Dov of the Galilee
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- Time of past OR future Camino
- (2017)
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The batteries are quite heavy. We used them for car camping or for our travel trailer, but are heavier than my machine so too heavy for the Camino. I would not send my machine with luggage transfer. I carry it with me as I do my medications.I walked for a bit with a guy who used cPAP machine at night. He was booking private accommodations because he was using a luggage transfer service for the machine AND because he needed to be sure that there would be an electrical outlet. Public albergues usually have a policy of not accepting luggage transfers (although you might be able to send your bag to a private albergue just for pickup). Not all public albergues have an outlet for each bed.
Apparently there are battery-powered travel cPAPs that are quiet enough to sleep in a shared room (see https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/weight-heat-humidity.87802/#post-1273070 )
Anyone who expects an even reasonable level of privacy in a dorm . . . to be as kind as possible, realign your brain cells.So a friend of mine is hesitant of walking the Camino because along with a host of other issues he's a user of a cPAP machine. He's not sure if he would be allowed to use it in a dorm setting and his budget would not allow him to have private rooms.
I've personally heard the machine and I would not be able to sleep with it operating in close vicinity but that varies from person to person.
So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
I believe there us a bit of misunderstandingI walked for a bit with a guy who used cPAP machine at night. He was booking private accommodations because he was using a luggage transfer service for the machine AND because he needed to be sure that there would be an electrical outlet. Public albergues usually have a policy of not accepting luggage transfers (although you might be able to send your bag to a private albergue just for pickup). Not all public albergues have an outlet for each bed.
Apparently there are battery-powered travel cPAPs that are quiet enough to sleep in a shared room (see https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/weight-heat-humidity.87802/#post-1273070 )
At the risk of being contrarian and not going along with the typical group think, I would advise saving $$ to afford private rooms that for sure will accommodate CPAP machine users and not impose on the sleep and enjoyment of many other people situated in albergues. You will likely sleep better as well.
One question which noise do you prefer - deafening snoring or the soft purr of a CPAP device.?
Precisely, my friend thought that by him paying for a single room he wouldn't disturb anyone. He's a considerate fellow and he really wouldn't be the kind of guy to say he has the right to keep others awake because he has a medical need. I think for him this stems from comments from family members who have not been pleased in family gatherings so he is hyper alert to what may happen with strangers who are sleep deprived over several days.I believe there us a bit of misunderstanding
I think when OP refers to private accomodations he means private rooms not Private vs. Public Albergues
I've stayed through all private albergues precisely because I was transferring luggage and if I didn't book a private room I was in the same "communal" bunk beds dorm society as the Pilgrim in Public Albergues.
All one has to do us let the hospitalero/a know the situation and need via email or WhatsApp and request if possible to have a bunk near the electrical plug.
Do you use a luggage transfer service or carry it in your backpack? I have a bipap I have been using for a year and I think it will be a hassle on the walk. Thoughts?Both my husband and I use travel machines, but there are plenty of people who use full sized machines. Before we could speak much Spanish, my husband carried a card explaining his condition and asking to be near an electrical outlet. He carried the card in his credential and always showed it to the hospitalero. He has used his machine on the Camino for 8 years now and never had a problem being accomodated. Often people want to sleep nearby as they know you won't snore. I started using mine about 3 years ago without difficulty. I carry a double euro plug extension cord so we can both use one outlet.
It is very nice of your friend to be considerate if others. No doubt in my mind that if all of us were considerate and friendly to each other the world would be a better place.Precisely, my friend thought that by him paying for a single room he wouldn't disturb anyone. He's a considerate fellow and he really wouldn't be the kind of guy to say he has the right to keep others awake because he has a medical need. I think for him this stems from comments from family members who have not been pleased in family gatherings so he is hyper alert to what may happen with strangers who are sleep deprived over several days.
The question was not addressed to me but I will give you my thought:Do you use a luggage transfer service or carry it in your backpack? I have a bipap I have been using for a year and I think it will be a hassle on the walk. Thoughts?
I hope you meant "farts"...Everyone snores, 10% are the loudest boarding on a Midnight Spécial and 50% also f***s
I use a c pap machine. I don't snore. One night we lost electricity and my wife claims She couldn't sleep. I snored like a chainsaw.So a friend of mine is hesitant of walking the Camino because along with a host of other issues he's a user of a cPAP machine. He's not sure if he would be allowed to use it in a dorm setting and his budget would not allow him to have private rooms.
I've personally heard the machine and I would not be able to sleep with it operating in close vicinity but that varies from person to person.
