returning to the UK, I attended the last Cornish Grammar School aged 14. Rather than allow me to take an O’Level in Spanish, I had to learn French from scratch … I managed to murder the language to the extent that the French teacher would ask “how can you wreck one romantic language whilst comfortable with another?” Pure pig-headedness I would think whilst smiling. Years later I returned to RAF Gibraltar as OC Ops, to find many school friends ensconced within the airfield and the Royal Gibraltar Police. It was as if I had never left.I quite agree. I have deep gratitude to my Spanish friends for their patience with my attempts to understand who they are, and why. And literature is a wonderful way to grasp that.
My friends were not being horrible. They did spur me on, though.
It was my hope to be able to acquire a respectful and correct accent. They deserve it! Maybe because of my background in Scotland, where French was the first language promoted in school in my day. It had been the language of culture and commerce, quite some years before I was born!
I was a fair bit older by the time I realised that a great percentage of the world population was Spanish speaking.
Our teachers, in school, were A1 long before the current AI. Note the difference in the A1 and AI typings.
From a forty-year-old newspaper column:I think it’s fair to say that Massachusetts is the equivalent of Portugal. Wonderfully nice people, until they get behind the wheel.
As someone else mentioned, the Guardian wrongly translated the word.From today's Guardian newspaper
Fish thieves
We have a similar thing in Kent, UK called DFLs - Down From London.
Or driving in Taiwan in the 1980s where we expats finally figured out the fundamental law of surviving the roads, and that is . . . "the first person through the opening wins!"Have you spent much time in Italy?
You ain’t seen nothing until you drive in populated areas of New JerseyI think it’s fair to say that Massachusetts is the equivalent of Portugal. Wonderfully nice people, until they get behind the wheel.
It's the same in Guatemala. Guatemalans are the nicest people in the world until they get behind the wheel of a car or motorcycle of whch we are overrun here.I think it’s fair to say that Massachusetts is the equivalent of Portugal. Wonderfully nice people, until they get behind the wheel.
I felt that even those who were directly benefiting from Pilgrims were rather hostile when we walked the Frances in 2018. We didn't get a warm welcome or friendly service in any place on the Frances be it accommodation, restaurant, cafe or bar apart from a delightful waiter in Tricastella. Indifferent at best, and surly as the norm. I wonder what they thought once their cash cows dried up during Covid. Are they more welcoming now? Was that why those on the Podiensis were all kind, helpful, friendly and interested or is that the difference between the French and the Spanish?I can understand the sentiment. For those who do not directly benefit from the vast hordes now walking the major routes the presence of so many noisy and often demanding visitors may be a very mixed blessing. The novelty probably wore off a long time ago.
I shall write to their corrections department!As someone else mentioned, the Guardian wrongly translated the word.
"Foder" is the Galician equivalent of "joder".
As a woman born in Santiago told me, it's quite a "feo" (ugly) word!
The Guardian usually has no qualms about printing the English translation of "joder" so it's odd that they chose "thieves" in this article...
Not really. "Foder" has several meanings, including to spoil something, to cause damage or to annoy. Informally, it can be used with the meaning of stealing. So fish thieves is not really wrong, although it doesn't sound half as nice as "fodechinchos"As someone else mentioned, the Guardian wrongly translated the word.
"Foder" is the Galician equivalent of "joder".
As a woman born in Santiago told me, it's quite a "feo" (ugly) word!
The Guardian usually has no qualms about printing the English translation of "joder" so it's odd that they chose "thieves" in this article...
Seedless?Some of my best friends are JAFA’s!!
Oh dear I started it so I guess I ought to explain.Seedless?
Well I'm just quoting the lady (in her 60s) who was born and brought up in Santiago and she just said about it being the equivalent of "joder" (in Gallego) and being an "ugly" word ("feo")Not really. "Foder" has several meanings, including to spoil something, to cause damage or to annoy. Informally, it can be used with the meaning of stealing. So fish thieves is not really wrong, although it doesn't sound half as nice as "fodechinchos"
Ah the beauty of language. In the UK, at least in my area, Jaffa is slang for a man who is infertile. So if you stand in an English pub and shout ‘some of my best friends are Jaffa’s’ you may get some bemused looks!Oh dear I started it so I guess I ought to explain.
On one hand Jaffas are a type of sweet in Aus & New Zealand - a hard red sugar coating, with chocolate inside.
On the other hand a Jafa is " Just another f**** Aucklander"
Bear in mind that New Zealand's total population is 5.2 million, roughly a third of us live in Auckland. Aucklanders individually are often wonderful people, on mass they don't always have the best of reputations in the rest of New Zealand.....
Basically there's Auckland, and then there's south of the Bombay Hills. ie, where the rest of us (Hicks) live.
Like everything it's stereotypical - a bit like the stereotypical Texan being loud and obnoxious. Very few are but it only takes one to 'prove' the stereotype.
In my home area and some other parts of the UK - particularly Northern Ireland - "Jaffa" is a slang term for Protestants.Ah the beauty of language. In the UK, at least in my area, Jaffa is slang for a man who is infertile.
I was born and brought up in Galicia. I agree with the lady that "foder" is not a polite word and that it is the equivalent of "joder". But the "fish thieves" translation is still OK, if not as colourful as the Galician "fodechinchos"Well I'm just quoting the lady (in her 60s) who was born and brought up in Santiago and she just said about it being the equivalent of "joder" (in Gallego) and being an "ugly" word ("feo")
Or TangosIn my home area and some other parts of the UK - particularly Northern Ireland - "Jaffa" is a slang term for Protestants.
Where I live, "dizzy" is slang for..... ;-)I'm dizzy . . .
Oh, dear, did I just commit a cultural malaprop?Where I live, "dizzy" is slang for..... ;-)
No, I was just joking.Oh, dear, did I just commit a cultural malaprop?
Whew! Our best friends from Singapore days will be with us for (American) Thanksgiving. They are from Toronto (Guelph Line). Extra rations of wine will be deployed and mention made of a certain David Tallan, fellow countryman, Toronto resident, and moderator extraordinaire for the Camino forum . . .No, I was just joking.
Always best to deploy extra rations of wine when my name is mentioned.Whew! Our best friends from Singapore days will be with us for (American) Thanksgiving. They are from Toronto (Guelph Line). Extra rations of wine will be deployed and mention made of a certain David Tallan, fellow countryman, Toronto resident, and moderator extraordinaire for the Camino forum . . .
Another Bob! Yey!Gallegos often call me “Bob” but I really prefer Robert.. Oh, wait, did I misunderstand the question?
I would not dare try to send you either the maquette or the finished piece (prohibitive cost) nor would I call either of them Bob.Another Bob! Yey!
At a music festival my daughter bought a model of a skull (from the "weirdo tent") and, when asked why said she always fancied one and called it Bob.
Roll on a few years and, having told her I'd no recollection of having a teddy bear as a child, I received one for Christmas, a fine fellow rescued from a charity shop which I named . . . Bob
The following Easter my chocolate egg came with a stuffed bunny which I called . . . Bob
And the next Christmas I bought a novelty polar bear head from a garden centre (because the carol singing reindeer head "wasn't allowed") that still hangs proudly on the end of my bookcase 24/7 and called him . . . Bob
Daughter's reaction: "You can't call everything Bob!"
View attachment 176894
It seems, however, that you can.
I once wondered online “why do we call it 'fanny pack' when nobody wears it on their backside?" Then someone explained something about Australian slang …Where I live, "dizzy" is slang for..... ;-)
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