OBSOLETE COVID THREAD Covid digital vaccine passport being prepared (for EU citizens)

[alexwalker]

The prime minister of Norway (Norway is EU affiliated, not a member) said yesterday that a national corona passport will be available to our citizens by the end of May, and an EU equivalent will be available before end of June, allowing vaccinated EU citizens (and us Norwegians) to travel freely in the EU. Nothing about other regions of the world, though. In my case, planning is starting up. Hope to hit Spanish ground in September, fully vaccinated (Second and final shot due on May 26th).

 

[pepi]

I think that the WHO yellow passport will be worthless for travelling to Spain. I won't even take mine with me when I get my Covid-19 jab. Plus, there've been news reports recently that faked WHO yellow passports are illegally available for € 125. The digital certificates would be much harder to fake, I guess. This, and the fact that they can be scanned and read automatically are in their favour.

El Pais had yet another article (in English) about the "Digital Green Certificate" that will become available in June at the earliest. The advantage for travellers, according to the Spanish Minister for Health, will be twofold: it will allow citizens of Europe to enter Spain without having to quarantine or take a coronavirus test. IOW, a digital green certificate will save you hassle, time and money when travelling to Spain.

In absence of any alternative proof of vaccination, the WHO certificate is absolutely valid. As however, the EU including Switzerland is currently hastily working on a digital green certificate and such will certainly become the prime "passport" to prove vaccination, when it has been introduced; but this is only the case for EU citizens.
Until non-EU countries have established similar (recognized) certifications as the green certificate, the WHO certificates will be honored, since they can be backtracked to the issuer who can confirm that the vaccination has taken place. Hence a fake certificate can be detected. The WHO certificate is therefore absolutely not worthless.
This information was given to me by the Swiss authorities.

 

[Kathor1]

No doubt we will soon learn what type of vaccination proof will be accepted in order to be exempt from Covid-19 related restrictions when entering Spain by air, sea or land. As far as I can tell, at the time of writing, the current answer is "none", and proof of a PCR test is required from travellers whether vaccinated or not. The vaccination rates are currently around 20% of the (adult?) population in EU countries but this is due to increase considerably during May. Change is in the air.

I don't know how vaccination is documented in the various EU countries. As I understand it, they are making large-scale use of the yellow WHO passports in German vaccination centers for example, i.e. people are asked or encouraged to bring their WHO passport with them but in other EU countries this is not the case. "Unified in diversity/Unida en la diversidad/Unie dans la diversité/In Vielfalt geeint" .

 

[pepi]

@Kathar1na
I am sorry to differ, I think that we all should stop posting pure guesswork in this forum and wait for the official regulations. Rules are clearly different for EU citizens and aliens from other countries, especially those living overseas including Britain. (E.g. the PCR test is not required between many EU countries and regions.)

 

[Kathor1]

posting pure guesswork in this forum

I thought I had made it clear in my post that I was referring only to the current PCR entry requirement (including other accepted test methods) that Spain has established, not about any other country. I have an interest in this as I am thinking on and off of travelling to Spain this year and I follow developments carefully.

BTW, published by the Spanish government (it's even in English and it covers the whole world, not only the EU+ area):

• List of countries and areas from which a negative diagnostic test for active SARS- CoV-2 infection will be required from passengers before entering Spain.
  VALIDITY: This list will come into force at 12:00am (midnight) on April 12th, 2021 and will be valid until 12:00am (midnight) on April 25th, 2021
  
  
• List of countries and areas from which a negative diagnostic test for active SARS- CoV-2 infection will be required from passengers before entering Spain.
  VALIDITY: This list will come into force at 12:00am (midnight) on April 26th, 2021 and will be valid until 12:00am (midnight) on May 9th, 2021

To avoid confusion: The lists say who must provide the result of a negative PCR test or similar test. It doesn't say anything about all the other current entry requirements/bans established by Spain.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

To avoid confusion:

In my opinion, there is really almost no way to avoid confusion this past year on all things related to Covid-19 and how to avoid contracting it, including government Lockdowns, the experimental vaccines, and now adding in the special passports.

 

[Kathor1]

In any case ... here is the link to the current form of the proposal for the EU's (and Spain's) Digital Green Certificate (DGC). Text printed in bold are new amendments. Interestingly, in the "prologue", they mention fraud (the future EU certificates cover both vaccination and test results):

The risk posed by false COVID-19 certificates is real. On 1 February 2021, Europol issued an Early Warning Notification on the illicit sales of false negative COVID-19 test certificates. Given the available and easily accessible technological means, such as high-resolution printers and various graphics editor software, fraudsters are able to produce high-quality forged, faked or counterfeit certificates. Cases of illicit sales of fraudulent test certificates have been reported, involving more organised forgery rings and individual opportunistic scammers selling false certificates offline and online.​

 

[C clearly]

In my opinion, there is really almost no way to avoid confusion this past year on all things related to Covid-19 and how to avoid contracting it, including government Lockdowns, the experimental vaccines, and now adding in the special passports.

If you expect simple black-and-white unchanging answers, you will be confused by the reality that our knowledge is limited. We need to act on the best knowledge available, from the most qualified sources available.

