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bed bugs 2013

santa666

New Member
Time of past OR future Camino
Camino Frances 2013
Camino Portugues 2018
Camino Portugues 2019
Hello everybody,

I found many discussions about this, but most of them was solved by Permethrin, but I can not find it in Europes stores. Is this problem really so hot on Camino Frances, or are there just few rare cases in concrete albergues? Thank you for answers and sharing your experiences. I will travel from SJPP in half of April.
 
Ideal sleeping bag liner whether we want to add a thermal plus to our bag, or if we want to use it alone to sleep in shelters or hostels. Thanks to its mummy shape, it adapts perfectly to our body.

€46,-
Hi Santa 666
You will probably get many mixed answers to this question depending on people's personal experience. So , for what's its worth , I walked for six weeks sept to oct and didn't see a single bed bug. Mosquitos yes, bed bugs , no. I saw one girl with bites . I came across a lot of hysteria, and paranoia about the little critters, and a lot of people mistaking mosquito bites for bug bites. :)

So, that's one experience....
Buen camino,
Helen
 
We are due to go about the same time. I too have seen so much chatter about bedbugs.
Some people I know just came back from the Camino and said they did see one place when they were doing the bed inspection. They just moved to another place to stay. This was their only time. I am taking a bedbug mat, I couldn't be bothered with the thought. most camping stores have the spray. Its worth it so you don't have to worry so much. It's not so much the bite its the infection possibly after. I only see the badly infected/histamine cases so I cant tell you about the generic reactions.
 
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In 5 Caminos I have not seen a bedbug or been bitten. Touch wood!! Always walked in April /May except in 2010 when I walked the Portuguese in September . I remember in Rubais someone had drawn a bug and left a warning in the day book which panicked some of our lot but none was seen that night(or felt).
 
If you go in summer then there is a very good chance that you could become a victim. I have been bitten in August as well the end of October. It was the inconvenience of washing everything , spraying and putting all the other kit in black rubbish bags out in the sun, as well as feeling that I was a lepper.
When bitten this year , the well trained hospitaleros at Granon took me though the process step by step which was a lot of extra work for them. Looking back I am most greatful to them through at the time I wallowed in self pity and anger - WHY ME!!
A treated personal sheet may help , but the critters can still get in your pack and on your clothes.
I guees that you will have to deal with if it does happen and just get on with it. I cannot say that I had any ill side effects although many people do , again a visit to the Pharmacy or Doc if needed.
In my 10 or so visits to the Camino , I have been bitten only twice and never during my spring visits so you can see that it is not a forgone conclusion.
Summing up - deal with it IF it happens , and remember that a five star hotel in no guarantee , it can happen anywhere.
 
During my camino in sept/oct 2011, it was a problem. When I arrived in León, a lot of pilgrims were bitten. I heard from two sources that lesser bed bugs were noticed during the summer/autumn 2012 compared with the situation in 2011.

If I would do the camino again - as a preventive action - I would procure some big closed "airplane" plastic bags where I would put a) some fresh clothes and b) put permanent all my electronic devices - because washing those and/or spraying those and/or putting those in +55°C is not OK.

I would also avoid the albergues (Astorga, Villafranca del Bierzo,...) where several bad reports were generated by different members.
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
I have been given advice from a few people who have done the Camino a few times each.
They said to put my pack in a big clear plastic bag at night and seal it. The little critters may not get you in bed, but they can get to your pack on the floor.
I will be taking a chemically treated mat/sheet and a plastic bag for my pack. I don't need to be told twice.
:)
 
GunnarW said:
.............I would also avoid the albergues (Astorga, Villafranca del Bierzo,...) where several bad reports were generated by different members.
They can occur anywhere........ we as Pilgrims carry them. :mrgreen:
 
We found a couple of bed bugs walking across a bed at one of the more expensive private places we stayed. (Even though I always gave a cursory check to the beds in every room.) We were moved to a different room, and put all possible clothes through the laundry. A few days later I developed 5 bites, but since the reaction can be delayed by a number of days, one can never be sure when they occured.

I think bedbug control is one more reason to pack very lightly and to organize the contents carefully. The biggest concern is not to bring them home (mature bugs, eggs OR larvae). Before flying home, I organized my backpack so I could easily remove all washables and put them straight into the machine, I wiped down a few things like shoes and electronics, and everything else went into the freezer at -18C for a week.
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
Santa 666,
The last problem you will have is bed bugs , please believe me.
Just have a good look .
They have appeared in Madrid , Washington, Sydney and Paris.

We have completed 5 different camino's [ and failed with a bad knee on another ] and my wife found that by taking pillow cases instead of plastic bags we became more confident of avoiding this problem.
Clothes were in compartments and when they were washed so was the pillow case containing them.

The worst sound will be someone in a rush , WHY , at 5.30 am with the plastic bag.
On the Le Puy camino many pensions placed our bags in a rubbish liner , it was compulsory.

* Is 666 the 6th month of 66 born.
Say yes and the kids pay , say no , and i'm short a few dollars.

It's a great 5-6 weeks enjoy.
David
 
Dear friends,
thanks for many replyes, I was already scared about this problem, but now is better, I hope that my only problem will be totaly tired, and I will not bring any unvanted travelers... now is time to set up my plans, and start looking for tickets and another "important" thinks...

Thank you and maybe we will meet us somewhere on the way.

