Ultimate Dog Repellent

[Chomps]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

 

[DoughnutANZ]

Maybe this would work.

 

[isabeau]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

 

[dick bird]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

Any device designed to frighten or alarm a dog is almost certain to be illegal in Spain.

 

[Chomps]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

Because there are literally hundreds of posts on here about nuisance dogs and dog attacks on the Camino.

always with their owners and under voice control

That is not consistent with what I am hearing over and over on Camino forums.

 

[KathyRugg]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

I don’t know the answer. I seem to be a dog attractor. This beauty is named León and he was a love. I never met a mean dog along the whole Camino.

 

[Kathor1]

That is not consistent with what I am hearing over and over on Camino forums

I guess that @isabeau wasn’t talking about a neighbourhood on the Camino Francés, she was talking about a neighbourhood in California.

From all I have read, out of the 450,000+ Camino pilgrims a year, a few do get bitten by a dog; there is even a very recent thread, see Alert - Pilgrim bitten by a dog on stage to Zamora. Forum members seem to belong to different categories, ranging from the one’s who own a dog and/or love dogs and just know in their hearts that dogs will never bite a harmless and hapless pilgrim to the ones who will tell you that you might get bitten anywhere in the world so why worry about the Camino and to the ones who a scared of the tiniest of dogs and who wish them no harm just that they stay away and not come any closer.

I guess that you are thinking of ultrasonic devices? I have no idea … but I am following this thread.

Btw, I did not get bitten nor did I see any pilgrim get bitten while I walked. There were two dogs barking and running along behind me and my companion while we were walking through some town or village and one of them “nipped” at my backpack or at the belt hanging from it; I was anxious but my companion is a dog patter (pats any dog within sight) and we just kept walking. In Galicia some massively big dogs were standing, strolling or lying on the Camino path through a small town or other. They took no notice of me but I moved very carefully. All the others made a lot of noise but were behind walls or fences. At one time there was a warning board next to the Way to Santiago and that was a bit of an iffy situation because the dogs did appear but no need to worry, it happened on the Chemin in far away France and not on the Camino in Spain.

 

[Brandy]

Walked several thousand km in Spain , never had problems with dogs.
Buen Camino
Brandy

 

[Anhalter]

Feeling bold today, so I'll claim that on the "popular" Caminos (which includes the Primitivo) there are so many people that every dog should be well accustomed to them. This does not exclude the risk of bad luck, just like anywhere in the world.

Myself as well as a friend did have an issue once (each). But that was somewhere you count the number of pilgrims passing each day on one hand and will likely have digits left. In both instances staying calm and holding the walking sticks in front (note: not frantically waving them) did the trick.

So it's up to you how much you want to worry. I wouldn't.

 

[Tincatinker]

Because there are literally hundreds of posts on here about nuisance dogs and dog attacks on the Camino.

That is not consistent with what I am hearing over and over on Camino forums.

Can you imagine how boring the average Camino forum would be if everybody who walked a Camino and didn't have a dog encounter reported it. 500,000 posts headlined "I walked a Camino and didn't get bitten by a dog".

Oh, and a search for "dog + attack" on the forum produced about 4 relevant posts, not literally hundreds. Fear is the mind-killer.

 

[Kathor1]

Oh, and a search for "dog + attack" on the forum produced about 4 relevant posts, not literally hundreds. Fear is the mind-killer.

Entering dog bitten into the search field instead of dog attack yields a few more relevant posts. “”Just saying””.

 

[Tincatinker]

Entering dog bitten into the search field instead of dog attack yields a few more relevant posts. “”Just saying””.

Still ain't in the "hundreds" though

 

[woody66]

Entering dog bitten into the search field instead of dog attack yields a few more relevant posts. “”Just saying””.

Now to my mind that is a more scary result; i wouldn't want to bump into the Pilgrim that did that!!!

 

[Former member 108241]

Oh, and a search for "dog + attack" on the forum produced about 4 relevant posts, not literally hundreds. Fear is the mind-killer.

Just thinking aloud, I would say "literally hundreds" is about correct. No, that's not hundreds of unique threads but posts, including replies? Possibly. I haven't added my voice to the chorus but I'm suddenly and inexplicably dealing with anxiety about this too. Which is strange because I grew up in a country where vicious dogs are the norm. I once opened a gate and strolled up to the front door of a property to drop off some paperwork for a sick colleague and I did this so nonchalantly and casually - even though there were danger signs saying "Guard dogs on patrol", "Keep out" and I even saw the Dobermans patrolling the place and didn't think twice. Funny thing about that story is they totally ignored me, like they could sense I wasn't scared of them? My colleague almost had a fit though. Certainly would NOT be doing that again any time soon. But if I'm ever faced with a dangerous dog in Spain I might try a nonchalant walk and see how that goes.

 

[Flatlander]

I've cycled many kms all over Spain and never had a single negative issue with a dog. I've cycled in other places where dog attacks were a daily event.

I can understand the anxiety, though, and there's likely very little assurance for you from reading that I've never had a problem.

If this is a real problem for you, then I suggest you tackle this like any other problem you anticipate for your camino - practice.
Expose yourself to dogs. Learn to read their body language. Do a bit of research to see what we do can influence a dog. You might surprise yourself! Sometimes on a low day there can be nothing better than a playful dog. (But in Spain, generally, they're too well behaved).

To answer your question, specifically, I have found that water squirted through a nozzle (such as on most sports bottles) into the face of a dog is a dog-friendly, effective way of discouraging their interest.

 

[BombayBill]

My own opinion based on my experience on different routes is that it depends on the landscape. I’ve encountered farm dogs that are protecting their realms who, if given wide berth, can be safely passed. On the other hand I’ve encountered guard dogs in residential areas that truly are aggressive. It seemed particularly bad on the Verde amongst a cluster of oddly opulent houses where the dogs were large and violent. One almost got me as its chain allowed it on the path.

So as to deterrence I would say look around and if the area is rural just avoid approaching any animals. Otherwise have your poles at hand. Fussing with any other technology probably would be too slow to deploy.

 

[naplesdon]

I experienced this "terror" only once in 11 years of walking the Camino when I was walking from Oloron and two very large Alsatians who were keeping guard over a flock of sheep decided that I was an intruder. They came at me fast from all angles and were determined that I was not going to survive that day. I wielded my two walking sticks expertly like they were Harry Potter magic wands and moved as fast I could to get as far away from the flock of sheep as I could, realizing that the two dog's primary purpose in life was to protect their flock and hopefully not make me their menu del dia.

 

[moromauro]

I can report, for personal experience, of a couple who was attacked and bitten by to dogs on Via de la Plata, while they were walking the same stage as mine.

I was attacked by a dog myself, in 2019 on Camino Catalán, but managed to stay (rather...) calm and i could get far from what the animal considered to be its own property (it was the Caminos's trail, instead), finding another way to go further.