I don't understand the point in referring to the vaccines as "experimental" except to sow doubt and confusion. I hope that data will continue to be collected for many many years, on this disease and vaccines as well as others, in order to learn more. Our knowledge will never be complete.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

I agree, @C clearly, yet my intent was not to sow any discord, but only sharing my personal frustration and opinion at the continually changing information.
When I said experimental, I only used the word because for now the vaccines are not yet FDA(Food and Drug Administration) approved as far as I can tell...they are only AEU by the FDA for now; Authorized for Emergency Use. I am not saying they have no benefit and I do plan to be vaccinated.
You can check the FDA's website.
https://www.fda.gov/emergency-prepa...virus-disease-2019-covid-19/covid-19-vaccines
Including is this page I have copied from their website from this April. I will not comment nor debate further.

 

[Kathor1]

the vaccines are not yet FDA(Food and Drug Administration) approved as far as I can tell...they are only AEU by the FDA for now; Authorized for Emergency Use. I am not saying they have no benefit and I do plan to be vaccinated.

Erm ... a better term would be novel vaccines perhaps as the Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna technique is fairly new (mRNA); all the other Covid-19 vaccines that have been developed so far are more conventional. Remember that there is a larger range of vaccines in use in the UK, Hungary, China, Russia, and many other countries, than the two vaccines used in the USA ... BTW, the EU's (see thread topic ...) EMA did not go for emergency use authorisation. They opted for their conditional marketing authorisation approach. It sounds less dramatic.

 

[nathanael]

I think that the idea of a vaccine passport may be a good idea, but is fraught with problems. The first of which is fairness while the vaccine is still in short supply.

I definitely agree on a vaccine passport many disagree, well if you are not willing to be vaccinated then you could be a risk to others. all for vaccine passport.

 

[Kathor1]

I definitely agree on a vaccine passport many disagree, well if you are not willing to be vaccinated then you could be a risk to others. all for vaccine passport.

Vaccination and vaccination passports are two totally different things. The concerns about vaccination passports are related to concerns about the protection of private data and the fear that they might be used as a means to exclude people from various activities. The first aspect (data protection and security) is a high priority for EU countries and the second aspect is irrelevant as the EU DGC will not be used to exclude people from travelling. It is not even a vaccination passport. It will contain information about vaccination (if taken) and/or about the result of recent PCR test or similar test (if required for travelling) and/or a recent Covid-19 infection (within less than 6 months).

 

[nycwalking]

Big brother is watching aspect of Covid passports is unnerving me.

I neither like or trust it.

Too much control of the many by the few.

 

[Kathor1]

Big brother is watching aspect of Covid passports is unnerving me. I neither like or trust it. Too much control of the many by the few.

You don't have to worry about the EU DGC certificates as they are only for EU citizens and residents or are you worrying on our behalf? The certificates are not obligatory.

PS: Apologies to @alexwalker. Each time I write "EU" I have a bad conscience. I try to keep it short and simple. Otherwise I would have to explicitly include Norway, Iceland, Liechtenstein and Switzerland; exclude Denmark who can decide within 6 months whether they want to participate or not; exclude Ireland where I have no idea what they will be doing.

 

[trecile]

I agree, @C clearly, yet my intent was not to sow any discord, but only sharing my personal frustration and opinion at the continually changing information.
When I said experimental, I only used the word because for now the vaccines are not yet FDA(Food and Drug Administration) approved as far as I can tell...they are only AEU by the FDA for now; Authorized for Emergency Use. I am not saying they have no benefit and I do plan to be vaccinated.
You can check the FDA's website.
https://www.fda.gov/emergency-prepa...virus-disease-2019-covid-19/covid-19-vaccines
Including is this page I have copied from their website from this April. I will not comment nor debate further.
View attachment 98220

I wouldn't equate Emergency use with Experimental. They are not synonyms.

I'm happy to have a slightly sore arm today after my second Pfizer jab yesterday!

 

[Camino Chrissy]

I wouldn't equate Emergency use with Experimental. They are not synonyms.

You make a very good point, @trecile!
That said, they both do start with an "E"!

 

[alexwalker]

PS: Apologies to @alexwalker. Each time I write "EU" I have a bad conscience.

No problem. Am happy not to be an EU member, just associated, with some benefits, but several disadvantages. But end of politics.

 

[nycwalking]

You don't have to worry about the EU DGC certificates as they are only for EU citizens and residents or are you worrying on our behalf? The certificates are not obligatory.

PS: Apologies to @alexwalker. Each time I write "EU" I have a bad conscience. I try to keep it short and simple. Otherwise I would have to explicitly include Norway, Iceland, Liechtenstein and Switzerland; exclude Denmark who can decide within 6 months whether they want to participate or not; exclude Ireland where I have no idea what they will be doing.

The Covid passports are being rolled out all over the world.

That’s my concern.

Maybe I am being a worrywart but there it is.

 

[Kathor1]

The Covid passports are being rolled out all over the world.

True. But the level of data protection are not the same everywhere, and neither is the technology that is being used.

 

[nycwalking]

True. But the level of data protection are not the same everywhere, and neither is the technology that is being used.

My point exactly.

 

[Kathor1]

My point exactly.

You mean to say that you worry about all the systems and technologies of all the "vaccination passports" in all the countries of the world? Wow. I'am a lot more selective with the stuff I am worrying about.

 

[peregrina2000]

Though this EU covid passport thread has lasted a lot longer than its US covid passport counterpart thread, this one is now drifting into topics other than factual reporting. When more factual information becomes available, members should feel free to start another thread and we’ll keep our fingers crossed that it stays on track.