Denis
 
Train for your next Camino on California's Santa Catalina Island March 16-19
Well, must've been a combination of bed bugs loving me and bad luck, but I got them twice in 6 weeks from SJPP to Santiago (September/October 2012). I consider myself an unwilling expert now. I've concluded that I got them the first time in the big, very comfortable and friendly albergue at Azofra. I'm not certain because I did stay at Granon the following night but they wipe down all the mattresses every morning with disinfectant. I've concluded that it is often the blankets which also harbour the mites, so even if the mattresses are treated, you can get them from blankets. The second time I got them was probably in the main albergue (with the courtyard) in Mansilla de las Mulas; unfortunate because it is also a very friendly, fun place.

How to treat the buggers? Hot wash and dry everything that can be; everything else -I mean everything, iphone case, backpack, toilet bag...-into a big plastic bag and spray the crap out of it (into it!) and tie up for a few hours. You'll need a considerate pilgrim buddy to lend you some clothes while this is happening. Try not to touch any of their stuff with your critter-infested stuff though!

Prevention: I met a fellow Aussie who had a lightweight mesh pyrethrum (sp?) treated mattress cover which I will definitely take on my next camino. I would also avoid using blankets anywhere unless in desperation. Buy a bottle of DEET spray and use it around your mattress and pillow each night-I know, it's toxic and awful but if you do it a few hours before sleep it is less smelly. The more concerned an albergue is about pilgrims bringing bedbugs in, the more likely they are not to have them.

Just a note: the giant main albergue as you come into Astorga didn't have begbugs when I was there in October but the other one did (apparently). I arrived with bed bugs at the former and told them before I checked in and they were fantastic-helped me get it all sorted. By the way: there was a pilgrim staying there who admitted he had had bed bugs for 10 days (!!!) and hadn't treated them so he was carrying them with him to each albergue. TREAT YOUR BEDBUGS! Don't pass them on!

Gawd-what a spiel!!
Good luck with not getting them! A lot of people did when I was walking.
Heather
 
It's a little-known statistic that only one in ten people will be bit by bedbugs, if they are there (and they ARE there in some albergues, hostales, and hotels the world over). Just as mosquitoes like some people more than others, bedbugs seem to be fussy. They pose no health threat, but the bites are itchy and the idea of bugs crawling on you in your sleep is downright creepy.

The bigger problem is the ones that hitchhike in your clothes and backpack, as C Clearly said:
C clearly said:
The biggest concern is not to bring them home (mature bugs, eggs OR larvae). Before flying home, I organized my backpack so I could easily remove all washables and put them straight into the machine, I wiped down a few things like shoes and electronics, and everything else went into the freezer at -18C for a week.

Excellent advice. You really don't want these things in your home.
 
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
A S.African pilgrim bought bedbug spray in SJPP before starting her Camino. She sprayed all her clothes + back pack. She used her sprayed sarong as a bed sheet. This worked for her as some of her fellow pilgrims got bitten but she escaped. Her Camino was April 2012. I will start my Camino on 3 May 2013 and hope to meet you somewhere on the route. Bueno Camino
 
Buy a bottle of DEET spray and use it around your mattress and pillow each night
While that might keep the bugs away from that part of your mattress and pillow, it won't keep them from biting you! DEET is a repellent, not an insecticide. You have to put it on yourself for it to do anything. If you are going to endure the toxicity of DEET, use it right. :D
 
i am one of the one in ten and gets bitten, on both my caminos, mosquitos don't like me bedbugs do.

Maybe the bedbugs bite some of the remaining nine, I wouldn't know not everybody develops the allergic reaction.

They may be in your stuff even if you swear you have never come across one, they may not be.

I have noticed that a lot of people who swear that bed bugs on the Camino is not an issue were walking outside the bed bug season.

They are an issue, just not enough of one to not go.

Buen Camino
 
Get a spanish phone number with Airalo. eSim, so no physical SIM card. Easy to use app to add more funds if needed.
They are an issue, just not enough of one to not go.
Your point is well-taken. I shall include it in my new book, "Things I Worried About, But Should Not Have." Another chapter will be "Crowds on the Camino." :wink:

There is plenty to be anxious about leading up to starting a pilgrimage. I always suggest that nervous energy is best used on things you have control over, not the ones you don't. Follow the good advice, and then take some anti-histamine just in case (something you have control over).
 
I will be careful on my Camino, however they are just another critter to suck blood, mosquito and tax man are just two others. Let's not forget who carries these things around .
 
HeatherWriter said:
Well, must've been a combination of bed bugs loving me and bad luck, but I got them twice in 6 weeks from SJPP to Santiago (September/October 2012). I consider myself an unwilling expert now. I've concluded that I got them the first time in the big, very comfortable and friendly albergue at Azofra. I'm not certain because I did stay at Granon the following night but they wipe down all the mattresses every morning with disinfectant. I've concluded that it is often the blankets which also harbour the mites, so even if the mattresses are treated, you can get them from blankets.

I worked as a hospitalera at Granon from 1 October to 15 October, and I can assure you that the bedbug problem is taken very seriously there. Not only were the mattrasses disinfected every day but they were also treated with a special bedbug spray, and the blankets were also sprayed on a regular basis. We went to great lengths every day to take preventative measures, and sprayed all around the dormitories, and in every nook and cranny - especially around warm places close to the bathrooms. We did have 2 pilgrims arriving with signs of bedbug bites, and we immediately swung into action and followed the standard procedures.
 
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I've seen them crawling in Azofra, unfortunately.
It was in the large municipal, not the parochial (which I believe is closed down now?)

I sprayed the mattresses, as I always do, and bedbugs came running out.
I tested 3 rooms before I got one without bugs.

I saw a great way to treat for bedbugs this year, and I wish the albergues would do it.
You put a container of some kind, just a jar lid works, full of insecticide powder under each bed leg.
As long as the bed is not touching the wall, it seems to work because the bugs won't crawl through the powder to get onto the bed.

