What do pilgrims decide to walk from Porto to Vliarinho ?

[Former member 22438]

What do pilgrims decide to walk from Porto to Vliarinho instead of walking from Porto via Matosinhos and Vila do Conde alongside the coast ?
Ignorance ? The shortest way ?

This track is one of the top two unpleasant walks of the Caminho Portuges ( together with the track from Alverca de Ribatejo to Azambuja ) walking on narrow hardshoulders of motorways, heavy traffic rushing by ,almost touching you.
While there is a very pleasant and safe detour from Porto to Vila do Conde alongside the beautifull Douro river and the Atlantic ocean on a wooden boardwalk.

 

[michryan]

What do pilgrims decide to walk from Porto to Vliarinho instead of walking from Porto via Matosinhos and Vila do Conde alongside the coast ?
Ignorance ? The shortest way ?

This track is one of the top two unpleasant walks of the Caminho Portuges ( together with the track from Alverca de Ribatejo to Azambuja ) walking on narrow hardshoulders of motorways, heavy traffic rushing by ,almost touching you.
While there is a very pleasant and safe detour from Porto to Vila do Conde alongside the beautifull Douro river and the Atlantic ocean on a wooden boardwalk.

I have already decided that I'm taking the coast via Matosinhos. I like to live another day for another adventure.

 

[Dutch]

Why why why...

I woke up and something said to me...not the coast. And so i didn't.

Boy, do i regret listening to my inner self hahaha

Who knows though...maybe it was needed so i could help warn others from making this mistake also, 'cause it sure is the worst route out of a city.....ever!

 

[Diogo92]

I think it's because most of the pilgrims don't read this forum

 

[Me Fein]

I walked the Caminho Portugese april/may 2013 from Lisbon. I walked from Porto to Vilarinho mainly as I live beside the sea but also my "camino family" were walking this way.I have no memories of traffic but then it was May 1st. One of the many things I remember is we were given 2 bags of fruit by a market stall owner and being wished bom caminho by all the stall owners and customers. She also insisted that the man carry the fruit for us ladies. The difficulty I found was the cobblestones but cannot say that I found it unpleasant.I did meet people who walked along the coast they enjoyed it but found it difficult due to strong winds. Just enjoy which ever route you take.

 

[amorfati1]

Here is what a young Czech pilgrim shared with me who had walked the Porto to Vilarinho route:
She did not have a guidebook - and simply followed the yellow arrows, trusting that it would be the best route, since it was the 'official caminho' - She had no idea just how unpleasant and at times terrifying/dangerous some stretches were ... and would not ever recommend it to anyone. she wished she had known about the other route (coastal) or the option to take the metro. -
at one point she was near tears when she recalled some incidences when walking those roads and said: "how can they recommend this route to pilgrims??" -
i had no answer to it - because i knew 100% that i would not trot out of Porto on those roads, no matter how many yellow arrows point that way.

(thus i was introduced to pilgrims who travel the caminho without maps or guidebook.)

 

[another walker]

What do pilgrims decide to walk from Porto to Vliarinho instead of walking from Porto via Matosinhos and Vila do Conde alongside the coast ?
Ignorance ? The shortest way ?

This track is one of the top two unpleasant walks of the Caminho Portuges ( together with the track from Alverca de Ribatejo to Azambuja ) walking on narrow hardshoulders of motorways, heavy traffic rushing by ,almost touching you.
While there is a very pleasant and safe detour from Porto to Vila do Conde alongside the beautifull Douro river and the Atlantic ocean on a wooden boardwalk.

Sounds like this is top class advice. I shall take this route and go inland further north. E sim,so Londrinho,originalamente. Um abraço. Martin

 

[wayfarer]

This route is on my wish list also. My wife and I drove it in 2013 and it was beautiful.

 

[Former member 22438]

Sounds like this is top class advice. I shall take this route and go inland further north. E sim,so Londrinho,originalamente. Um abraço. Martin

Londrinho Brasil ?

 

[Former member 22438]

caminhar no lado da costa e um bom idea !

Londrinho Brasil ?

