Compostela certificate

[Former member 22438]

can anybody explain the antique latin text on the Compostela certificate, issued by the Cathedral of Santiago as handed over by the Pilgrim office after acomplishing any camino ?

Specially because I noticed that on my two earlier Compostelas my name is written in a certain latin form. difficult to explain in English but being Dutch we have a certain way to write names and proverbs differently in the context of the text. As the Germans do in a more extended way as we do and as far as I am informed Slavic languages like Russian have these way of forming their sentences too. The antique latin language as spoken by the Romans has this way of writing to.In modern latin languages like Spanish ,French, Portuguese etc this has been disappeared.

On my first two Compostelas and seen some from other pilgrims , my name Albert is written in the Compostela text "Albertum"
On the last issued Compostela earlier this month the person who wrote out my Compostela took over the name as being written on my passport which is Albertus. My wife's name on her ID is Neeltje which is distracted from the name Cornelia.

The first time in 2013 they looked at my name and compared it with the same name in their computer as they did with the name of my wife. On her earlier Compostela after searching in the computer the employee decided to fit in her name in the text ad being "Corneliam"
Last year Peregrina2000 aka Laurie Reynolds was writing out our Compostelas, being volunteer at the Pilgrims office and did the same as the year before and checked the computer.
I doubt if the desk employee did his job right by just taken over our names from the ID documents.
Anybody has sense of this not important item but just wondering why.
Thanks in advance
Albertinho
.

 

[Former member 22438]

If I understand correctly, you refer to noun cases? The fact that a word such as a noun, name or pronoun changes depending on whether it is nominative, genitive, dative, accusative or a few others, depending on the language? Like for the Latin name Albertus, which could also be Alberti, Alberto, Albertum, Alberto and Alberte? And you wonder why it was Albertum in earlier years and now Albertus?

I am sure someone has the answer as I don't but meanwhile I found this interesting blog, written by a forum member, http://johnniewalker-santiago.blogspot.be/2009/07/they-write-your-name-in-latin.html which sheds some light on what is in their computer.

Thank you for your answer Katharina
Exactly Noun case. my nameAlbertus should be deverted to Albertum in the text written on the Compostela certificate I think.

 

[Scott Sweeney]

A little off topic but I'm still trying to figure out why our names were not written in Latin on our Compostela this year. The four previous ones were but not this june. Of course I didn't closely look at the time until we walked outside and the line was too long to go back.

 

[GettingThere]

I got my Compostela this week and they wrote it with with a Latin ending - my name is Amanda (which is Latin anyway but don't get me started on that) and it was written as "Amandam" - which is the correct noun ending to fit into the sentence it's part of, as mentioned above. They explained that they only do this for names that will fit with the Latin, otherwise they just write them as they appear on your credenciale, which is what they did with my mother's name. Which doesn't explain why your name was written differently to previous years - maybe different people in the Pilgrims Office with different understanding of how it works?

 

[Scott Sweeney]

Thought about that but both of us went to two different people in pilgrims office. Oh well

 

[Former member 22438]

Oh, but that is totally on topic. IF they do no longer write the names in Latin and IF Albertinho's name is Albertus in his Dutch ID, then it would explain why they wrote Albertum in previous years and why they wrote Albertus in 2015.

Maybe the deskemployee was fed up about the lines in the courtyard.
He was irritated because my video camera was running-and told me to stop what I did inmediately. I filmed there before the years before. Anyway I am 99% sure he made a mistake on purpose or not.
Thanks for the answer.

 

[t2andreo]

There are several plausible reasons for being "named" incorrectly when your Compostela is issued. Many of the issues can be corrected by attention to detail and proper case usage. So, some of the posters above are correct.

However, I witnessed two entirely different scenarios while working as an Amigo last summer.

The first scenario is where an American pilgrim had a given name that literally had no Latin translation. So, the person writing the Compostela was compelled to use his actual given name. This happens fairly regularly, as contemporary names are sometimes "creative" and without historical basis that would equate to a Latin derivative. It can also occur, when a pilgrim is from a non-Judeo-Christian culture, and has a name that has no Latin equivalent.

The second scenario is where a pilgrim reacts vehemently to the Latin version of their name. Last summer, one German woman, upon seeing that the name on her passport had been translated into it's Latin equivalent, became very agitated declaring to me that "no one has that name...all the people with that name are ugly, old, and have hairy moles...!" Ok, no problem. I advised the young lady to return immediately to the employee who had written her Compostela, and to insert herself after he/she completed the transaction they were now working on. I suggested she tell the office employee that the name indicated was unacceptable and that she preferred the name on her national passport...problem solved...another satisfied pilgrim...