Anyway.. my bet would be it was Azofra where you got bitten.
I do love that albergue, just don't like it's bugs!
 
the parochial (which I believe is closed down now?)
I think it opens for the off-season. I stayed in it last March when the municipal was still closed. No bed bugs at that time of year! (too cold)
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
Anniesantiago said:
I've seen them crawling in Azofra, unfortunately.
It was in the large municipal ........................ Anyway.. my bet would be it was Azofra where you got bitten.
I do love that albergue, just don't like it's bugs!
Yup , chances are this was where I was bitten in October 2012. :(
 
I also became an expert on bedbug inspection, eradication and psychological counselling for the afflicted victims when I worked as a hospitalero in Zamora in November. I had worked in Granon in May and treated the albergue over 4 days as part of the SOP. I sprayed Biokill ( a relatively mild pesticide ) over the albergue on day one, on one side of the sleeping mats on day two and then turned them all over, on the new top side on day three and turned them again and mopped over where I sprayed on day two and then repeated the mat turning and mopping one last day. We did not have any cases reported to us although bedbugs are most active at 4 a.m. and the anesthetic/anticoagulent they inject before sucking lasts for about 4 hours so the pilgrims may have been down the road before they felt the effects (and I understand only about half of victims show a reaction at all).

I was quite cocky that we had it solved but a stay as a hospitalero in Zamora was a quite a different story. We only had 31 pilgrims over a half month (less than our daily average in Granon) but fall is a much worse time for bedbugs as they thrive at temperatures between 20 and 30 degrees C (68 F to 86 F for those of you from the one country in the world that likes to hold on to the British Imperial system). Therefore the fall is worse and on the Via de la Plata the pilgrims have few to no options as to where to stay and some albergues are granjas de chinches.

Some people also noted that you can get them in hotels as one bugshocked peregrina was sure of her infestation happened staying with her mother in one in Salamanca. We treated her with a chance to eradicate, an extra day's stay to make sure this happened and a reading of "Ode to a Bedbug" and lots of assurance that it could happen to anyone.

This really turned out to be true when my hospitalera partner got bitten on three successive nights. The first time we were not absolutely sure, the second time we were so we changed her room and treated her abode. However she was bitten in the new room as well.

Research found that they can travel up to 30 m (almost 100 feet) a night and seek us out by looking for our heat and humidity. Bug repellants work less effectively on them so I doubt that using Deet is worth its potential health risk.

This brings me to the most important point. Bedbugs will not kill you. Prolonged exposure to strong pesticides (agricultural workers, etc.) has been linked to Parkinson's disease and cancer. I challenged our supervisor in Granon and raised this as an issue at the Hospitalero Encuentro after I heard that hospitaleros had been instructed to apply it daily there. Marina assured me that Biokill is a mild pesticide (and indeed it is only advertised to be effective for a month compared to what we used in Zamora that said you would be bedbug free for over a year). She also said this was approved for domestic use and the health inspectors required this. Overspraying may also be problematic if you create the situation where the bedbugs develop a tolerance or immuntiy. I understand some researchers are investigating the possibility of using a fungus that is 100% lethal against bedbugs. I hope if used it will not have any negative health effects on humans. By the way bed bugs were largely eliminated from our homes by the application of DDT proving that some cures are worse than the disease.

I know protocols are important but will not keep the albergue bug free of course because the pilgrims kept bringing them through the door in their belongings. However our succcessors in Zamora up to a month later reported that they had not had any new cases. The recommended spraying schedule I have seen is every ten days because this is how long it takes for the eggs to hatch.

Also as adults we can use certain chemicals that do not pass the skin barrier (although we should be using masks and gloves) but children do not have this protection.

There have been some good comments already about looking for the "black pepper" fecal material as well as the different stages. To treat the albergue in Zamora we used pesticide as our ultimate weapon, but also sprayed with alcohol but were somewhat concerned with flamability (where some of our pilgrims believe that smoking in the albergue is their right). We also bought an iron which we left behind both to steam the sleeping bags, beds and mattresses as well as to siron clothes. Heat over 45 degrees C (oh you figure it out in F) is more effective than cold apparently.

Now that I have made you all itchy I will close. I wrote a summary for Canadian hospitaleros that I will get posted on our blog. http://canadianhospitaleros.blogspot.ca/
 
I've posted about this previously. I did carry bed bugs home from Europe on one of my trips. Getting rid of them when you didn't know you carried them home is a much bigger problem then worrying about getting bit. It cost me big time to get rid of them. I did read one post here mentioning putting their things in a pillow case. This will not protect you from bed bugs unless it is a bed bug proof case. Regular pillow cases are a good home for bed bugs. I plan on taking very little items this time and disposing of them before coming home. Not taking the chance.

The other option which was mentioned here is placing your items in a plastic bag. That is fine, but they may hitchhike on you too. Best thing is to take precautions after you get home. They die about 120 degrees Fahrenheit. Once you get home, place everything in a plastic bag and seal with duck tape and if its hot, keep out in the sun for a week. If its not hot, don't open for 6 months. Then they will die.

ENJOY your trip and don't worry about the bugs. You can't usually see them, and the bites rarely get infected unless you scratch scratch scratch. Most people don't even know they were bit. It usually takes a while before you develop a reaction to their bites. They actually inject a numbing agent in your skin before they bite so you don't feel it. As I said, I've had the problem, but intend to ignore them and enjoy myself. Since I am going in March it may not be as big of a problem.
 