Um abraço disso lado do mundo

 

[Former member 22438]

Here is what a young Czech pilgrim shared with me who had walked the Porto to Vilarinho route:
She did not have a guidebook - and simply followed the yellow arrows, trusting that it would be the best route, since it was the 'official caminho' - She had no idea just how unpleasant and at times terrifying/dangerous some stretches were ... and would not ever recommend it to anyone. she wished she had known about the other route (coastal) or the option to take the metro. -
at one point she was near tears when she recalled some incidences when walking those roads and said: "how can they recommend this route to pilgrims??" -
i had no answer to it - because i knew 100% that i would not trot out of Porto on those roads, no matter how many yellow arrows point that way.

(thus i was introduced to pilgrims who travel the caminho without maps or guidebook.)

That is what Diogo says Claudia. Lot of people do not know about this forum and even then if they do the majority is interested in the other routes of the camiño. A pity. It is such a beautiful walk through Portugal and the south of Galicia

 

[another walker]

Londrinho Brasil ?

UK.

 

[Former member 22438]

UK.

I think you will like the boardwalk to Vila do Conde. Specially as you start from Porto the walk is great.

London is the place for me ! Will be there again end of september to see some relatives who live there.
The only place with the name Londrinho I know is in the south of Brasil. I know a fellow jazzguitarist who lives there.

 

[mikevasey]

There are two routes out of the city center to Vilarinho one goes for long stretches along a busy highway, which can very stressful and dangerous and the other misses out for the most part this highway walking but goes along narrow cobbled roads where cars fly by and a there is a busy dual carriageway to cross with a central reservation to clamber over and another problem is that as you are considering if you feel sucidal, you become aware that you have restricted views and can see no more than 50 meters as you look left and about 150 meters as you look right which will be the 2nd lanes of traffic you have to contend with once you have got over the middle barriers, Most people jump on the Metro and avoid this bit, if you are starting out from Porto and have limited time then this is the best option.

 

[Former member 22438]

So I cannot understand that these routes are still promoted and nobody says " forget this and walk the Matosinhos to Vila do Conde variant out of Porto"
Brierley, Johnny Walker,Vialusitana do something about it !

 

[Diogo92]

So I cannot understand that these routes are still promoted and nobody says " forget this and walk the Matosinhos to Vila do Conde variant out of Porto"
Brierley, Johnny Walker,Vialusitana do something about it !

Well, I have one thing to say about this: although security it's also a matter for the Pilgrim Associations, so it's the original way. With this, I mean for the pilgrims following the original trace from the first record that we have from the Caminho Português.

We can never forget that, the Caminho Português, it's probably a thing with a major development in the last 10 to 15 years, and when the roads were made, the Caminho already passed in there, but there wasn't really a Caminho for people think that making that road in there, it would mess up with pilgrims lives.
Portugal has a problem: when somebody wants to make things by their own mind, they don't even ask if it's correct. That’s why you have some arrow painting which isn't official, and that confuses pilgrims and sometimes, even Association minds.

It's a thing to see, it's true. This it's only my opinion. We can't forget that in Portugal, the only official Association its Via Lusitana, and that its workers are volunteers, and have to take care of a trace that goes from Lisbon to Valença do Minho. It's a work that it's exhausting because sometimes municipalities create difficulties to their work, and even some terrain owners.

For me, the preferable was that the Albergues previous to Porto, had the opportunity to give that information for Pilgrims. And if possible, that the persons who work in those places, made the Caminho at least 3 times, so that they could know and understand the Caminho.

 

[Former member 22438]

I say " safety first ". We live now and not 800 years ago

 

[Diogo92]

I say " safety first ". We live now and not 800 years ago

I go with the same idea. But there are people who don't. And that's the problem.

One of those cases it's the one that we talked about, the detour in Azinhaga. Why make a detour that will put pilgrims in the middle of nowhere, and that doesn't even has a place to get water!? Just because there is a different political view.

People have internet in these days, and they can know what to expect. I believe that guides also say "You have 2 ways to get out from Porto, one through na Industrial Area, and other through the coast". So it all ends up with people choosing what they think it's the best, but that doesn’t mean that they are making the right choice (like the Czech pilgrim that @amorfati1 talked about).

 

[Former member 22438]

You are right but it is the camino we walk so it is good to let the people know on this forum and beyond what are the risks .
Maybe if more people are going to avoid these risks the officials and organisers get awake
So here is a task for us who walk the camino and tell everybody aboud the good and the bad !