Anyway... i can't understand why a lot of users reply to minimize this problem instead of focusing on the question that has been posted.

Has anyone some suggestion to give?

 

[TrvlDad1]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

Pop open umbrella

 

[bananarama]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

So pepper-spray is a no-no in Spain?

I'm just one data point: I've cycled the CF twice and VdLP once, and it was on the VdLP that I came across a bunch of rowdy Spanish Mastiffs protecting their posse of sheep on the section between "Casar de Cáceres" and "Embalse de Alcántara" and aside from the barking, nothing else happened.

I appreciate you're concerned. Statistical data suggests it's extremely unlikely that something will happen. Also your mug-shot is a dog so I assume you're no stranger to interacting with them?

 

[CatPhillips]

Last week while walking the Norte an otherwise adorable ankle-bitter (chihuahua) ran towards me barking ferociously. Luckily I had my poles out so I faced him and held him at a distance with my poles until his owners ran out and retrieved him. I have no doubt he would have bitten me if I had turned my back on him. I wasn’t really scared because he was very small but still…I learned carrying mail years ago that you don’t turn your back on an aggressive dog. Back away slowly. I’ve walked over 4000k on caminos in Spain and Portugal and I’ve had this experience exactly twice. Once I met a pilgrim who was actually bitten by another aggressive little dog. Most dogs I’m Spain will ignore you.

 

[Kathor1]

Still ain't in the "hundreds" though

Yes, I agree that there are probably not hundreds of posts on this forum about hundreds of cases where a pilgrim was bitten by a dog. But probably hundreds of posts in threads about this topic. I mean we are already on post #22 where the majority of us posters here points out that they had not been bitten.

But hey, there was this recent thread about the pilgrim bitten by a dog on a Saturday morning on the Camino de Santiago near Zamora and there is even a photo in the Spanish news media that was released by the Guardia Civil themselves:

​

 

[Arctic_Alex]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

Well, I do not see the need for a "repellent", however, there can be problems with dogs at times.
Just to explain, I am a person quite experienced with dogs. I grew up with (among? ;-) ) dogs since I was a toddler, I do occasionally use dogsleds and theses days I live with several dogs.
So I am not afraid of dogs and I know to read them.

My experience on Caminos so far:

1. Some years ago on the Camino Frances I had an encounter with a dog not wanting to let me pass the house of his owner, so I had to manoeuvre carefully. Not a real problem, but for a person with only little dog experience this could have been a bit tricky and maybe scary.

2. Last month, on the Camino Primitivo, it happened that a farmer in very early morning still had his guard dogs loose which would be on a chain after sunrise when the pilgrims normally arrive. The Camino lead right across his land so the two dogs engaged me rather aggressively from two sides simultaneously, effectively making it impossible to move on as they guarded me in quite clear body language and dog-talk. It took me some minutes of negotiating with the two to convince them I was not a bad guy. In the end one of them calmly left and the other even wanted to make friends. But again, someone who was less of a dog-person would have had a problem here.

However, especially in the second situation any sort of "dog repellent" that a dog would interpret as aggression would have been a really bad idea. I am thinking of a pilgrim afraid of dogs, swinging an umbrella, his walking stick or shouting or performing hectic movements. Therefor I am very sceptical when it comes to these things.

 

[Jim Bispham]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

Why be afraid of dogs? Well In march this year I was attacked by 2 dogs on the Via de la Plata just south of Melida and bitten, I required hospital treatment. I was not afraid of dogs before this incident, but now do not trust them.

 

[MichelleElynHogan]

I have always found that my attitude has been my best deterrent. With defending dogs, I ignore them. They leave me alone. With angry dogs, they still will not attack without provocation.

Best to look up a very good dog trainer like Cesar and review his methods.

 

[AnaRosario]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

I definitely am afraid of dogs, and did encounter an incident back in 2018. From what I’ve read, possibly more loose canines along the route. I am concerned about that, as I make my plans for my upcoming Camino.

 

[Helen Robinson]

Because there are literally hundreds of posts on here about nuisance dogs and dog attacks on the Camino.

That is not consistent with what I am hearing over and over on Camino forums.

Having just completed the Frances I can say there are barking dogs in gardens or farm property but NEVER have I seen one loose. You really don't need to worry.

 

[Blackcountry pilgrim]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

Walking the Camino Portuguese last year I was attacked and bitten by a dog in a bar first day out of Porto...ended up in the casualty dept having stitches. Not sure about other Caminos but I came across a lot of dogs loose in Portugal and Spain and am very wary no whilst walking so I would also be very interested in anything that would reassure me!

 

[Arctic_Alex]

Having just completed the Frances I can say there are barking dogs in gardens or farm property but NEVER have I seen one loose. You really don't need to worry.

I have seen several loose, not just pets, also larger guard dogs, also on the Francés.

 

[Kathor1]

Having just completed the Frances I can say there are barking dogs in gardens or farm property but NEVER have I seen one loose.

Whether loose dogs are a danger to pilgrims or not is another question and I don't doubt your word that you have NEVER seen one loose. Others have. And that's also the reason why you see this board and similar information posters in Spanish and/or English that ask Camino pilgrims not to allow loose dogs follow them. Apparently, this has become an issue (and apparently not all dogs and cats find their way home again).

 

[Chomps]

Just so you all know. Yes, I am a huge dog person and my wife and I actively rescue dogs. My aunt and uncle have operated a golden retriever rescue for many years and my cousins train for Eyes For the Blind and also do fostering work.
I have cycled across the entirety of England, Germany, Holland, and a lot of N. France. So I am no stranger to dogs.
I agree that dismissing the issue is hazardous. While being in denial of it is just silly.
Yes, limiting a search to just a few select words will also limit your results. Dig just slightly harder than that and you will find plenty.
Also, those who have been in the Algarve; Fishermans route, Cabo St Vicente, Faro, etc are, I assume, familiar.
I am just looking for best practices here and I thank those who have responded.

 

[VintageCowgirl]

Over my lifetime I've been bitten more by horses than dogs. I carry a Vantamo personal personal alarm that's very loud and has a strobe light. This is more to scare off 2 legged predators but perhaps it would startle a dog and make it run away from the noise.

 

[Mickblack]

I was leaving a farm campsite in France, wearing only shorts and riding my bike. By the farmers house his dog bit me; blood streaming profusely from my leg. The farmers wife saw it happen. I’m English so when French dog bites you it’s got rabies! In my panic I couldn’t remember the French word for rabies and so I asked the woman, ‘is it mad’, thinking she would know what I really meant. ‘No, she replied, it bites everybody’

 

[Glenshiro]

Expose yourself to dogs

No, don't. Just don't. Or to anyone else. They frown on that kind of thing in rural Spain.

 

[Markva79]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

Yes. Farm dogs are often alone protecting “their” property. Rarely are they accompanied by their owners. Most of the time they are behind a fence or tethered to a building. On rare occasions they can be loose and sometimes aggressive - sometimes not.