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Thank you Tom Friesen for your detailed post.
If every albergue should act like Grañon, Zamora and some others... the problem of bedbugs could be reduced. For the moment, some albergues really don't care and this is wrong! It has also no sense that Grañon is spraying daily if Azofra doesn't take an action.
I would prefer to pay some euro's more / night to contribute to a general action plan to reduce bedbugs.
And for the moment, more then 50% of the peregrinos never heard of bedbugs before they start their camino. A pitty. To be informed is a good start. It would be nice if this subject can be set in the top FAQ.
 
max44 said:
I will be careful on my Camino, however they are just another critter to suck blood, mosquito and tax man are just two others. Let's not forget who carries these things around .

Lawyers . . . any present company excluded.
 
koilife said:
Lawyers . . . any present company excluded.
My daughter is a lawyer. lol..She just told me they won't get bitten out of professional mutual respect. lol something like that.
 
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I walked the CF in end of September and October of 2012 and right after Sarria I fell victim to a massive amount of bed bug bites. I learned the following lessons:

1. No one dies from bed bug bites and I probably did more health damage with the amount of wine and that delicious herbal drink I consumed over 7+ weeks! :D

2. The bites freaked me out but it was a "head thing" so by the 4th day and a half dozen creams I decided I had to start sleeping again and forget about the bites. I did the usual washing of all gear and threw away what could not be washed. BUT THE BEST ADVICE I received is getting Benadryl and taking a dose before bed each night. This took care of the swelling and itching. After a few nights bug bites were gone and because of the Benadryl I suffered no more.

3. Now my bed bug story is just that... part of the thread of incredible experiences that I was blessed to experience on my Camino.

I will return this spring for my second Camino and believe me I will take the usual bedbug precautions but never again will I worry or panic if I get a few bites from the little critters!

Bobbie
Sedona, AZ

Ps: agree with plastic bag when you return home.
 
Sedona2012 said:
I walked the CF in end of September and October of 2012 .............. I will return this spring for my second Camino.
Returning after a few months - the bug certainly did bite? :mrgreen: :arrow:
 
RENSHAW said:
Sedona2012 said:
I walked the CF in end of September and October of 2012 .............. I will return this spring for my second Camino.
Returning after a few months - the bug certainly did bite? :mrgreen: :arrow:

The bug sure did bite me and hard! :o
Now trying to decide if I need to hike the Mesta (skipped on the first trip, long story) or walk the Norte. Leaving April first. Any suggestions or opinion welcomed!
 
3rd Edition. More content, training & pack guides avoid common mistakes, bed bugs etc
Pieces said:
some of us actually find the meseta to be one of the best bits of the Camino...

Might be why I am drawn back to the Meseta... Feel like a part is missing that must be completed.
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
hi
I am walking the Camino alone starting in Saint Jean on 10 April 2013, this post has made me for the first time, not want to go!

are they really that bad!?

help!

Caroline
 
Please do not worry about bed bugs! I walked the Camino Frances and Portugual route Sept and Oct 2012 and I was the only one that was bit by bed bugs out of the many pilgrims I met on the trail.

My advice is to google on this site how to treat your clothing, sleeping bag and backpack then go on your Camino and do not worry. If bitten wash everything in hot water and place in dryer. I even put my backback in the dryer. If u are experiencing any itching or swelling take Benadryl every night until better.

My Camino was the best thing I have ever done for myself and I would hate to think of you missing out over this issue.

Buen Camino!

Bobbie

cpstar said:
hi
I am walking the Camino alone starting in Saint Jean on 10 April 2013, this post has made me for the first time, not want to go!

are they really that bad!?

help!

Caroline
 
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I haven't found them as bad in the spring as they are in the fall.
 
I'm planning on treating my pack, sleeping bag, sheet (with pillowcase sewn on) and travel pillow with the permethrin before setting out on my Camino. Don't want the little critters ruining a once in a lifetime experience.
 
Please, please do not let the idea of bedbugs stop you from walking the Camino. For many, including myself, it has been one of the best experiences of my life.
I have walked the Camino Frances twice, both in Sept and Oct when it is reasonable to expect bedbugs to be around. On both Caminos I was bitten around the wrist at Meson El Acebo at Acebo (I am a slow learner), and they were a mild irritant for a couple of days. However, one lady I met was badly bitten at the same albergue, but bought some cream at a local pharmacy which helped greatly, and a mosquito spray which kept the bugs at bay. If you do get bitten, go to a pharmacy, as they know all about the problem. But please do not let this stop you from walking. David
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
We never had any problems with bed bugs but a couple of our friends did. Both instances happened in Galicia where we noticed the habit of using plastic mattress coverings wasn't used. This was common practice early on in the Camino and, might just be coincidence, but no one we knew got any.
 
Pyrithrians are found in most flying insect sprays. It's a organic compound made from a plant found in South America. Try to get one that lists it as the primary ingredient. Bed bugs like to hide in the seams of mattresses. Spray the seams on both sides of the mattress.
 
Train for your next Camino on California's Santa Catalina Island March 16-19
cpstar said:
hi
I am walking the Camino alone starting in Saint Jean on 10 April 2013, this post has made me for the first time, not want to go!

are they really that bad!?

help!

Caroline

To be brutally honest , you best stay at home. You will encounter far more testing experiences on the Camino than a few little bites.
 
I see that 'Jackflap' ( the couple walking the winter Camino with Lewis , their dog) were bitten around the 10th January , a few days back.
 
cpstar said:
hi
I am walking the Camino alone starting in Saint Jean on 10 April 2013, this post has made me for the first time, not want to go!

are they really that bad!?

help!