 

[Diogo92]

You are right but it is the camino we walk so it is good to let the people know on this forum and beyond what are the risks .
Maybe if more people are going to avoid these risks the officials and organisers get awake
So here is a task for us who walk the camino and tell everybody aboud the good and the bad !

And the ugly. Don't forget the ugly, or Clint will shoot at you

 

[Former member 22438]

And the ugly. Don't forget the ugly, or Clint will shoot at you

Don't tell about the ugly ! Nobody wants to come anymore

 

[Diogo92]

Don't tell about the ugly ! Nobody wants to come anymore

Na ugly thing for me, could be a beautiful thing for you. Don't judge peoples tastes

 

[shubertj]

I go with the same idea. But there are people who don't. And that's the problem.

One of those cases it's the one that we talked about, the detour in Azinhaga. Why make a detour that will put pilgrims in the middle of nowhere, and that doesn't even has a place to get water!? Just because there is a different political view.

People have internet in these days, and they can know what to expect. I believe that guides also say "You have 2 ways to get out from Porto, one through na Industrial Area, and other through the coast". So it all ends up with people choosing what they think it's the best, but that doesn’t mean that they are making the right choice (like the Czech pilgrim that @amorfati1 talked about).

Albertinho,
What is the detour in Azinhaga?

 

[shubertj]

Albertinho,
What is the detour in Azinhaga?

Sorry it was Diogo 92 comment

 

[Former member 22438]

Albertinho,
What is the detour in Azinhaga?

you follow the path (see picture) from Quinta to Bosque and somewhere in between the path leads now moreless northwards to Pombalinho and follows the the road, my pen is pointing untill you are direction Ponte ! So this detour avoids Azinhaga due to a conflict between some authorities ! Absurd ! Off course as you see the name of Azinhaga you could get that way and arrive in the village and from there you can continue the way to Ponte.
In Golegã we had a nice hostal Solo Duro . It is not in the Brierley guide I have but if you come to the center ,ask for the the place.

 

[shubertj]

View attachment 11856you follow the path (see picture) from Quinta to Bosque and somewhere in between the path leads now moreless northwards to Pombalinho and follows the the road, my pen is pointing untill you are direction Ponte ! So this detour avoids Azinhaga due to a conflict between some authorities ! Absurd ! Off course as you see the name of Azinhaga you could get that way and arrive in the village and from there you can continue the way to Ponte.
In Golegã we had a nice hostal Solo Duro . It is not in the Brierley guide I have but if you come to the center ,ask for the the place.

Thanks very helpful

 

[Former member 22438]

My pleasure

 

[amorfati1]

this is what they post around Azinhaga. foto taken in May.
Following the yellow arrows brings you to Pombalinho - from there you still reach Azinhaga (where i overnighted, and had a tasty late lunch. just follow the ROADSIGNS to Azinhaga since there won't be arrows, at least there were none in May) but it's still a bloody mess and I had to ask multiple times the kind locals ... i wasn't lost, i knew where i was - but i just did not like where i was (pombalinho at that point) i rather would have stayed on those farm field tracks.

around that stage i for the first time was ready to wrap mister B. around the Maypole.

advice: keep your humour - and keep on trucking ... eh, walking.
cheers, claudia

 

[APokey1]

View attachment 11856you follow the path (see picture) from Quinta to Bosque and somewhere in between the path leads now moreless northwards to Pombalinho and follows the the road, my pen is pointing untill you are direction Ponte ! So this detour avoids Azinhaga due to a conflict between some authorities ! Absurd ! Off course as you see the name of Azinhaga you could get that way and arrive in the village and from there you can continue the way to Ponte.
In Golegã we had a nice hostal Solo Duro . It is not in the Brierley guide I have but if you come to the center ,ask for the the place.

Hello Albertinho!

Is this map you have a photo of one of the guidebooks that they have in Porto at the tourist center?? I hope so!
Thank you!!
Pokey in Colorado.. headed to Porto in one week!

 

[Former member 22438]

Hello Albertinho!

Is this map you have a photo of one of the guidebooks that they have in Porto at the tourist center?? I hope so!
Thank you!!
Pokey in Colorado.. headed to Porto in one week!

No @aPokey. This is a picture taken out of John Brierley's guide camino Portuges.