 

[Robo]

Having just completed the Frances I can say there are barking dogs in gardens or farm property but NEVER have I seen one loose. You really don't need to worry.

Just heading back home from the VdlP.
Lots of loose dogs there.
'Most' were not a problem.

 

[TrvlDad1]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

How to judge the fear factor here?

 

[sp01326]

Walked several thousand km in Spain , never had problems with dogs.
Buen Camino
Brandy

The same for me. I suppose than the classical Caminos are safer than the less attended ones. On Frances, Primitivo, Norte, English ways I saw only dogs well used to the human presence. I cannot speak about la Plata or minor ways. Buen Camino

 

[henrythedog]

So pepper-spray is a no-no in Spain?

That’s correct.

Try anything like that and you’ll need a backup plan to deal with the dog’s owner.

 

[Caminogoat]

Any device designed to frighten or alarm a dog is almost certain to be illegal in Spain.

I have an iWatch that can make a very loud alarm. I must insist that it is designed to frighten or alarm humans only.

 

[Anamiri]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

Honestly, if you're walking the Frances, dogs are not an issue. Its a well worn trail, and all the animals are used to seeing humans, the majority wont even lift their heads to watch you walk by. As well as dogs, I petted horses, goats donkeys, cows, and even had a wee lamb follow me. I pretty much patted every dog I met, most are very friendly. I am a dog person, and I know how to read them. If I thought I was likely to lose a hand, I wouldn't approach. I would suggest if you are concerned, just walk by, giving them some space, and pay them no attention.

Don't try and touch one of the livestock guard dogs - that's their job to protect their flocks.

I'm at much higher risk walking around the farms and village where I live.
I think you have a higher chance of being run over on the road.

 

[Rita Flower]

Because there are literally hundreds of posts on here about nuisance dogs and dog attacks on the Camino.

That is not consistent with what I am hearing over and over on Camino forums.

Sorry to say that people will post more of what didn’t work, scared or frustrated them in all areas (dogs, accommodations, people etc) than what was OK.
Yes, there have been a a number of people bitten by dogs - out the thousands who walk all the Caminos.
Then there have been many more posts about dogs that frightened people but did not bite.
Last year I walked for a while with a man who had been frightened of dogs since childhood. . We were on a section of the Via where we were walking through someone’s property. There were a number of big dogs. We kept walking at the same pace while I chatted to the dogs in a low dog friendly voice. As we got to the last gate I turned around and the dog growled. It surprised me but I immediately realised the fog was saying - keep walking, no stopping here on this property. We just kept going and all was well.
Then on the Sanabres there is a big black dog that belongs to the Oseira monastery that walks with pilgrims for about 5 Km. Very friendly.
And I think on the Francés there are not that many dogs.
The only ‘dog deterrent’ I know is dog friendly behaviour = keep walking - don’t make eye contact or confront - chat in a low calm voice - keep calm by using the breath.
Buen Camino

 

[Rita Flower]

Whether loose dogs are a danger to pilgrims or not is another question and I don't doubt your word that you have NEVER seen one loose. Others have. And that's also the reason why you see this board and similar information posters in Spanish and/or English that ask Camino pilgrims not to allow loose dogs follow them. Apparently, this has become an issue (and apparently not all dogs and cats find their way home again).

View attachment 148321

Loose dogs who follow are unlikely to be dogs that bite. And from experience it can be hard to deter a ‘following’ dog. But they certainly should not be encouraged.

 

[Rita Flower]

I definitely am afraid of dogs, and did encounter an incident back in 2018. From what I’ve read, possibly more loose canines along the route. I am concerned about that, as I make my plans for my upcoming Camino.

Not wanting to offend, but fear of dogs often leads to fear in dogs which can lead to more aggressive behaviour like barking and growling and occasionally even biting.
There are a lot of dogs in Spain - and in Portugal I called one section ‘the days of the barking dogs of Portugal’.
Perhaps working with a dog trainer before you leave will give you more confidence with dogs and give you a more relaxed Camino.
Very few of us here are actually dog experts. At best well informed amateurs.

 

[Rita Flower]

Why be afraid of dogs? Well In march this year I was attacked by 2 dogs on the Via de la Plata just south of Melida and bitten, I required hospital treatment. I was not afraid of dogs before this incident, but now do not trust them.

So sorry to hear this. I hope you are now well.
But please see if you can let go of a general fear of dogs. Not an easy thing as the trauma of the biting will be reactivated.
As suggested in other comments, connecting with a good dog trainer to teach you best practice around dogs could do a lot to make future Caminos more relaxed.

 

[chuckhibbs]

I can report, for personal experience, of a couple who was attacked and bitten by to dogs on Via de la Plata, while they were walking the same stage as mine.

I was attacked by a dog myself, in 2019 on Camino Catalán, but managed to stay (rather...) calm and i could get far from what the animal considered to be its own property (it was the Caminos's trail, instead), finding another way to go further.

Anyway... i can't understand why a lot of users reply to minimize this problem instead of focusing on the question that has been posted.

Has anyone some suggestion to give?

I carried mail for over thirty years in the US.
I as attacked well over a dozen times. German Shepards, beagles, poodles etc.
Pepper always worked. Received no joy from it but have to protect yourself.
Not necessary to spray into the face of the dog, spray in the air and let them run into it. Works every time.

 

[mjal]

Not strictly relevant to the Camino but I think it is to the OP's concerns and to some of the opinions so far expressed.

As a rural GP (family physician) in the UK, I treated a large number of patients with dog bites. My professional partners had similar experiences.

Face the facts - dogs DO bite whether "provoked" or otherwise.

And this myth that dogs detect fear in the "victim" - what magic allows a dog (especially a pack) to detect this in someone who was not aware of the dogs in question until the incident began - four of them racing at the pedestrians, barking, growling - loose in a public space, no "territorial" issue?

Ah, it's not the dog's fault, it's due to poor training...no consolation to the victim.

 

[Kathor1]

I carried mail for over thirty years in the US. I was attacked well over a dozen times. German Shepards, beagles, poodles etc. Pepper always worked. Received no joy from it but have to protect yourself. Not necessary to spray into the face of the dog, spray in the air and let them run into it. Works every time.

And while I have never bought it let alone used it: Pepper spray is called spray pimienta in Spanish and you can buy it for example in the Armeria Castro in the calle La Rúa in Léon. The shop is right on the Camino Francés trail. You must provide your DNI (passport) and you must be older than 18.

The shop also carries more usual products for the "outdoor-pilgrim" and I know this because I once bought some excellent shoelaces there.