Caroline

As you can see experiences vary wildly and so will yours. Try to relax and enjoy the Camino and be open for what might happen to you. For sure take normal precautions and use common sense, but don't drive yourself mad ;-)
Buen Camino! SY
 
Train for your next Camino on California's Santa Catalina Island March 16-19
Spray the seams on both sides of the mattress.
Would you like a stranger spraying stuff in your home? Albergues are home to all the pilgrims. Please don't take it as your right to spray anything there. Leave it up to the hospitalero during off-hours. You may be doing something that is lethal to an allergic fellow-pilgrim.
 
I can handle bed bugs , its the wild packs of abandoned dogs that scare the living daylights out of me. :shock:
 
Join the Camino cleanup. Logroño to Burgos May 2025 & Astorga to OCebreiro in June
Via Francigena near Radicofani
That is a bit off the Camino Frances, and this forum section! :D

We have members who have spoken of a fear of dogs. If there is a danger somewhere, I am sure they would like to know. If its a joking matter, they would like to know that, too, I suspect.

Packs of wild dogs are a danger to livestock, so Spanish farmers would take care of them. The occasional mongrel is more likely in a country where dogs seem to outnumber humans.
All domestic pets in Spain must be identified by microchip or by a clearly readable tattoo. The tattoo will only be accepted as a means of identification until 3 July 2011.

Dangerous dogs

Any person owning a potentially dangerous dog (perros potencialmente peligrosos) in Spain must have an appropriate licence (by law of article 3 of the Royal Decree 287/2002, of 22 of March 2002) and the dog must be registered with the municipality. Handlers and walkers of dangerous or potentially dangerous dogs must also be licenced (article 1, 2 of Law 50/1999, of December 1999). A licence is valid for five years.

Potentially dangerous dog are identified as being in one of three categories:

1) Breeds and breed crosses classified as potentially dangerous:

Doberman (Andalucia only)
Pit Bull Terrier
Staffordshire Bull Terrier
American Staffordshire Terrier
Rottweiler
Dogo Argentino
Fila Brasileiro
Tosa Inu
Akita Inu
UPDATE - May 2012 - The Junta de Andalucia has added Bull terriers, Presa Canarios, Napolitan mastiffs and Boxers to the list. These breeds cannot be taken out in public without a leash and muzzle and must be registered at the town hall.

2) Dogs with certain characteristics of these breeds are also classified as potentially dangerous. The characteristics are:

Strong musculature, powerful or athletic constitution, robustness, agility, vigor and endurance
Short hair
Deep chest (60 to 80 cm), height of over 50 cm and a weight over 20 Kg
Big, square, head, with a wide skull and strong jaws
Broad, short and muscled neck.
Straight, parallel forelegs and muscular hindquarters, relatively long back legs standing at an angle

3) Dogs that have a track record of aggression to humans and other animals must also be licenced and registered.
 
After reading the various replies I will be treating my equipment and clothing with permethrin prior to leaving for my Camino. It seems as if the permethrin is effective for up to 6 weeks. As I will be walking for 3 months I will have to respray along the way. Do you know if permethrin is available in The Puy en Velay or St. Jean Pied de Port?

Thanks

Guy
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
Do you know if permethrin is available in The Puy en Velay or St. Jean Pied de Port?
A search of items in the Decathlon website, the largest sporting goods chain store in France, does not return any results, so it may not be available in France. There is a 7 oz. spray bottle of Sawyer that you could take with you. Since Sawyer advertises that permethrin is effective for 6 weeks or 6 washings, I think that it is likely that it lasts longer than six weeks. After all, six washing would remove a lot more of the chemical than the passage of six weeks!
 
RENSHAW said:
If you go in summer then there is a very good chance that you could become a victim. I have been bitten in August as well the end of October. It was the inconvenience of washing everything , spraying and putting all the other kit in black rubbish bags out in the sun, as well as feeling that I was a lepper.
When bitten this year , the well trained hospitaleros at Granon took me though the process step by step which was a lot of extra work for them. Looking back I am most greatful to them through at the time I wallowed in self pity and anger - WHY ME!!
A treated personal sheet may help , but the critters can still get in your pack and on your clothes.
I guees that you will have to deal with if it does happen and just get on with it.

Exactly my thought on this topic. (Especially the part where you feel like WHY ME and like a lepper, haha) I have been bitten my only time on the camino, and I dare say it was bad - I had a huge allergic reaction. After the panicking the nuns in Léon helped me calm down and through the cleaning process. Not a big deal. I recommend you just don't think about it. When the bedbugs 'like' you, you'll get bitten anyway (spray or no spray), but it's not the end of the world.

If you want to take preventions however, I wouldn't recommend a spray (it's mass and weight). Wash your clothes regularly above 60 degrees (it is possible in a lot of albergues) and pack your backpack with the stuff divided over several plastic bags. Keep the clothes that you've worn (they might be 'infected' with the bugs) from the ones you didn't wear.

But really, don't worry, it only makes you're camino less enjoyable.
Buen camino!
 
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Hi
Has anyone used the Lifesystem Bed Bug Undersheet?? It only weighs 100g so is an attractive alternative to another bed bug sheet I've found, but which weighs 600g...

thoughts would be very appreciated!
 
cpstar said:
Hi
Has anyone used the Lifesystem Bed Bug Undersheet?? It only weighs 100g so is an attractive alternative to another bed bug sheet I've found, but which weighs 600g...

thoughts would be very appreciated!
I saw this link a while back. el-camino-frances/topic13650.html
If you do a search, using the search bar at the top, there has been some feedback.
 