Azinhaga is situated on the Lisbon to Porto leg and closer to Lisbon than to Porto so If they should supply this map in Porto you should walk back away from Santiago what is possible as you follow the blue arrows pointing to Fátima partly.

 

[Former member 22438]

View attachment 11869 this is what they post around Azinhaga. foto taken in May.
Following the yellow arrows brings you to Pombalinho - from there you still reach Azinhaga (where i overnighted, and had a tasty late lunch. just follow the ROADSIGNS to Azinhaga since there won't be arrows, at least there were none in May) but it's still a bloody mess and I had to ask multiple times the kind locals ... i wasn't lost, i knew where i was - but i just did not like where i was (pombalinho at that point) i rather would have stayed on those farm field tracks.

around that stage i for the first time was ready to wrap mister B. around the Maypole.

advice: keep your humour - and keep on trucking ... eh, walking.
cheers, claudia

Hi Claudia. I remember we saw the same illustration as on your picture in May 2013 Just one or two months before the argue started between the officials ,it was in the news and my good friend Diogo mentioned it for the first time here on this forum.

Walking on and entering Golegá the mayor came to us personally and welcomed us and said if we were looking for a place to sleep ,he was willing to help us.

A sad story around the same place. In Mario's albergue in Santarèm we met an American guy and together we walked up for a few miles the next day. Later we met him again during lunchtime, sitting on a fence nearby a farm. He was acompanied then by a skinny dog.it was not his dog he said.

Going on ,the dog followed him. At the point the Azinhaga detour begon, we saw them walking again in the distance although they walked on another road more westwards from where we were. Later in Golega we met him again and asked were the dog was. Hit by a car just behind me ,crossing another road. How sad.

This American guy was fed up about the American consumptional way of living and wanted to stay in Spain or Portugal ,he wanted to buy an albergue and start a new more sober life .the last time we saw him was in Coimbra but the story kept me interesting.Mario of Santarem remembered his name and some months ago I found him on Linkedin, being back in the States after traveling around Europe for a year. So that is what Azinhaga keeps in mind all the time.

 

[Diogo92]

Hi Claudia. I remember we saw the same illustration as on your picture in May 2013 Just one or two months before the argue started between the officials ,it was in the news and my good friend Diogo mentioned it for the first time here on this forum.

Walking on and entering Golegá the mayor came to us personally and welcomed us and said if we were looking for a place to sleep ,he was willing to help us.

A sad story around the same place. In Mario's albergue in Santarèm we met an American guy and together we walked up for a few miles the next day. Later we met him again during lunchtime, sitting on a fence nearby a farm. He was acompanied then by a skinny dog.it was not his dog he said.

Going on ,the dog followed him. At the point the Azinhaga detour begon, we saw them walking again in the distance although they walked on another road more westwards from where we were. Later in Golega we met him again and asked were the dog was. Hit by a car just behind me ,crossing another road. How sad.

This American guy was fed up about the American consumptional way of living and wanted to stay in Spain or Portugal ,he wanted to buy an albergue and start a new more sober life .the last time we saw him was in Coimbra but the story kept me interesting.Mario of Santarem remembered his name and some months ago I found him on Linkedin, being back in the States after traveling around Europe for a year. So that is what Azinhaga keeps in mind all the time.

Heck of a story if you asked me. I hope that everything goes well with that guy.

 

[Former member 22438]

Heck of a story if you asked me. I hope that everything goes well with that guy.

Yes he is back in the US "consumption" world in NYC .now and then I have email contact with him.
I have been once in NYC for a couple of days and than you long for the rest and peace of the camino I can tell you. And I stayed there only for 5 days. Crowds, millions of cars, 24/7 shops opened, flashing neon commercials trying to influence your brain just to buy,buy buy...
So I said bye bye and started to walk. Then better to walk the Azinhaga detour and left or right in o Porriño

 

[Former member 22438]

Yes he is back in the US "consumption" world in NYC .now and then I have email contact with him.
I have been once in NYC for a couple of days and than you long for the rest and peace of the camino I can tell you. And I stayed there only for 5 days. Crowds, millions of cars, 24/7 shops opened, flashing neon commercials trying to influence your brain just to buy,buy buy...
So I said bye bye and started to walk. Then better to walk the Azinhaga detour and left or right in o Porriño