 

[Dilbin]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

I've been bitten at home in Ireland (drew blood, stitches etc) while out training for the Camino and it affected me psychologically for the rest of the training. Two days into that particular Camino(Salvador) two large dogs ran at me barking and growling. Bizarrely enough I didn't panic and just shook my stick at them shouting Allez! and they didn't come near me. Maybe it's a Camino thing that I'm just more relaxed there or something. I did get a nip on the backside once on the Norte but in that instance I just got angry with the owner because she didn't control her dogs. It's really a lot more about Fear I think. For example their are posts about what to do and how to avoid livestock on the road. Neither are really issues and I have walked all over Spain and Portugal many times. My only suggestion would be have a walking pile or stick and enjoy the journey. Leave the world behind and enter in to the twilight of the spirit. Buen Camino

 

[barnettstakeagiantstep]

Feeling bold today, so I'll claim that on the "popular" Caminos (which includes the Primitivo) there are so many people that every dog should be well accustomed to them. This does not exclude the risk of bad luck, just like anywhere in the world.

Myself as well as a friend did have an issue once (each). But that was somewhere you count the number of pilgrims passing each day on one hand and will likely have digits left. In both instances staying calm and holding the walking sticks in front (note: not frantically waving them) did the trick.

So it's up to you how much you want to worry. I wouldn't.

If you carry walking sticks you have protection Buen Camino everyone

 

[dick bird]

spray pimienta in Spanish and you can buy it for example in the Armeria Castro in the calle La Rúa in Léon.

¿Son legales los sprays de pimienta para defensa en España? - SAFETYPS

Los sprays de pimienta son consideradas como armas de defensa personal pero ¿son legales los sprays de pimienta para defensa en España?

www.safetyps.com

Indeed, they don't call themselves 'Armeria' for nothing, the products of Browning and Winchester being among those they stock alongside more familiar brands such as Saloman and Teva. But pepper spray (13 euros a can) is legal in Spain so long as it is an approved brand and used only for self-defence as this website helpfully explains. However, anyone who uses it on a dog should be prepared to explain themselves to the dog's owner.

 

[Flatlander]

However, anyone who uses it on a dog should be prepared to explain themselves to the dog's owner.

I agree wholeheartedly and I'll add they'll be dealing with me too if I'm in the vicinity.

As with a lot of things, there is rarely a simple or single solution.

I've been bitten at home in Ireland (drew blood, stitches etc) while out training for the Camino and it affected me psychologically for the rest of the training

This is so very true.

My own (biking) experience was very nearly derailed not by dog attacks but by the fear of dog attacks (not in Spain). Every house was a source of anxiety. Every shadow was a dog. I realised I had a problem when someone's mailbox nearly stopped me in my tracks. When anxiety is high, comfort and enjoyment is low.

No amount of pepper spray would impact on that.

Besides, it can be very tricky stuff to actually use, especially outdoors in the wind. Without practice I'd be as likely to pepper spray myself as a dog.

I'm of the opinion that tackling the anxiety is a healthier and more successful approach than trying to retaliate.

Also, without meaning to add to the fear factor, I was bitten by a dog, very far from home in a land where rabies is an issue. Travelling as I was by bike, it was inconvenient, but my course of three shots over three weeks turned out to be an interesting and enjoyable experience and let me see and meet people I'd not have met otherwise.
Also, because I had done some work on my attitude to dogs there were no psychological issues - which was just as well because I met many, many dogs in many remote places with no further problem.

Sometimes the things we fear in the comfort of our own homes aren't nearly so bad as the reality.

 

[dbeatriceb]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

I can understand why someone would inquire about repellant, but my guess is it isn’t permitted in Spain. Occasionally there can be a dog that feels it’s his/her job to guard the family compound you might not realize you’re walking past. Usually dragging the ends of hiking poles along the pavement, making semi-circles, will deter them from coming closer. But especially in the countryside, a dog running free generally has an agenda and it might not include playing cute for pilgrims. Larger dogs in particular can be work dogs that don’t appreciate the presence of strangers.
There are also friendly little canine scavengers in villages who will request handouts from pilgrims’ lunches.
In rural areas especially, encountering a dog can be an unpleasant experience. I’ve tended to more than one pilgrim who ventured too close to a private gate and was rewarded with a bite.
On the Camino it isn’t like walking leashed pets in an urban or suburban setting. Although a rural dog might obey voice commands from its human, said human could be nowhere in sight. When they are, sometimes they will warn passing pilgrims to keep their distance. I come from a neighborhood of dogs too, leashed or under voice command, but the Camino isn’t “Kansas,” so it is a good idea with any strange dog on the loose to maintain a healthy respect and distance.

 

[Arctic_Alex]

There are also many harmless dogs, but it is not always easy to tell the difference. This was a loud guard dog from the house opposite my accommodation in Fisterra. A defending guard dog on the chain in daytime, but a cuddly free-range dog at night at the beach. We made friends and he later tried to follow me into my accommodation. Next day back on the chain he was barking at me again when I approached his house, but then he suddenly recognised me and started friendly tailwagging.

 

[oursonpolaire]

I have always found that my attitude has been my best deterrent. With defending dogs, I ignore them. They leave me alone. With angry dogs, they still will not attack without provocation.

Best to look up a very good dog trainer like Cesar and review his methods.

I assure you that there are dogs which attack without provocation and I have been subjected to this on two occasions-- both lesser caminos, as the dogs on the Francese look upon us with sheer boredom, which is how I like it.

On one, a passing motorist saved me when I was cornered by two (possibly unemployed and wandering, as it was far from any house or farm) guard dogs, pushing them out of the way and allowing me into his car-- he told me that this had happened before and he did not know to whom they belonged. On the other occasion, two Asturian mastiffs saw me from a rise on the road almost a km off, and began bounding in my direction, barking furiously. I turned tail and a nearby farmer allowed me within his gate-- he told me that the owner was unstable, and housed goats and sheep in her house, and that the dogs had attacked others before. I reported this to the ayuntamiento in the next pueblo, and filled out a denunciacion for the provincial police, which is needed before they would go around and get the owner to control her dogs.

A few years previously, I was given a mini-course by a local dog trainer who gave me some basic tips on how not to be perceived as a threat, and I have found this very useful while training on local paths. However, I will likely pick up some pepper spray for my next Camino.

 

[redbackpack]

I walked with a friend when a dog stood in our path. My friend froze at first, then started slowly back. I kept going and talking to the dog. The dog looked like it wouldn't let us pass at first, but as I got closer it got scared and ran away doing as big circle as it possibly could around us.

If you ask her, she encountered a big dangerous dog.
If you ask me, I encountered a dog who was terrified.

I pet as many dogs on the Camino as I respectfully could.
My only bite was from a burro.

 

[David Tallan]

What this thread is teaching me is that our experiences are many and varied on the many Caminos and it is unwise to extrapolate from our limited experience (no matter how many Caminos we have walked) to something that is universally applicable.

 

[MichelleElynHogan]

I assure you that there are dogs which attack without provocation and I have been subjected to this on two occasions-- both lesser caminos, as the dogs on the Francese look upon us with sheer boredom, which is how I like it.