Thanks Max44, I've actually seen this - but noone actually says if its any good!!

thanks again,
Caroline
 
A selection of Camino Jewellery
I like a bit more overhang myself. I make my own. I use an extra large sarong type material and use chemicals. As I am not laying directly on it, I am not worried. I dilute the concentration as I make a new one each time for other locations. The Camino is not the only place in the world with bugs or other critters. Even where I live now, mosquitoes carry debilitating diseases.
I never really get sick of bitten on trips, but I do carry the gear with me. You can get sprays for the beds, however, it's unfair to those who may be sensitive to chemicals. A lot of people seem to have become hyper-sensitive to most things.
PM me if you want to make your own..it's easy. Unless you want something that will last for years... mine are good for a few months as i use minimal chemicals
 
I am travelling the Camino Frances in May & June 2013. I'll be staying in hotels rather than Auberges. Does anyone know if the bedbug problem is also a problem in Hotels? If so, is it wise to be prepared & travel with appropriate products?
Thanks for your replies in advance :)
 
Walked from St. Jean to Burgos in October. Didn't even think about the possibility of bedbugs and didn't come across any, staying In municipal alberques.
 
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A question for the bed bugs experts -- I have walked every year since 2000, usually in May/June. I have been bitten by bedbugs only once, in the Zafra albergue on the Vdlp.

People on the forum have said that bed bugs only bite a select lucky few. Does the fact that I've been bitten once mean that I am one of those that the bed bugs are likely to go for (because of some feature that only those little creatures can discern), or is it more of a random thing? Or is it more likely that since I don't walk in high summer, the odds are lower?

Thanks, buen camino, Laurie
 
Lise T said:
It was recenlty recommend to me ....a natural product that is used on pets for fleas. :shock:
Its made up of:

Sunflower Oil, Neem Oil and essential oils of Cedarwood, Rosemary, Lemongrass, Thyme and Peppermint.

Im wondering if anyone has tried or heard of anything like this working?
A buddy of mine tried that once. The bedbugs didn't bite, but the bear sure had good breath the next morning! :wink:
 
healthytoo said:
I am travelling the Camino Frances in May & June 2013. I'll be staying in hotels rather than Auberges. Does anyone know if the bedbug problem is also a problem in Hotels? If so, is it wise to be prepared & travel with appropriate products?
Thanks for your replies in advance :)
YES! Very experienced hospitalero friends of ours, who volunteer yearly at the Refugio Guacelmo and who follow a very strict protocol as regards cleaning the Albergue, picked up bed bugs in a hotel in Santiago! It stands to reason that as Pilgrims sometimes switch from albergues, Pensions and sometimes a Hotel, there is always a chance of the bed bugs moving also from place to place. Frankly, I would imagine that most Albergues do a more rigorous cleaning job each morning than a chambermaid in a hotel or pension. Anne
 
Train for your next Camino on California's Santa Catalina Island March 16-19
I brought the bedbug sheet this summer and was bitten. One thing I noticed is that it states that the permetrine wears of but the sheet doesn't come with and expiration date (go figure)...
 
Lise T said:
It was recenlty recommend to me ....a natural product that is used on pets for fleas. :shock:
Its made up of:

Sunflower Oil, Neem Oil and essential oils of Cedarwood, Rosemary, Lemongrass, Thyme and Peppermint.

Im wondering if anyone has tried or heard of anything like this working?

Bed bugs are attracted to the CO2 in your breath and your body warmth. As nice as these natural oils sound, they have never be proven to be effective in a lab, sorry, SY
 
Pieces said:
I brought the bedbug sheet this summer and was bitten. One thing I noticed is that it states that the permetrine wears of but the sheet doesn't come with and expiration date (go figure)...
Terry's original bug resistant bag-liner came with a note that it was effective for 20 washes. If there is a number in the name it might be an indication of how much washing it will take before the repellent is ineffective.
 
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
I've walked on various Caminos every year for the last 8 years anywhere from 2 to six weeks. I have never been bitten by a bedbug or run into someone who had.

Unusual? Lucky? Maybe the little critter just don't find me attractive?

Who knows?

My advice - be vigilent but don't let it distract you from the joys of planning, walking and communal living!
 
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
Tia Valeria said:
Pieces said:
I brought the bedbug sheet this summer and was bitten. One thing I noticed is that it states that the permetrine wears of but the sheet doesn't come with and expiration date (go figure)...
Terry's original bug resistant bag-liner came with a note that it was effective for 20 washes. If there is a number in the name it might be an indication of how much washing it will take before the repellent is ineffective.

mine said XX washes OR i think it was 1 or 2 years....
 
On 3 Caminos I never had a problem, but last summer I was bitten very badly in Roncesvalles, not in the albergue, but in the expensive hotel next door. I had a very bad reaction and had quite a time of it. The lesson here is that these things can be anywhere. I recommend checking for them whenever you encounter a new bed. Look under and around the corners of the mattress. That is where they will be hiding. If you see them, report them and get yourself to another place to stay.
Put your mind to rest, and enjoy your Camino.
 
i went 5 weeks walking from Roncenvalles to Santiago and not a single problem. Encountered about 4 people along the way who did get bites--who never lodged at the same location that i did. some had severe hystamine reactions.

...and then, I took the bus from Santiago to Finnisterre and I'm fairly convinced that I picked up bed bugs when my packed was loaded on the bus with about 100 other packs. I washed everything after the bite-night, and since it was the end of my trek bought new clothes.

...and then, when I returned home to the states, found one lone uber-strong sucker STILL in the bottom of my pack!! i was shocked actually. and i didn't mess around when i cleaned my gear in spain. they are nasty little guys.

i don't think there's reason to fret, but the general "hysteria" about them is due to the fact that it is quite awful to be bitten and they are staunchly difficult to rid yourself of. my lesson here: i was vigilant checking out where i stayed, but it never occurred to me the bus could be a problem. it also makes me wonder about the folks who have their bags transported daily.
 