So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
Yes...although I have seen the other one as well crazy as it may beI hope you meant "farts"...
At the risk of being contrarian and not going along with the typical group think, I would advise saving $$ to afford private rooms that for sure will accommodate CPAP machine users and not impose on the sleep and enjoyment of many other people situated in albergues. You will likely sleep better as well.
Most people do not lug around all of that extra weight just to prevent snoring. I would suggest that the reason is that the machine prevents them from stopping breathing periodically to the point that others wonder if they will start to breathe again. A demonstrated need don't you think?Personally, I prefer the sound of snoring to the sound of these machines - - having said that, if a pilgrim needs one for more serious sleep apnaea than just snoring, then I will always prefer the sound of the machine to whatever medical issues might arise without it.
So my take on the protocol is - - if you actually do need it, then use it. But if it's just for snoring, well : spoiler alert Everybody Snores.
He is a pilgrim as well as anyone of us. I have a friend who used one and for the better part of we found in the same dormitory. It did not bother me, if anything the smorers bothered me more but then I put my ear plugs and I was fine with itSo a friend of mine is hesitant of walking the Camino because along with a host of other issues he's a user of a cPAP machine. He's not sure if he would be allowed to use it in a dorm setting and his budget would not allow him to have private rooms.
I've personally heard the machine and I would not be able to sleep with it operating in close vicinity but that varies from person to person.
So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
I have used mine in dorms when I have stayed in albergues since 2018, and only once has anyone complained. Coincidentally, the same person who had made it difficult for others in the room to fall asleep with his snoring the previous evening.So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
As a user, c-pap machines are necessary for your basic health. The snoring is annoying but more alarming is when you stop breathing which affects your brain and your heart. During the course of the night you can have apnea more than 30 times depending on the severity of the sleep apnea. I always travel with my machine. When my machine broke down in the course of our travels in England I had to sleep sitting up so I would not stop breathing. Believe me if I didn’t need it I would gladly go without one.Personally, I prefer the sound of snoring to the sound of these machines - - having said that, if a pilgrim needs one for more serious sleep apnaea than just snoring, then I will always prefer the sound of the machine to whatever medical issues might arise without it.
So my take on the protocol is - - if you actually do need it, then use it. But if it's just for snoring, well : spoiler alert Everybody Snores.
Precisely! Nothing to do with the subject of the thread but to punctuate the point:I have used mine in dorms when I have stayed in albergues since 2018, and only once has anyone complained. Coincidentally, the same person who had made it difficult for others in the room to fall asleep with his snoring the previous evening.
I usually don't, but sometimes I do ; and on occasion it can be fairly loud.Any time I heard someone (and sometimes quite smugly) say that they don't snore AT ALL they were the loudest snorer in the room
I have a cpap machine and it is silent once its on my face properly. This is better than my snoring any day andI wish many of my fellow pilgrims had done the same. I always pack an extension cord to, not just for cpap but also charging whatever you may want to charge when you aren't by the outlet.So a friend of mine is hesitant of walking the Camino because along with a host of other issues he's a user of a cPAP machine. He's not sure if he would be allowed to use it in a dorm setting and his budget would not allow him to have private rooms.
I've personally heard the machine and I would not be able to sleep with it operating in close vicinity but that varies from person to person.
So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
Curious. Have you ever heard a CPAP at night? And if you follow your logic, then snorers or those who rustle plastics bags at 4:30 AM should also book private rooms.While use of CPAP is desirable and a necessity for some people, imposing yourself and equipment needs into relatively close sleeping quarters such as found in albergues is NOT a necessity in order to enjoy a Camino. I, myself would not in good conscience put myself into an environment whereby my health condition/behaviors are disruptive to the sleep needs of others especially on an arduous activity such as long distance walking. There are plenty of other options available to pilgrims who find themselves in this situation. Just because something CAN be done doesn’t mean it SHOULD be.
I have learned over time that a self-discipline of breathing in and out at the same rhythm as the snorers gets you to sleep despite them. As to now, this has become second nature for me, and it does generally work.As a rule it is the responsibility of the light sleeper to use earplugs, as a snorer will more likely give you trouble..