On one, a passing motorist saved me when I was cornered by two (possibly unemployed and wandering, as it was far from any house or farm) guard dogs, pushing them out of the way and allowing me into his car-- he told me that this had happened before and he did not know to whom they belonged. On the other occasion, two Asturian mastiffs saw me from a rise on the road almost a km off, and began bounding in my direction, barking furiously. I turned tail and a nearby farmer allowed me within his gate-- he told me that the owner was unstable, and housed goats and sheep in her house, and that the dogs had attacked others before. I reported this to the ayuntamiento in the next pueblo, and filled out a denunciacion for the provincial police, which is needed before they would go around and get the owner to control her dogs.

A few years previously, I was given a mini-course by a local dog trainer who gave me some basic tips on how not to be perceived as a threat, and I have found this very useful while training on local paths. However, I will likely pick up some pepper spray for my next Camino.

If I may, consult with that same dog trainer re: secondary tools for repelling dogs. Pepper spray may not deter them. There is much on canine psychology that would help here but it would be voluminous. And personally, I have never had any difficulties with dogs at home or on the Camino except for one time where I was bitten in the butt by a yearling German Shepherd. It was a fear bite. Ask your dog trainer friend about that. When do dogs bite in fear?

 

[pjacobi]

Loud noises only tell the dog that you are "barking" back! Talk softly to calm the dog down, so the dog will not think you are a threat. Don't make any sudden moves.

A dog that is only barking will most likely not bite. Most dogs growl and show their teeth as a warning before biting.


-Paul

 

[AJGuillaume]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

I was bitten by a dog as a child, and have a deeply entrenched fear of dogs. No manner of "therapy" has helped.

So I bought an ultrasonic device called Dazer II.
I don't need it obviously if the barking dog is behind a fence or on a chain.

It has worked in nearly all situations when the dogs were stray dogs. Walking through the ramblas on the Camino Mozárabe, there often are stray dogs. I have used the device and they would scatter.

If the dog is not behind a fence, not chained (and I'm not talking about those big dogs that keep an eye on sheep), and comes rushing out of a property, then the device doesn't work. The dog is intent on defending its territory, wants to bite me, feels my fear, and the only thing that has worked in this cases is to use my walking poles, and to throw stones.

I met a pilgrim who had a pepper spray can. She would not use it on the dog, but would create a barrier on the ground with it. She said it always worked. And yes, pepper spray is legal in Spain.

Hope this helps, @Chomps

¡Buen Camino!

 

[Linda V]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

The only dog attack on my Camino Frances. Not aimed at me but at my Coffee cake. He was trying to hypnotise the cake to come towards him

 

[Chomps]

View attachment 148514
The only dog attack on my Camino Frances. Not aimed at me but at my Coffee cake. He was trying to hypnotise the cake to come towards him

What a sweet pup!

 

[oursonpolaire]

If I may, consult with that same dog trainer re: secondary tools for repelling dogs. Pepper spray may not deter them. There is much on canine psychology that would help here but it would be voluminous. And personally, I have never had any difficulties with dogs at home or on the Camino except for one time where I was bitten in the butt by a yearling German Shepherd. It was a fear bite. Ask your dog trainer friend about that. When do dogs bite in fear?

I'm afraid that I am going to be very blunt in response. When faced by two large guard dogs, aggressive and in attack mode, there is little in canine psychology that could help. It's not inconceivable that a lone dog might be persuadable, but that was not the reality with which I was faced.

These dogs could not have been fearful-- they had clearly been trained to be aggressive and discussion about dogs biting in fear is not really pertinent. I was there. This is not a laboratory situation. I spoke with my dog trainer friend afterward and she agreed that I was in a very difficult (her words-- I would have said dangerous) situation. If singing Kumbaya would work, I would have done so happily. Pepper spray would almost certainly have deterred them from pursuing their attack-- this has been confirmed by a Mountie I know who has had to deal with dogs weaponized by their owners. I do not like this situation, but it would not be of my choosing.

A quick note to finish this-- dogs on the Francese are just fine. They occasionally bark, but generally they just look at us and yawn. My experiences on other caminos were real, but they were the exception. For almost every pilgrim, just walk by Bowser.

 

[dbeatriceb]

I was bitten by a dog as a child, and have a deeply entrenched fear of dogs. No manner of "therapy" has helped.

So I bought an ultrasonic device called Dazer II.
I don't need it obviously if the barking dog is behind a fence or on a chain.

It has worked in nearly all situations when the dogs were stray dogs. Walking through the ramblas on the Camino Mozárabe, there often are stray dogs. I have used the device and they would scatter.

If the dog is not behind a fence, not chained (and I'm not talking about those big dogs that keep an eye on sheep), and comes rushing out of a property, then the device doesn't work. The dog is intent on defending its territory, wants to bite me, feels my fear, and the only thing that has worked in this cases is to use my walking poles, and to throw stones.

I met a pilgrim who had a pepper spray can. She would not use it on the dog, but would create a barrier on the ground with it. She said it always worked. And yes, pepper spray is legal in Spain.

Hope this helps, @Chomps

¡Buen Camino!

Good to know it’s legal. And I love the barrier on the ground idea— brilliant!

 

[knoisyknees]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

Yikes during our 8 caminos we've never had any issues with dogs. Hope you don't either.

 

[John Cook]

By the time I'd finished walking the VdlP last month I grew to hate dogs. I saw a few very well trained guard dogs, two even quietly followed me from a distance, until I'd passed their protected areas but I met so many more seemingly vicious ones.
I had a few actually sprint towards me, teeth bared so I turned and faced them and either growled or shouted very loudly at them. This stopped them in their tracks and they backed off, still barking though. One even ran for me in front of it's owner, who ignored it and carried on talking to his friend. I shouted particularly loudly at that one and had to carry on shouting as I walked for at least 50m.
I discovered that shouting very loudly at the loose ones became very therapeutic as I imagined I was hopefully waking up their owners.
I even had a tiny snake lunge at me, but I thought that was cute.

 

[dougfitz]

What this thread is teaching me is that our experiences are many and varied on the many Caminos and it is unwise to extrapolate from our limited experience (no matter how many Caminos we have walked) to something that is universally applicable.

If there is anything that is universally applicable is that all dogs will bite. Anyone who tells you that their dog doesn't is not aware that that the dog will bite, but has not yet been pushed to the limit of its tolerance by someone's behaviour. If you have a fear of being attacked, I think it is up to you to know how to avoid confrontations with working dogs, but I do concede that owners who have trained their dogs to be aggressive also have a responsibility to ensure those dogs don't threaten the safety of the public in general.

I generally stay on the path but keep walking towards a barking dog and talk to it quietly, and will offer the back of my hand for it to sniff if it gets close. If it keeps barking or starts to bare its teeth and snarl at this point, I move on. If it wants to sniff my hand I let it. Over several Caminos I have been nipped once on the back of my hand by a nasty little long nosed terrier when I didn't sense its change in mood when doing this.