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I've been reading more and more about bed bugs and it's a little disconcerting. Mosquitoes love me so I'm wondering if bed bugs will be a serious issue.

I did a litte research on Permethrin and here is what I found....

Permethrin is a common synthetic chemical, widely used as an insecticide, acaricide, and insect repellent. It belongs to the family of synthetic chemicals called pyrethroids and functions as a neurotoxin, affecting neuron membranes by prolonging sodium channel activation. It is not known to rapidly harm most mammals or birds, but is dangerously toxic to cats and fish. In general, it has a low mammalian toxicity and is poorly absorbed by skin.

I'm trying to decide what is worse, the bed bugs, or the chemical.

Does anyone have any alternative methods to keep the BB's away. Herbal mixture or something less toxic?
Thanks so much.
 
annakappa said:
YES! Very experienced hospitalero friends of ours, who volunteer yearly at the Refugio Guacelmo and who follow a very strict protocol as regards cleaning the Albergue, picked up bed bugs in a hotel in Santiago! It stands to reason that as Pilgrims sometimes switch from albergues, Pensions and sometimes a Hotel, there is always a chance of the bed bugs moving also from place to place. Frankly, I would imagine that most Albergues do a more rigorous cleaning job each morning than a chambermaid in a hotel or pension. Anne

I walked the whole Camino staying mainly in albergues without even seeing a single bed bug and was starting to think they were a myth. Then I too found one while staying in a hotel in Santiago. It was crawling along my arm while I was sitting in bed reading. Then I saw its mate hiking across my blanket. That caused me to strip the bed and look at all of my own gear but they were an attack force of two only.

I agree that the albergues probably take more care. I changed hotels after a restless night.
 
3rd Edition. More content, training & pack guides avoid common mistakes, bed bugs etc
Linda T said:
A S.African pilgrim bought bedbug spray in SJPP before starting her Camino. She sprayed all her clothes + back pack. She used her sprayed sarong as a bed sheet. This worked for her as some of her fellow pilgrims got bitten but she escaped. Her Camino was April 2012. I will start my Camino on 3 May 2013 and hope to meet you somewhere on the route. Bueno Camino

Hi, I start on the 2nd of May and stay in Orrison for the first night.
Hope to see you along the way.

Regards,

Darren
 
I start my Camino on the 12th April. If I don't get blisters, thirsty or bitten by bed bugs, I will feel like I have missed out. Since the bugs are attracted to CO2, I will sleep next to a mouth breather. :)
 
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I am going to take a Perythrin treated twin fitted sheet. I see a lot of people recommend a silk sheet. Those are very expensive. Can you take a satin sheet instead? I did not know if there was less weight, or a tighter weave to the fabric of silk that made it preferable to other fabrics. To me, satin sheets are a cheaper version of silk.... Can anyone recommend a place to buy the appropriate twin fitted sheet online in the USA? I remember reading a post about fitted sheets, but cannot find it again.
 
No encounters whatsoever during my March 2013 Camino Frances, also with regard to some of the locations mentioned earlier.
My advice: always check the mattress you will be sleeping on.
 
Last year, Falcon (I think?) told me about a product you can buy and use. It is a permethrin liquid made by Sawyer. You can get it at REI in the USA or order it online or go to a farm supply store.

I went to a charity shop (Goodwill) and bought a pair of sheer curtains for $2.
I then washed the curtains in the Sawyers.
It worked great.

I actually ended up not taking mine because there is a smell and I'm highly sensitive.
But I can see that this would be a very inexpensive way to go if you were worried about bedbugs.

I have a good blog on bedbugs - helping you identify whether or not they're there, and the process I use to determine if I'll sleep in a place or not. You can find it by Googling Annie's Simple Life Bedbugs.
 
Train for your next Camino on California's Santa Catalina Island March 16-19
If you treat your sleeping bag with Permetherin that should help quite a bit. It does have a bit of a smell, so if you are sensitive to some smells there are other alternatives. There is a silk liner that is already treated to repeal bedbugs. It's called the "Cocoon Insect Shield Safari Silk Rectangular Bag", and I bought mine online at Campmor:http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___45969
It weighs only 5.6 oz and costs $69.99 (U.S.) This is what it looks like:
45969.jpg


Ultreia!

Mary
 
Hi, Mary,
I have been toying with the idea of getting something like the sheet you bought. But I looked at the product description and it talks about ticks, mosquitos, ants, flies, flees, chiggers, and no-see-ums. But no mention of bedbugs.

Do you know what the ingredients are in the "insect shield protection?"

Thanks, Laurie
 
Hi Laurie,

Yes, Insect Shield is actually a formulation of the insect repellent Permethrin which results in effective, odorless insect protection. Bedbugs are susceptible to products containing pyrethroid insecticides such as Permethrin and studies show the effectiveness of Permethrin on bedbugs. I just looked at a survey that in Gambia Africa Permethrin-impregnated bed nets were responsible for the disappearance of bedbugs.

My husband David who is not only a "gear geek" and has helped to reduce my backpacking weight considerably, is also an avid researcher. He will not buy anything until he speaks to the people who actually make the gear/product and is satisfied that it is the best. For that reason I am pretty comfortable and confident that this silk liner is a good choice.

I hope this information helps you Laurie!

Mary
 
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Wonderful! Got Beans?:grin:
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/04/10/sc ... s.xml?f=19

From the article; "Generations of Eastern European housewives doing battle against bedbugs spread bean leaves around the floor of an infested room at night. In the morning, the leaves would be covered with bedbugs that had somehow been trapped there. The leaves, and the pests, were collected and burned — by the pound, in extreme infestations."
 