. Big brother is watching you ! As he says "I want you "

 

[Diogo92]

Yes he is back in the US "consumption" world in NYC .now and then I have email contact with him.
I have been once in NYC for a couple of days and than you long for the rest and peace of the camino I can tell you. And I stayed there only for 5 days. Crowds, millions of cars, 24/7 shops opened, flashing neon commercials trying to influence your brain just to buy,buy buy...
So I said bye bye and started to walk. Then better to walk the Azinhaga detour and left or right in o Porriño

Albertinho, please send something to your friend for me. Send an email to him with this link http://zerocurrency.blogspot.pt/ Tell him to search for a guy named Daniel Suelo, he will sure help your friend.

 

[Former member 22438]

Albertinho, please send something to your friend for me. Send an email to him with this link http://zerocurrency.blogspot.pt/ Tell him to search for a guy named Daniel Suelo, he will sure help your friend.

I don't like to interfear. Maybe he 's happy with his life now.
He tried another life. He worked on a farm in Portugal, went to Romania,walked the Frances,negociated about the purchase of an albergue and went back to the USA. I think after all he is happier in Wallstreet.

 

[Dutch]

Maybe he is doing the Wall Street Shuffle

 

[Former member 22438]

Maybe he is doing the Wall Street Shuffle

On Broadway in a "New York state of mind "

 

[amorfati1]

Hi Claudia. ......

This American guy was fed up about the American consumptional way of living and wanted to stay in Spain or Portugal ,he wanted to buy an albergue and start a new more sober life .the last time we saw him was in Coimbra but the story kept me interesting.Mario of Santarem remembered his name and some months ago I found him on Linkedin, being back in the States after traveling around Europe for a year. So that is what Azinhaga keeps in mind all the time.

yes - i love the way how the fabric of stories, as the one you shared, keeps the flavour of the caminho alive ...that in itself is another blessing, is it not?!
thank you!

 

[Former member 22438]

yes - i love the way how the fabric of stories, as the one you shared, keeps the flavour of the caminho alive ...that in itself is another blessing, is it not?!
thank you!

It is amazing how we change the subject of the topics all the time with all our in the meantime "beloved "fellow peregrinos , isn't not Claudia ? We wanted to start in Matosinhos but ended up in New York City

Normally after completing a camino you should loose interest and pick up the daily things in your regular world but something inside me tells me to check this great forum everyday again and again.
And I am not the only one .a lot of people stay connected for hours to read everything and commenting everything (me for example. . But the camino is such an addicting phenomen.

 

[another walker]

I think you will like the boardwalk to Vila do Conde. Specially as you start from Porto the walk is great.

London is the place for me ! Will be there again end of september to see some relatives who live there.
The only place with the name Londrinho I know is in the south of Brasil. I know a fellow jazzguitarist who lives there.

I love London,i was born there,at the foot of the Shard (of course it was not there then).London social history is my only real academic passion. Funny thing also,is that i am a guitarist also. I am a blues man,leaning more to a greasey Chicago style. My wife plays delta style and we fuse the two with some degree of success.
Also, do you know,is it all board walk from Matasinhos or does one sometimes have to walk on the sand? I don´t much like the idea of walking a long way on a tilt/slant.

 

[anniethenurse]

From Matosinhos to Vila do Conde?
It is board walking, narrow paths, small roads (very little traffic) following the yellow arrows and it is about 28- 29 km. I used GPS.
You do not have to walk on sand at all.
Bom Caminho

 

[Former member 22438]

I love London,i was born there,at the foot of the Shard (of course it was not there then).London social history is my only real academic passion. Funny thing also,is that i am a guitarist also. I am a blues man,leaning more to a greasey Chicago style. My wife plays delta style and we fuse the two with some degree of success.
Also, do you know,is it all board walk from Matasinhos or does one sometimes have to walk on the sand? I don´t much like the idea of walking a long way on a tilt/slant.

As Annie the Nurse says. It is not all boardwalk. We walked about 100 meters on the beach to a kind of small pillar on a dune..quite a steep dune by the way. Sometimes you can make a detour of a couple of hundred meters on tarmac if you like. It is a great walk.