I find the saddest dogs are those in house and farm yards that, when you approach, go running off, then come running back, and repeating this the whole time you are walking past. There was one that after a couple of cycles was pretty much spinning on the spot. I couldn't help but wonder what had driven it to this. I couldn't watch any more, and had to keep walking to give it some relief from this erratic behaviour.

I have never, fortunately, met a farm dog that has been truly aggressive, although I have walked past some dogs guarding business premises that I'm happy are on the other side of a high fence! They are truly disturbing to see, knowing that they may have been trained to attack when no handler is present.

In the main, my interactions with dogs have generally been unremarkable. The few really aggressive ones have been on chains or enclosed yards, and those few that haven't been generally lose interest as I keep moving.

 

[David Tallan]

If there is anything that is universally applicable is that all dogs will bite.

Yet I have walked by many dogs that did not bite, as have many others who commented above. So clearly the sentence, as written above, is nor universally applicable. Maybe if you extended it to "all dogs will bite if sufficiently provoked" but that implies what dog bites are always the result of provocations, which is also disputed by testimony above. I think I will have to continue in my belief that this thread shows that universally applicable experiences rarely are so.

 

[dougfitz]

Yet I have walked by many dogs that did not bite, as have many others who commented above. So clearly the sentence, as written above, is nor universally applicable. Maybe if you extended it to "all dogs will bite if sufficiently provoked" but that implies what dog bites are always the result of provocations, which is also disputed by testimony above. I think I will have to continue in my belief that this thread shows that universally applicable experiences rarely are so.

@David Tallan, the fact that a dog didn't bite you when you walked past is not evidence that it won't bite. Some dogs might go through their lives without biting because they have never been put into the circumstances where that is their natural or learned response. Others will take a snap at every passing stranger.

I don't see any need to caveat my statement here. There is one universally applicable truth, and that is all dogs will bite. You just don't want to be the person that is there when they feel compelled to, whether by your behaviour or someone or something else happening around them.

 

[David Tallan]

@David Tallan, the fact that a dog didn't bite you when you walked past is not evidence that it won't bite. Some dogs might go through their lives without biting because they have never been put into the circumstances where that is their natural or learned response. Others will take a snap at every passing stranger.

I don't see any need to caveat my statement here. There is one universally applicable truth, and that is all dogs will bite. You just don't want to be the person that is there when they feel compelled to, whether by your behaviour or someone or something else happening around them.

I think we are using the language differently. If there is a dog that goes through its whole life without biting, in my use of the language to say that it will bite is inaccurate.

All dogs can bite, all dogs might bite, sure. All dogs will bite, in reference to a dog that lives its whole life without biting makes no sense to me.

 

[Arctic_Alex]

Saying all dogs will bite (as in for every dog there are circumstances under which it will) is the same as saying every human will apply aggressive and potentially lethal violence given the right circumstances. Both statements are in principle true.

 

[David Tallan]

Saying all dogs will bite (as in for every dog there are circumstances under which it will) is the same as saying every human will apply aggressive and potentially lethal violence given the right circumstances. Both statements are in principle true.

For me there is a difference between saying all dogs will bite and saying for all dogs there are circumstances where they will bite.

There are circumstances where the Toronto Maple Leafs will win the Stanley Cup. That is true. But I wouldn't say that it is equivalent to saying the Toronto Maple Leafs will win the Stanley Cup. For the latter to be true, the circumstances have to come to pass. Clearly, the circumstances do not come to pass for all dogs, which is why many dogs live their entire lives without biting anyone.

 

[Arctic_Alex]

For me there is a difference between saying all dogs will bite and saying for all dogs there are circumstances where they will bite.

There are circumstances where the Toronto Maple Leafs will win the Stanley Cup. That is true. But I wouldn't say that it is equivalent to saying the Toronto Maple Leafs will win the Stanley Cup. For the latter to be true, the circumstances have to come to pass. Clearly, the circumstances do not come to pass for all dogs, which is why many dogs live their entire lives without biting anyone.

This is what I think was meant by the original statement even though it was not phrased in a really precise way originally. I agree the general statement is of limited value and to illustrate this I made a comparable statement for humans I could also say all ships will sink under certain circumstances or whatever.

 

[Grammy Kin]

To return to the original question… we had one of the ultrasonic handheld things when we walked in France last year. We knew we would be off-route at times - where most of the worrying encounters take place - and thought this might be a good answer, instead of pepper spray. Unfortunately, when we tried It out, there seemed to be no reaction by nearby dogs, so we eventually trashed it. Later we were charged by pit bulls at one farm in the middle of nowhere and they blocked our way ahead. We had to rely on our walking sticks and yells to the owners before we could continue. I doubt the thingamajig would have helped.
Sure, on most routes, especially the CF, dogs lying in the sun ignoring you remind you that you’re merely one in thousands, but when you’ve accidentally gone the wrong way or intentionally detoured, the situation can be very different. The idea of spraying the ground is intriguing.

 

[dick bird]

To return to the original question… we had one of the ultrasonic handheld things when we walked in France last year. We knew we would be off-route at times - where most of the worrying encounters take place - and thought this might be a good answer, instead of pepper spray. Unfortunately, when we tried It out, there seemed to be no reaction by nearby dogs, so we eventually trashed it. Later we were charged by pit bulls at one farm in the middle of nowhere and they blocked our way ahead. We had to rely on our walking sticks and yells to the owners before we could continue. I doubt the thingamajig would have helped.
Sure, on most routes, especially the CF, dogs lying in the sun ignoring you remind you that you’re merely one in thousands, but when you’ve accidentally gone the wrong way or intentionally detoured, the situation can be very different. The idea of spraying the ground is intriguing.

This is what some of us have been trying to point out - you were on their territory they challenged but did not attack you. Had you used pepper spray on them, the owner could have prosecuted you. It is not the solution.

 

[Grammy Kin]

Well, obviously they were guarding. But we were on a road, not their property technically. We stopped. Had we advanced they very well may have attacked us. So, back to the OP’s post - is there another technique/item available and effective for those of us who aren’t ready to get kumbaya with vicious dogs?

 

[Anthony18]

I know... I know....

Everyone says do the pick-up-a-stone trick or wave your poles at them....
...or yell "NO" in Spanish (umm??...)

But I want the bestest high-tech dog repellent that there is.
Flexible on weight.
Much appreciation.

Not saying it can't happen, but I never encountered a mean dog throughtout the entire camino. I thru-hiked it from SJPP to SDC. Now, I did make sure to never go out of my way and approach dogs to pet or feed them. I'd see them and stay clear, but I never had a dog approach me or come at me in an aggressive manner. Maybe you can get a small air horn in Spain.

 

[Pilgrim9]

Now to my mind that is a more scary result; i wouldn't want to bump into the Pilgrim that did that!!!

I think I would want to brush my teeth afterwards.