It's the people who feel their sleep might be disrupted by the ordinary behaviour of others who need to seek more private accommodation. Neither snoring nor CPAP use is anything out of the ordinary.While use of CPAP is desirable and a necessity for some people, imposing yourself and equipment needs into relatively close sleeping quarters such as found in albergues is NOT a necessity in order to enjoy a Camino. I, myself would not in good conscience put myself into an environment whereby my health condition/behaviors are disruptive to the sleep needs of others especially on an arduous activity such as long distance walking. There are plenty of other options available to pilgrims who find themselves in this situation. Just because something CAN be done doesn’t mean it SHOULD be.
Perhaps this comment is an indication that you shouldn't be sleeping in alberguesMaybe sleep disruption/deprivation are one of those sought after albergue experiences to make the journey somehow seem more authentic. Not for me.
Please search out this thread for my response to your 1st post along the same lineWhile use of CPAP is desirable and a necessity for some people, imposing yourself and equipment needs into relatively close sleeping quarters such as found in albergues is NOT a necessity in order to enjoy a Camino. I, myself would not in good conscience put myself into an environment whereby my health condition/behaviors are disruptive to the sleep needs of others especially on an arduous activity such as long distance walking. There are plenty of other options available to pilgrims who find themselves in this situation. Just because something CAN be done doesn’t mean it SHOULD be.
If you're concerned and thank you wouldn't be able to sleep with the noise of a cpap, how in the world would you survive snoring and everything else?So a friend of mine is hesitant of walking the Camino because along with a host of other issues he's a user of a cPAP machine. He's not sure if he would be allowed to use it in a dorm setting and his budget would not allow him to have private rooms.
I've personally heard the machine and I would not be able to sleep with it operating in close vicinity but that varies from person to person.
So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
Then you should probably stay in private rooms.Maybe sleep disruption/deprivation are one of those sought after albergue experiences to make the journey somehow seem more authentic. Not for me.
I apologize for the typo…. It should read four Caminos. Frances, Portuguese coastal, Primitivo, and Invierno all with a CPAP. I never received a single complaint.I have completed for Camino with a travel CPAP and it has never been an issue. The machine itself is very quiet. My roommates have told me it sounds like a quiet white noise, which is a lot better than snoring.
They are honestly not loud. About the same as the quiet hum of an air-conditioner or similar.While use of CPAP is desirable and a necessity for some people, imposing yourself and equipment needs into relatively close sleeping quarters such as found in albergues is NOT a necessity in order to enjoy a Camino. I, myself would not in good conscience put myself into an environment whereby my health condition/behaviors are disruptive to the sleep needs of others especially on an arduous activity such as long distance walking. There are plenty of other options available to pilgrims who find themselves in this situation. Just because something CAN be done doesn’t mean it SHOULD be.
Well... there is always a 5th CaminoI apologize for the typo…. It should read four Caminos. Frances, Portuguese coastal, Primitivo, and Invierno all with a CPAP. I never received a single complaint.
So a friend of mine is hesitant of walking the Camino because along with a host of other issues he's a user of a cPAP machine. He's not sure if he would be allowed to use it in a dorm setting and his budget would not allow him to have private rooms.
I've personally heard the machine and I would not be able to sleep with it operating in close vicinity but that varies from person to person.
So the question is should he wait till he is able to afford private accommodations or chance being in the group lodgings where he could face some unpleasant situations from sleepless pilgrims?
Nobody need seek private accommodation, and whatever happened to tolerance ?It's the people who feel their sleep might be disrupted by the ordinary behaviour of others who need to seek more private accommodation. Neither snoring nor CPAP use is anything out of the ordinary.
Yes they are very expensive but I have found it worth it when I have to carry it for several hundred kilometres. An extension cord can alleviate several problems.I used a portable C-Pap. I bought the battery pack but left it at home because it was so heavy. The portable machines are RIDICULOUSLY expensive. I always asked to be near an outlet and that usually worked. The best bit of gear I took was a LONG EXTENSION CORD which I sometimes needed to use.
That would include the people with CPAP and we should be tolerant to them ( as many have pointed out over and over its not a toy on the whim it's a life saving apparatus!) and yet someone keeps on insisting that THEY SHOULD seek private accommodation.Nobody need seek private accommodation, and whatever happened to tolerance ?
Obviously.That would include the people with CPAP and we should be tolerant to them
ExactlyNobody need seek private accommodation, and whatever happened to tolerance ?
No, we are all pilgrimsThat would include the people with CPAP and we should be tolerant to them ( as many have pointed out over and over its not a toy on the whim it's a life saving apparatus!) and yet someone keeps on insisting that THEY SHOULD seek private accommodation.