Guitar passion...I fancy the darkbrown jazz sound of the (Gibson USA) archtops. I have 3 of them, ,an real electric guitar,Les Paul style and recently bought in Portugal a manouche gypsy acoustic one.for the moment I only play in a jazz bigband. So 5 in total but only can play at one at the time.

 

[amorfati1]

It is amazing how we change the subject of the topics all the time with all our in the meantime "beloved "fellow peregrinos , isn't not Claudia ? We wanted to start in Matosinhos but ended up in New York City

Normally after completing a camino you should loose interest and pick up the daily things in your regular world but something inside me tells me to check this great forum everyday again and again.
And I am not the only one .a lot of people stay connected for hours to read everything and commenting everything (me for example. . But the camino is such an addicting phenomen.

Quite.
Just like life, no? I loved living in southern switzerland. - et voila' - here i am in northern california!

Question: But i do not understand the 'Normally after completing a camino you should loose interest...' part of the message. Why lose interest? the caminho was part of my life .... was life for the time i experienced it for those weeks - and the preparation and the 'after glow'.
People often make the distinction : 'back in real-life' or 'back in the real world' ... - something i also do not understand. My life "en caminho" was as real life and real world than the one i am experiencing now...
anyhow - it's just further 'off topic' - pardon moi!
yet i often noticed it on this forum and elsewhere - this 'in real life....' and wondered about it ...why the distinction? why is the life of earning a living/working/getting groceries/cleaning the kitchen floor more "real" than the life of a pilgrimage with everything that entails?
i for one aim to be as fully present in my cleaning the kitchen floor as i was walking on those roman bridges or ordering a cafe con leche

please , this is no 'criticism' or anything like that at all, Senor Albertinho ! i think it's an important aspect/question!
why some pilgrims keep being engaged in camino topics for years after/during the pilgrimage?!
i know that nobody asked me, but here's an answer anyway:
in my experience one hopefully learns/sees/observes/experiences (especially post 42years of age) that we are not our accumulated history ... but our evolving and unfolding journey through life!
and i would further say that during an outer journey like the camino, one perhaps gets to realize this, or gets a taste of it: we are not frozen history (or neatly defined roles of mum/dad/employee/boyfriend/girlfriend/retiree etc etc etc) but we are actually still becoming ...
And THAT is a very alive feeling - we are so much more than our roles - and on the camino we can or could actually experience it ... step by step, kilometer after kilometer.
And this very alive feeling --- who wouldn't want to keep engaged with it? even via proxy/this forum or whatever else fits the ticket. (we are still all human BEINGs, and not human Doings)

alrighty --- now i am seriously off-message. - apologies ... and please nobody bites me head off for that!
(but this topic might be well worth its own 'thread' perhaps?!)
saluti!
claudia

 

[Kanga]

Back to the original topic, is anything being done to re-route the yellow arrows? It is not good enough to say the arrows go on dangerous roads because that is the historic way. If history was the only criteria we would all be walking out of Paris on the freeway, or across Spain on the autopista.

 

[Diogo92]

Back to the original topic, is anything being done to re-route the yellow arrows? It is not good enough to say the arrows go on dangerous roads because that is the historic way. If history was the only criteria we would all be walking out of Paris on the freeway, or across Spain on the autopista.

Yes it is, But it's a difficult job has I've explained.

 

[Diogo92]

Quite.
Just like life, no? I loved living in southern switzerland. - et voila' - here i am in northern california!

Question: But i do not understand the 'Normally after completing a camino you should loose interest...' part of the message. Why lose interest? the caminho was part of my life .... was life for the time i experienced it for those weeks - and the preparation and the 'after glow'.
People often make the distinction : 'back in real-life' or 'back in the real world' ... - something i also do not understand. My life "en caminho" was as real life and real world than the one i am experiencing now...
anyhow - it's just further 'off topic' - pardon moi!
yet i often noticed it on this forum and elsewhere - this 'in real life....' and wondered about it ...why the distinction? why is the life of earning a living/working/getting groceries/cleaning the kitchen floor more "real" than the life of a pilgrimage with everything that entails?
i for one aim to be as fully present in my cleaning the kitchen floor as i was walking on those roman bridges or ordering a cafe con leche