When I am working the sometimes long queues before people get into the pilgrim office, I regularly tell people to pay attention to the Latin variant of their name that the employee writing Compostela proposes. If they have an issue, THAT is the best time to comment or request and alternative - BEFORE the Compostela is written. I usually recommend they go with the same name as is on their national passport or EU1000 card. I explain that, on my first Camino, and not knowing any better, I came home with my gender changed...

The chap writing my Compostela had the correct name, but got the gender wrong. We got that sorted on my next Camino. But my mother was NOT pleased....

So, the bottom line, is for pilgrims to remain part of the Compostela process, pay attention and POLITELY speak up if you disagree.

I hope this helps.

 

[naplesdon]

Who cares? It's a bloody piece of paper and at least 90% of your name is recognisable.

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

Who cares? It's a bloody piece of paper and at least 90% of your name is recognisable.

Hi, you are so wright it is only a piece of paper . Wish you well, Peter.

 

[Former member 22438]

I dono

Who cares? It's a bloody piece of paper and at least 90% of your name is recognisable.

I don't care. Just wondering. I only noticed that two times they used the same name so it was expected the third time too.

 

[Former member 22438]

There are several plausible reasons for being "named" incorrectly when your Compostela is issued. Many of the issues can be corrected by attention to detail and proper case usage. So, some of the posters above are correct.

However, I witnessed two entirely different scenarios while working as an Amigo last summer.

The first scenario is where an American pilgrim had a given name that literally had no Latin translation. So, the person writing the Compostela was compelled to use his actual given name. This happens fairly regularly, as contemporary names are sometimes "creative" and without historical basis that would equate to a Latin derivative. It can also occur, when a pilgrim is from a non-Judeo-Christian culture, and has a name that has no Latin equivalent.

The second scenario is where a pilgrim reacts vehemently to the Latin version of their name. Last summer, one German woman, upon seeing that the name on her passport had been translated into it's Latin equivalent, became very agitated declaring to me that "no one has that name...all the people with that name are ugly, old, and have hairy moles...!" Ok, no problem. I advised the young lady to return immediately to the employee who had written her Compostela, and to insert herself after he/she completed the transaction they were now working on. I suggested she tell the office employee that the name indicated was unacceptable and that she preferred the name on her national passport...problem solved...another satisfied pilgrim...

When I am working the sometimes long queues before people get into the pilgrim office, I regularly tell people to pay attention to the Latin variant of their name that the employee writing Compostela proposes. If they have an issue, THAT is the best time to comment or request and alternative - BEFORE the Compostela is written. I usually recommend they go with the same name as is on their national passport or EU1000 card. I explain that, on my first Camino, and not knowing any better, I came home with my gender changed...

The chap writing my Compostela had the correct name, but got the gender wrong. We got that sorted on my next Camino. But my mother was NOT pleased....

So, the bottom line, is for pilgrims to remain part of the Compostela process, pay attention and POLITELY speak up if you disagree.

I hope this helps.

Your explanation is very clear to me. Thanks

 

[waveprof]

We got really upset because, without asking, they chsnged our sons Basque name, Kepa, to Pietro to make it Latin. We had no problem with the Latinization, but the transition only works if you accept the Castillian notion that Kepa is Basque for Pedro (Peter). This isn't true in the least. Kepa is a pre Roman and Pre Christian name that means solid as a stone. The Castillian/Spanish word for stone is spelled similar to Pietro (Latin for Pedro/Peter) and thus the connection. I like that the cathedral Latinizes names--I'm a fan of tradition. But they shouldn't force it when doing so is, essentially, taking a political stance on language and culture. But we weren't shocked, most Spaniards on Camino insisted on calling him Pedro, I'm quite sure they meant no harm. Same with the cathedral. But it's something I'll always think about when I look at our compostellas.

 

[Anamya]

The first scenario is where an American pilgrim had a given name that literally had no Latin translation. So, the person writing the Compostela was compelled to use his actual given name. This happens fairly regularly, as contemporary names are sometimes "creative" and without historical basis that would equate to a Latin derivative.

My husband is Australian with Chinese background. At the office, the person even apologized for not being able to translate any part of his name and asked if he was fine having his passport name on the paper.

I got my name in Latin ('Ana' is pretty easy). And our friends in Australia ask "why is you name so different in the compostelana"? Oh, well...

Albertinho, I believe in your case they may have made a mistake. Fortunately, not a 'harmful' one.