 

[Trekker One]

I've never had an issue with dogs in six Camino's. Met so many friendly ones looking for an ear scratch I've lost count.
Viscous dogs on the Camino is largely an imaginary problem some Camino first timers freet about completely needlessly. Kind of like bed bugs.
You certainly don't want to hit dogs with your poles or throw rocks at them

 

[Grammy Kin]

No need to be dismissive. Yes, in the 900 miles we walked the length of France, that was our one major encounter, but it certainly was a stopper. On our other caminos in Spain and Portugal, the times dogs approached us were usually when we’d accidentally gotten off route, and they generally were just curious. I thought the OP raised a valid question. Apparently many disagree.

 

[dougfitz]

Viscous dogs on the Camino is largely an imaginary problem some Camino first timers freet about completely needlessly.

As someone who has walked more than one pilgrimage, so not a first timer, and having walking places other than the Iberian Peninsula with its almost unique dog culture, I find it disappointing that what are quite legitimate concerns are dismissed like this.

You certainly don't want to hit dogs with your poles or throw rocks at them if I am around or else I would be your problem...

I might not agree with all the methods being proposed in this thread, but if the circumstances arose where a dog was close enough to be fended off with a walking pole, and exhibiting aggressive behaviour, I wouldn't hold back. I'm not going to go chasing a dog like that, but I'm not going to just let it keep coming at me either.

 

[dick bird]

Viscous dogs on the Camino is largely an imaginary problem

Exaggerated maybe, but imaginary certainly not. Just because something has not happened to you does not mean it has not happened to others.

 

[Arctic_Alex]

I've never had an issue with dogs in six Camino's. Met so many friendly ones looking for an ear scratch I've lost count.
Viscous dogs on the Camino is largely an imaginary problem some Camino first timers freet about completely needlessly. Kind of like bed bugs.
You certainly don't want to hit dogs with your poles or throw rocks at them if I am around or else I would be your problem...

I would actually say bed bugs are a bigger problem, but while there are many friendly dogs on the Camino you may have bad luck. So probabilities are lower than some first-timers might think, but the issue is real. It is a combination of sometimes careless dog owners or even those owners who push their dog to be overly aggressive by undermining the dog‘s trust in humans one one side and sometimes careless or outright wrong behaviour of pilgrims who know little to nothing about dogs and their psychology.
I have seen both on both of my Caminos.

I am a dog person.

 

[kelleymac]

We had no problems with dogs on the camino. I was missing my dogs at home and with a sad smile, noticed dogs here and there, sometimes watching me and sometime completely ignoring me. I did get barked at and approached from behind once by a very small dog once. I just turned, spoke gently, and swung my walking stick in a circle around my feet. The dog went home. I have found in my time in France, Germany and Spain-- dogs are far better socialized with humans than here in the US. Dogs can be taken on the bus, in restaurants, to cafes, in taxis. -- Here is a photo of a dog somewhere between me and Conques ignoring me. (She looked like my dog at home.)

 

[VNwalking]

Because there are literally hundreds of posts on here about nuisance dogs and dog attacks on the Camino.

That does not mean there are hundreds of attacks. In 7 caminos I have rarely met with an aggressive dog. Chill...there is little to be concerned about, especially walking tbe Francés.

Exaggerated maybe, but imaginary certainly not. Just because something has not happened to you does not mean it has not happened to others.

Very exaggerated.
There are some places where dogs are known to have been problematic (like near Barxa on the Invierno), but even then it's not worth carrying 'protection'. Loud firm words work.

 

[Chomps]

There are some places where dogs are known to have been problematic (like near Barxa on the Invierno)

It makes sense that there would be dog problems in a place called 'Barxa'.

 

[MARSKA]

Loud whistle? put it in your pocket or around your neck.

 

[hecate105]

We have just cycled around Portugal and Spain (serendipitously on Camino routes!) and have had a total mixture of dog behaviour - I carry dog biscuits in a plastic tub on my handlebars - and when a dog runs out at me - i throw a biscuit at it and pedal madly - that mostly works... sometimes they think it is a stone and back off - sometimes they stop to eat the biscuit - but some just ignore the biscuit and keep on after you..... Most are on long leashes - and then you can pray they do not snap... but many are guarding farms and livestock and they will attack! Shouting 'No' loudly and 'get away ' in Spanish/Portuguese seems to work with some - as does wielding a stick or stone.... I have been chased by about a dozen or so this trip (10 weeks) it has made me a faster cyclist.....!
I love dogs - but after cycling in Asia and Iberia - I am much more vigilant for untethered dogs... I did get bitten this time - but by a dog on a campsite - on a lead.....! It hurt, but it healed!
Vigilance and having a stick - or use your water bottle - as my husband does.
I will have a collapsible walking stick handy in a plastic bottle holder next time - as well as the dog biscuits of course!!

 

[kelleymac]

I am glad you are a dog person. This story is for non-dog people

Once in days gone by.... There were about 15 dogs running about and playing on the Cornell University Arts Quad-- completely ignoring everyone in a mad game of chase and leap. Then this guy walked onto the quad, froze and stared at the dogs. After a minute or two, one dog noticed him, and looking at him, gave a low "rooo-hooo". The person continued to stare, locking eyes with the dog. Other dogs turned to see what was happening and looked at the human. The human started screaming, one dog walked slowly towards him (unagressively). The dogs' humans (standing nearby), intervened at this point calling their dogs. No one was bitten, but the poor man was terrified and had no idea that his actions called the dogs' attention. Making prolonged eye contact and being frozen in position is weird behavior for a human and it put the dogs on alert. -- Many humans are unaware of how they are coming across to animals.

 

[DoughnutANZ]

Some trauma is so deep that it overrides conscious thought.

When I was 5 years old and exploring on my own I came across two guard dogs that had been trained to attack.

Of course, being trained to attack that is exactly what they did. Their mauling of me put me into hospital. Fortunately my screams of terror attracted the dogs' owner who was able to intervene and save my life.

If you are rude enough and look closely you can still see the external scars on my face.

The mental scars are only obvious from my behaviour.

If a large dog that I don't know approaches me, even if it is not being obviously aggressive I start go into fight or flight mode. This is not a conscious choice on my part but sometimes if I spot the dog early enough I can force myself to override my triggers.

Today, while walking from Manzanares to Cercedilla I had two dog encounters that were significant for me but may not have been obviously so if you happened to observe them.

The first incident involved one of those huge sheep dogs that seem to be as big as a horse.

I noticed it sitting in the shade, unleashed and by itself at the same time that it noticed me. It got up and started walking towards me, no obvious aggression but if I hadn't just urinated a few minutes beforehand I am sure that I would have wet myself because this is the stuff of my worst nightmares!

Fortunately for me, at that same exact time a man riding a horse came around the corner in front of me and the huge dog lost interest in me and started walking towards the horse, much to the constenation of the horse rider.

Meanwhile, I quietly sidled to the other side of the path, put my head down and walked slowly on. Internally fighting every urge in my body to run.