please , this is no 'criticism' or anything like that at all, Senor Albertinho ! i think it's an important aspect/question!
why some pilgrims keep being engaged in camino topics for years after/during the pilgrimage?!
i know that nobody asked me, but here's an answer anyway:
in my experience one hopefully learns/sees/observes/experiences (especially post 42years of age) that we are not our accumulated history ... but our evolving and unfolding journey through life!
and i would further say that during an outer journey like the camino, one perhaps gets to realize this, or gets a taste of it: we are not frozen history (or neatly defined roles of mum/dad/employee/boyfriend/girlfriend/retiree etc etc etc) but we are actually still becoming ...
And THAT is a very alive feeling - we are so much more than our roles - and on the camino we can or could actually experience it ... step by step, kilometer after kilometer.
And this very alive feeling --- who wouldn't want to keep engaged with it? even via proxy/this forum or whatever else fits the ticket. (we are still all human BEINGs, and not human Doings)

alrighty --- now i am seriously off-message. - apologies ... and please nobody bites me head off for that!
(but this topic might be well worth its own 'thread' perhaps?!)
saluti!
claudia

Somebody once told me that the Camiño it's a metaphor for life

 

[Former member 22438]

Back to the original topic, is anything being done to re-route the yellow arrows? It is not good enough to say the arrows go on dangerous roads because that is the historic way. If history was the only criteria we would all be walking out of Paris on the freeway, or across Spain on the autopista.

I agree with you @Kanga ! And that is the reason that this topic was started.
The route is still there but there is a better alternative. .
However since some time I read the route plans of pilgrims ,I wonder why they choose for this dangerous route. I understood that not all people know about the safer and nice detour so just go for what is the "usual" route.
I think it is a task for organisations like Vialusitana to change it by writing about it and mantaining the waymarks but am afraid they will keep the ancient values .And maybe there are commercial arguments to keep the Vilarinho route .shops,bars,restaurants,albergue ,hostals.?
But by talking about it on this forum more and more pilgrims are going to use the detour I noticed..

 

[Former member 22438]

Quite.
Just like life, no? I loved living in southern switzerland. - et voila' - here i am in northern california!

Question: But i do not understand the 'Normally after completing a camino you should loose interest...' part of the message. Why lose interest? the caminho was part of my life .... was life for the time i experienced it for those weeks - and the preparation and the 'after glow'.
People often make the distinction : 'back in real-life' or 'back in the real world' ... - something i also do not understand. My life "en caminho" was as real life and real world than the one i am experiencing now...
anyhow - it's just further 'off topic' - pardon moi!
yet i often noticed it on this forum and elsewhere - this 'in real life....' and wondered about it ...why the distinction? why is the life of earning a living/working/getting groceries/cleaning the kitchen floor more "real" than the life of a pilgrimage with everything that entails?
i for one aim to be as fully present in my cleaning the kitchen floor as i was walking on those roman bridges or ordering a cafe con leche

please , this is no 'criticism' or anything like that at all, Senor Albertinho ! i think it's an important aspect/question!
why some pilgrims keep being engaged in camino topics for years after/during the pilgrimage?!
i know that nobody asked me, but here's an answer anyway:
in my experience one hopefully learns/sees/observes/experiences (especially post 42years of age) that we are not our accumulated history ... but our evolving and unfolding journey through life!
and i would further say that during an outer journey like the camino, one perhaps gets to realize this, or gets a taste of it: we are not frozen history (or neatly defined roles of mum/dad/employee/boyfriend/girlfriend/retiree etc etc etc) but we are actually still becoming ...
And THAT is a very alive feeling - we are so much more than our roles - and on the camino we can or could actually experience it ... step by step, kilometer after kilometer.
And this very alive feeling --- who wouldn't want to keep engaged with it? even via proxy/this forum or whatever else fits the ticket. (we are still all human BEINGs, and not human Doings)

alrighty --- now i am seriously off-message. - apologies ... and please nobody bites me head off for that!
(but this topic might be well worth its own 'thread' perhaps?!)
saluti!
claudia

About your question I meant in general. People go back home and the daily routine starts again. Work, householding,children, familiy, social obligations etc etc. Besides that, anyway in my environs people who do not know the finesses of the camiño are not going further than to think that you have walked a lot of kms during some days. What is the fun of it ? Anyway I cannot share the excitement with a lot of people. To them this is a dull and bouring story.. Walking ?