I am no fan of bedbugs, and hope to find a reliable way to avoid them. Just a word of caution-permethrin works well, but its toxic to most cats and dogs, so if you are going to treat your sheet ( or curtains-love that idea, Annie),do it outside or well away from pets, and don't store the treated items in your pack where pets can be affected by the chemical. Insecticides are residually effective,so don't forget to store your stuff safely away from them when you get home, too.I keep treated items like luggage in the trunk of my car where it can be safely locked out of the way.
 
Bed Bugs are a worry for me too but I cannot bring myself to wrap myself in toxic chemicals every night. Now while, if desperation sets in, I may resort to that I am not making it my default position. So.... after some online research I have made my own natural repellant. It won't kill them but I am hoping it will make me the least attractive pilgrim in a dorm full of bodies. Will let you know how it goes.
 
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LAVENDER is a natural bed bug repellent. If you are going to bring soap and/or any type of body wash, make it lavender-base. Bring a small lavender satch for your luggage/bags; our Grandmas knew better.... :D
 
I cannot bring myself to wrap myself in toxic chemicals every night. Now while, if desperation sets in, I may resort to that I am not making it my default position.
I respectfully disagree with the statement of wrapping yourself in toxic chemicals every night! There has been ample studies about the safe use of permetherin on clothing. On the http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/factsheet ... thing.html site is the following information:

"Permethrin factory-treated clothing is registered in the U.S. by the EPA. In evaluating these products, we follow normal risk assessment procedures to determine safety. Our 2009 revised exposure and risk assessment evaluated multiple exposure scenarios for permethrin factory-treated clothing, including toddlers wearing or mouthing the clothing, and military personnel who wear permethrin-treated uniforms on a daily basis. All exposure scenarios showed that permethrin factory-treated clothing is unlikely to pose any significant acute or chronic hazard to people wearing the clothing.

The amount of permethrin allowed in clothing is very low, and scientific studies indicate that human exposure resulting from wearing permethrin factory-treated clothing also is low. Available data show that permethrin is poorly absorbed through the skin."

The EPA periodically reevaluates all registered pesticides to ensure continued compliance with current scientific and safety standards.

The most recent comprehensive human health risk assessment for all registered uses of permethrin was completed in February 2006 in support of the pesticide’s reregistration.
In revising this assessment in April 2009, we evaluated several factory-treated clothing exposure scenarios including short-term and long-term cancer risks to adults, youth, and toddlers wearing permethrin-treated clothing. We also evaluated toddler object-to-mouth activity on factory-treated clothing. All scenarios resulted in risk estimates below our level of concern.
In June 2011, we initiated a new review, called registration review of all permethrin uses, opening docket EPA-HQ-OPP-2011-0039. We expect to complete the registration review of permethrin in 2017.
For more information
Permethrin page -- http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/chemicalsearch/

Permethrin registration review docket -- EPA-HQ-OPP-2011-0039

Mosquito Control including mosquito repellents -- http://epa.gov/mosquitocontrol/

Pyrethroids and Pyrethrins -- http://www.epa.gov/oppsrrd1/reevaluatio ... hrins.html



I for one am not concerned about this at all. With all the research that has been done over the years to ensure physical safety above all and with the EPA approval, I am satisfied. The effect of bedbug bites on the body is the last thing I want to deal with. Waking up with dozens of itching raised red bite marks on your body. Imagine realizing that your clothing is infested and maybe even your backpack once you stuff in your belongings. Even if you move on to another albergue along the Camino that is pest free, you could be responsible for bringing some of these bloodthirsty bugs along. Worse yet, of taking some of bedbugs home with you in your clothes or luggage.
I have nothing against natural methods to treat different problems; if it is a fact that it works, then theta would be my first choice, without a doubt :). But I want to have peace of mind!

Ultreia!

Mary
 
I'm probably one of the most sensitive persons in the world to chemicals with my MCS. And the smell alone of these sheets make me sick. But for a normal person, they should be no problem.

You are not "wrapping yourself up" in the sheet if you get the kind you just lay on the bed, then put your own sleeping bag on top of.

And for the other people, using it for a few days probably won't hurt most people. Our bodies do a good job of chelating chemicals unless they're broken like mine.

Also, I would not use this with a child (the sleeping bag one) but wouldn't hesitate to put it UNDER their sleeping bag.

I probably would not wrap myself up in a sleepsack, even if I did not have MCS, if it were impregnated with permetrin, but that's just me...

That's just my opinion.
 
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Annie, that is very understandable for you because of your MCS. And I suspect that many smells that most people cannot even detect, you can and would be sensitive to it. Thanks for the information.

Mary
 
Perfect memento/gift in a presentation box. Engraving available, 25 character max.
The industry report on the safety of factory treated permethrin clothing is interesting-but can it be compared to the levels that say, a consumer with a can of the stuff would apply?They may be using safe levels, but how do we know if we are when we treat fabric at home?I know I can get carried away with a can of spray if I'm waging war on the hornets around here, so I have concerns about someone thinking "I'm going to get those bedbugs before they get me" and really soaking their belongings.
 
Hi SisterSimon, addressing your question the only thing I can tell you is that if you apply the Permetherin as directed, first of all it's important to spray outdoors, on a screened porch, a deck, a patio, etc. ensure that you spray until clothing is moist and then let the garments dry outside before folding and packing. I use hangers for every piece of clothing that will be sprayed, socks included. Typically it's good for about 14 days. My husband an I have used this stuff for years, on our pants, shirts socks and on my hat because I do not want any mosquitos, other insects on my face. We haven't had a problem with it at all. So, I hope this gives you a bit of reassurance that you can do it without making a mistake :).

Ultreia!

Mary
 
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