The dog was merely interested in me and the horse, nothing happened, it showed no aggression at all.

I am not sure that I would have been able to control myself in the absence of the horse.

Second incident was about an hour later when I was walking through an industrialised area of a small town. As I walked past a fence I heard a quick movement behind me.

My second worst nightmare is being silently attacked from behind by a dog.

In this case it was two dogs, not a sound except them running (behind a fence) and so I got a huge shock but then saw that they were behind the fence and so was able to relax enough to notice that they were both very young, barely out of puppyhood and looking like they wanted someone to notice them and pat them.

Patting an unknown dog is a stretch too far for me and so I walked on.

I can understand the person described in the previous post, that could be me in certain circumstances, especially if there was a pack of dogs.

To be clear, I don't dislike dogs nor do I fundamentally wish them harm. It is just that certain actions from dogs trigger me and my greatest wish is that all dogs would be as well trained as police and other service dogs. Then I would have some confidence that their behaviour might be predictable.

Lastly, and of no particular significance, my children all love dogs and they wanted dogs when they were younger but I never allowed that. Now my oldest daughter has a service dog that she uses in her child psychotherapy practice and he and I get on quite well.

 

[henrythedog]

I could start a similar thread about moths.

My mother had a severe phobia of moths and, her extreme behaviour if one was in the house when I was about 3-4 years of age gave me a much milder but still significant aversion. I know they’re not going to chew your throat out, but bear with me.

There are dogs pretty much everywhere; good and less good; but typically reacting to human stimulus in a way they’ve been trained to or learned through bitter experience.

There’s nothing special about ‘dogs on Camino’ and setting out armed in expectation of a confrontation is IMHO utterly irrational.

By the time you’ve added pepper spray for dogs and humans, a camera for flashers, a security chain for backpack theft, a phone with 911 (or 121 in Europe) on redial tightly grasped in your hand, a RFID (God help us) wallet for your cards and so on you’ll only have room for a change of underwear.

 

[David]

Just curious… why would one need dog repellent on the Camino? Are you afraid of dogs? We come from a neighborhood of many dogs, but whether on or off leash they are always with their owners and under voice control. And we have our own dogs so personally wouldn’t be fearful. Am I missing something?

There are dogs without leads or nearby owners, plenty.

Agree with Doug - all dogs will bite, given the 'right' circumstances. Their DNA is Wolf, a predator, actually, a seriously good predator, especially in a pack.

 

[henrythedog]

I do wonder if we all need to take a minute to calm down a bit.

 

[DoughnutANZ]

By and large, dogs aren't the problem. In my experience it's the owners who are the problem. They are either too dumb to know that every interaction that they have with their dog is training it or they are one of those macho types who think that is good to train your dog to be aggressive.

One good example, one time I went to visit a friend who has a dog. Nice dog. The dog has a habit of standing up and putting its paws on you.

I said to my friend, "many people, especially women would find that objectionable". His reply was "Oh that's just his personality, I love it, why would I change it?" Then I said I find it objectionable, to which he didn't reply. The next time that the dog did it to me I kneed it in the stomach and turned sideways.

Smart dog, it only took doing this three times for it to never do it to me again.

 

[Tincatinker]

Little Dog says she is afraid of humans. Apparently they act irrationally: they do fear or flight stuff when she’s just trying to say hello and they do attack lunges at her when she is just ignoring them. She is puzzled because after somewhere near a million years of close association she thinks that if we were anywhere near as clever as we appear to think we are we would have got an, at least tenuous, grip on homo/cana relationships.

She will never bite a human. Even that 18 month old nightmare that thinks she likes being dragged around the kitchen by her ears. Except that human whose smell she doesn’t recognize moving to quickly towards the nightmare.
Sorry Doctor.

Ah, I remember now. Big bad dog repellent: get a bigger, badder, dog. Or a Terrier. The Terrier is likely the more effective

 

[henrythedog]

Little Dog says she is afraid of humans. Apparently they act irrationally: they do fear or flight stuff when she’s just trying to say hello and they do attack lunges at her when she is just ignoring them. She is puzzled because after somewhere near a million years of close association she thinks that if we were anywhere near as clever as we appear to think we are we would have got an, at least tenuous, grip on homo/cana relationships.

She will never bite a human. Even that 18 month old nightmare that thinks she likes being dragged around the kitchen by her ears. Except that human whose smell she doesn’t recognize moving to quickly towards the nightmare.
Sorry Doctor.

Ah, I remember now. Big bad dog repellent: get a bigger, badder, dog. Or a Terrier. The Terrier is likely the more effective

The difference between a terrier and a terrorist?

You can negotiate with a terrorist.

 

[David]

Loving all this. So, they say that if you take a bomb onto an aeroplane you will be completely safe because the odds of two bombs being on one aeroplane are so astronomical that it will never happen. So, working on that logic, take a madly attacking aggressive dog with you, the chances of two in the same place at the same time surely are also astronomically slim????

 

[VNwalking]

By the time you’ve added pepper spray for dogs and humans, a camera for flashers, a security chain for backpack theft, a phone with 911 (or 121 in Europe) on redial tightly grasped in your hand, a RFID (God help us) wallet for your cards and so on you’ll only have room for a change of underwear.

That's why people need luggage transfer.
And don't forget the airtags so they can be tracked if they don't appear at the destination.

The post hits a nsil squarely on the head
There's a general tenor of fearfulness about many aspects of walking a camino that's predominant and unnecessary. And it seems to be getting worse. If it's not dogs it would be something else.

 

[Flatlander]

There's a general tenor of fearfulness about many aspects of walking a camino that's predominant and unnecessary. And it seems to be getting worse. If it's not dogs it would be something else.

Unfortunately, fear doesn't follow logic.

When a fear rises there are essentially three choices:
Live with it (Be anxious every time a dog is in the vicinity)
Tackle the cause (learn about dogs and dog behaviour)
Or prepare to deal with the fear becoming reality (pack pepper spray, a taser and whatever else)

Only one of those leads to a calm mind.

Unfortunately, a lot of societies focus far too much on fear.

Here's a 33 sec video that I like on fear

Edited to add
I'm not a fan of diminishing people's fears. They can seem very real.

 

[Tincatinker]

There's a general tenor of fearfulness about many aspects of walking a camino that's predominant and unnecessary

@VNwalking isn’t that the saddest part of what is happening to our beloved Camino. It was always supposed to be a challenge, it was always supposed to be a bit scary. A long walk in a country of which we knew little or perhaps too much if we’d ever paid any attention to European history. A long walk; down to the chemists is a long way as the blessed Douglas Adams had it.
And now we find that Camino has to be “safe”, safe from all challenges: a safe space full of comfy beds, yummy meals, perfect families of random people who all think just like you and your own private flushing toilet.

Last time out I was gonna complain to the cruise director but they wos hiding in their cabin screaming “why, why, why?”