Off course I live with the camiño every day .this forum , editing my camiño videos and pictures. Physical training in the gym for the next camiño etc.

 

[Diogo92]

I agree with you @Kanga ! And that is the reason that this topic was started.
The route is still there but there is a better alternative. .
However since some time I read the route plans of pilgrims ,I wonder why they choose for this dangerous route. I understood that not all people know about the safer and nice detour so just go for what is the "usual" route.
I think it is a task for organisations like Vialusitana to change it by writing about it and mantaining the waymarks but am afraid they will keep the ancient values .And maybe there are commercial arguments to keep the Vilarinho route .shops,bars,restaurants,albergue ,hostals.?
But by talking about it on this forum more and more pilgrims are going to use the detour I noticed..

Via Lusitana don't care about commercial values of anybody. If they did, they would end up not creating detours off-road. I will tell you something: remember the talk that we had about bureaucracy in Portugal? That’s the main problem in here. We have problems with both the town halls, and private property owners who don't want that the Caminho pass through their terrains. Via Lusitana worked very hard, almost 3 or 4 years to create a detour after you get out from Vila Franca, so that pilgrims don’t have to walk in the N1. What happens is that the pilgrims still prefer to walk on the road. The detour it's well marked, you have a cobblestone marker each 500m, and so if people don’t walk it and follow what their guides say, or their intuition (for heck sake, you can see that if you choose the other way, you will walk on the road) that’s their problem not the Association.

Just for you to see another case, from Alhandra to Vila Franca, you have a wonderful boardwalk near the Tagus River, where the Caminho follows (a detour from the N1 road). I walk every weekend in there, and I always check for the markings and the plates. One Saturday, the plates were missing. No arrows, no nothing. Still, there were some pilgrims walking in there, because they had been told that the Caminho followed that way. I instantly contacted the Association, and what they have told me was that the city hall was doing some corrections on the plates. And they did. They created the cobblestone markers with the Blue arrows (Caminho de Fátima) and the Yellow arrows (Caminho de Santiago). Although, they have also created a new way, that gets out of town via the N1 road, reusing the old PVC plates. They are in there, if you pass in your car, you will see them in the roundabout. See what I mean?

A lot of people talk about the terrible walk from Lisbon until Azambuja, but most of them don’t have ever picked up a map, and saw that it’s almost impossible for you to do a detour for that part of the Caminho. There are conditioning like private property, state property, military bases, and a lot of other things to have in consideration (you can never forget, that we are talking about an area of the Tagus River that it’s protected by law).

The Association it’s creating a series of protocols with city halls, so that they are the ones who should be responsible for making and maintaining the marks. It’s impossible for an Association with the maximum 100 members, to do all the work, especially when you have such a big research work to do. What I do believe that was correct, was to split all the work until Santarém, with the guys from the Associação dos Amigos do Caminho de Fátima. One year it was one who would do it, the other year, the other Association.

I don’t believe it’s a problem for way marking. The alternatives are in there. They exist, they are written in Forum’s, guidebooks, blogs, other websites, etc etc. So if people choose that way, it’s their problem, not others people problem.

 

[another walker]

From Matosinhos to Vila do Conde?
It is board walking, narrow paths, small roads (very little traffic) following the yellow arrows and it is about 28- 29 km. I used GPS.
You do not have to walk on sand at all.
Bom Caminho

Thankyou Anniethenurse.

 

[Diogo92]

Speaking of the devil:

Marking of the Alternative to the EN306 on the Caminho Central Português.​

"The identities responsible for the promotion of the Caminho de Santiago in Vila do Conde, including the City Hall of Vila do Conde, the Delegation from Vila do Conde of the Associação dos Espaços Jacobeus, the Town Hall of Gião, the counties of Fornelo e Vairão, the Town Hall of Madeira da Maia and the Hospitaleiros from the Albergue de Peregrinos Mosteiro de Vairão, have decided by mutual agreement, to mark one alternative for the Caminho Português.

This alternative has its only motivation in keeping pilgrims safe, withdrawing their exposition to the potentially dangerous car circulation in the EN306 (inexistence of enough width, and inexistence of walking areas).

We request to all Public Entities, Jacobean Associations, Pilgrims and Friends from the Caminho de Santiago that can comply, to promote this alternative for the Caminho Português de Santiago."