I don't know... we all are entitled to our opinions of course but stuff like this is just mind-boggling
For the sake of an argument-to that person- you just completed yor daily walk, got to an albergue, walked into a dorm and...GASP! see a person with CPAP machine. Are you leaving?
I am sure she's already working on that oneWell... there is always a 5th Camino
That is simply UNTRUE that "everyone snores".The Albergue is full - there are good 20-30 pilgrims in there. Not a ONE CPAP machine
"to impose on the sleep and enjoyment (?) of many other people..."
Everyone snores, 10% are the loudest boarding on a Midnight Spécial and 50% also f***s. For the good measure 20% make other sounds in their sleep (and I won't even mention the guy who sleepwalking or the one that went to the bathroom and coming back accidentally tried to get into a bunk of a 19yo female)...
...And not a single CPAP...
....now what would I prefer?
I have tried several sources, and anything up to 44% of men and 25% of women admit to snoring. The numbers seem to vary a bit with age, with younger people less likely to admit to snoring than older ones.A small percentage snore.
You should meet my kid. 25 years old, incredibly fit (hikes every weekend, bikes every day) and very rarely drinks. And the loudest snorer I've ever heard (with a hallway and two closed doors away).That is simply UNTRUE that "everyone snores".
A small percentage snore. And an even smaller percentage snore loudly (and cause sleepless nights to many other pilgrims because ear plugs are ineffective against loud snoring).
During over a dozen Caminos in two countries over 18 years, I have never come across more than one loud snorer who either a) was not overweight or b) didn't drink alcohol or c) both.
The exception proves the rule.
Given your thoughts that "a small percentage snore" combined with the preponderance of people who indicate they have noticed snorers on their Camino; perhaps there is a sociological study area to determine why so many snorers are attracted to the CaminoThat is simply UNTRUE that "everyone snores".
A small percentage snore. And an even smaller percentage snore loudly (and cause sleepless nights to many other pilgrims because ear plugs are ineffective against loud snoring).
During over a dozen Caminos in two countries over 18 years, I have never come across more than one loud snorer who either a) was not overweight or b) didn't drink alcohol or c) both.
The exception proves the rule.
Hello and PLEASE take a good look at the context in which my post was made. I was making a point that some kind of "cacophony" is going on at the dorm and not one single CPAP machine is in sight (and per ongoing conversation at the time and to answer the user who was adamantly against having a C-PAP machine in the dorm because it would then "impose on the sleep and enjoyment of many other people")That is simply UNTRUE that "everyone snores".
A small percentage snore. And an even smaller percentage snore loudly (and cause sleepless nights to many other pilgrims because ear plugs are ineffective against loud snoring).
During over a dozen Caminos in two countries over 18 years, I have never come across more than one loud snorer who either a) was not overweight or b) didn't drink alcohol or c) both.
The exception proves the rule.
The exception proves the rule!!You should meet my kid. 25 years old, incredibly fit (hikes every weekend, bikes every day) and very rarely drinks. And the loudest snorer I've ever heard (with a hallway and two closed doors away).
You said "everyone snores". Maybe you meant "everyone is snoring". The latter indicates that the action is happening NOW. But you used the former (the Present Simple) which indicates a general or habitual action.Hello and PLEASE take a good look at the context in which my post was made. I was making a point that some kind of "cacophony" is going on at the dorm and not one single CPAP machine is in sight (and per ongoing conversation at the time and to answer the user who was adamantly against having a C-PAP machine in the dorm because it would then "impose on the sleep and enjoyment of many other people")
It was nothing more as a hypothetical example ...
That said - lucky you encountering only one loud snorer on over a dozen Caminos in 2 countries. Because I encountered them a-plenty on only ONE Camino (admittedly also in 2 countries.... but to be fair - the percentage definitely goes up once I moved from Country # 1 to Country # 2)
Well the amount of overweight people and those drinking excess alcohol has increased exponentially over the years so it's not surprising that people are noticing more snorers. I would love people to realize how badly alcohol (even in "small" amounts) affects the lungs and respiratory system. Because no government will tell you. They rely too much on the taxes.Given your thoughts that "a small percentage snore" combined with the preponderance of people who indicate they have noticed snorers on their Camino; perhaps there is a sociological study area to determine why so many snorers are attracted to the Camino
"Younger people less likely to admit they snore". That's one heck of a biased take.I have tried several sources, and anything up to 44% of men and 25% of women admit to snoring. The numbers seem to vary a bit with age, with younger people less likely to admit to snoring than older ones.
If you have a source that suggests a small percentage, say less than 5%, snore, would you mind sharing it.
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