Staying in Spain longer than 6 months (EU citizen)

[Luka]

I have a question which isn't directly related to the Camino, but as this is such a brilliant resource, I'll give it a try. I know there are other 'foreigners' here living in Spain.

After my Camino del Norte this summer I have plans to stay in Spain for maybe a full year. I will be working as a volunteer in different projects (hopefully as a hospitalera too). In that year I want to find out if there is a way I could move to Spain permanently.

I understand it is not allowed to stay in Spain as a tourist/visitor for longer than 6 months. So I am trying to figure out how to do this. I'll have to keep my administration in the Netherlands (because of taxes, owning a house and having a registration at the Chamber of Commerce, among other reasons). I won't have a fixed address in Spain (more roaming around) and I don't intend to earn any money there. I might work as a copywriter, but only for customers in the Netherlands (online, like a digital nomad).

So, what to do? Will the Spanish authorities even notice that I am there? I am planning to fly back home for a week or so over Christmas, to visit my parents. Will that wake up the authorities? Is there any way to organize this legally, without giving up my registration in the Netherlands?

 

[natefaith]

Hola Luka,
Since you're an EU citizen you have an advantage over us for sure . I'm more familiar with the US - Schengen rules but not as familiar with the EU laws - are you not allowed to keep your Dutch ID and still move around freely in Spain after 6 months?

My friend has German and American passports (his mom is German) and he was able to register with the Spanish national police and get a Spanish ID card (a DNI - documento nacional de identidad). He did not previously have a German ID card, which may be the main reason he had to obtain a Spanish ID card. He did have a fixed Spanish address, though.

I'd recommend that once you come to Spain and have a moment that you check with the police about what you need to do. In Santiago the "extranjería" (immigration office) is in the same building as the national police - so if you're here it might be an easy stop, in case the first department you go to within the building isn't the correct one.

Since you're an EU citizen I don't think flying out and back in will wake up the authorities. I've known people from North America and South America being held in detention for overstaying the 90-day rule, but I've not heard of any EU citizens getting in trouble. But of course I could be wrong!

Keep us updated on what you learn.
Faith

 

[JabbaPapa]

I have a question which isn't directly related to the Camino, but as this is such a brilliant resource, I'll give it a try. I know there are other 'foreigners' here living in Spain.

After my Camino del Norte this summer I have plans to stay in Spain for maybe a full year. I will be working as a volunteer in different projects (hopefully as a hospitalera too). In that year I want to find out if there is a way I could move to Spain permanently.

First, you should check what the Spanish Law says, as the implementation of EU directives can vary from country to country.

Nevertheless :

http://ec.europa.eu/justice/policies/citizenship/docs/guide_free_movement_low.pdf

p. 16 -- "Workers, self-employed, providers of services Workers and self-employed persons have the right to reside without any conditions other than being a worker or self-employed person. The same right applies to persons who temporarily provide services in the host EU country."

p. 15 -- "Special treatment for job-seekers : EU citizens benefit from the right to reside without any conditions and formalities for a period of six months and even longer, if they continue to seek employment in the host EU country and have a genuine chance of getting work."

p. 17 -- "It is a personal right : The right to reside in another EU country is your fundamental and personal right and is granted to you directly by the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. The right is therefore not dependent upon you having fulfilled administrative procedures. This basically means that once you meet the conditions, you have the right to reside from that moment and your right is not granted to you by a decision of the host EU country. The documents you or your family members might be issued with by the host EU country merely acknowledge that you have the right. However, if you fail to register or your family member’s residence card expires, your right to reside cannot be terminated if you still meet the conditions. You may be subject to a proportionate and non-discriminatory administrative sanction for your failure to observe the national rules."

 

[Luka]

Thank you @natefaith and @JabbaPapa for your quick and elaborate responses! You are right about my Dutch passport. That will be sufficient to travel around in Spain. I am priviliged as a EU-citizen for that.

What I don't know: I might need to register myself somehow in Spain. For example getting a NIE. And there I might get into trouble. First of all, I thought that a fixed address in Spain is necessary to register, and I simply don't have that. Second, legally I might have to pay taxes in Spain (instead of in the Netherlands), because within the EU they look at in which country you have stayed the biggest part of the year. That will get me into a lot of administrative trouble, because of still having a house and earning money in the Netherlands (considering I'll have clients as a copywriter). These are typical problems a lot of digital nomads have nowadays: there are no rules for us yet.

That's why I was wondering: what would happen if I simply wouldn't let the authorities know that I am there?

 

[Luka]

The right is therefore not dependent upon you having fulfilled administrative procedures. This basically means that once you meet the conditions, you have the right to reside from that moment and your right is not granted to you by a decision of the host EU country. The documents you or your family members might be issued with by the host EU country merely acknowledge that you have the right. However, if you fail to register or your family member’s residence card expires, your right to reside cannot be terminated if you still meet the conditions. You may be subject to a proportionate and non-discriminatory administrative sanction for your failure to observe the national rules."

Reading this for a second time now, would this be the answer? Does it simply say: 'When you haven't applied for any documents and the authorities have found out you are there, you still have the right to stay if you meet the conditions?'

 

[JabbaPapa]

what would happen if I simply wouldn't let the authorities know that I am there?

Probably nothing -- you're in a stable situation and paying your taxes, but it would be a good idea to alert the authorities if you set yourself up somewhere a bit more permanently, i.e for longer than about 3-6 months. You could look perhaps at a secondary residence status if that's possible ?

But your basic problem will be tax, though you cannot be subjected to dual taxation. For such matters, you'd be well advised to find out from a lawyer, perhaps when you're in Spain by telling them you're thinking of moving there and ask what you need to do and what the consequences are, rather than asking complete strangers on the internet

 

[JabbaPapa]

Reading this for a second time now, would this be the answer? Does it simply say: 'When you haven't applied for any documents and the authorities have found out you are there, you still have the right to stay if you meet the conditions?'

Rather than a right to stay, it means that it makes it difficult for them to extradite you in most cases where you haven't secured that right.

Again, you really really should find out from local sources.

 

[Luka]

But your basic problem will be tax, though you cannot be subjected to dual taxation. For such matters, you'd be well advised to find out from a lawyer, perhaps when you're in Spain by telling them you're thinking of moving there and ask what you need to do and what the consequences are, rather than asking complete strangers on the internet

I love paying taxes. It just gets very complicated if I'll have to do that in Spain, so I prefer to pay taxes in the Netherlands.
And yes, you are right of course!
The thing is, asking the authorities, I would prefer to let sleeping dogs lie. And I wonder if a lawyer would ever give me an illegal advice.

 

[Luka]

Again, you really really should find out from local sources.

I will try to do that too (am already trying to). But because so far there doesn't seem to be a legal way, I was hoping for experiences from other foreigners in Spain that would give me an idea of the possibilities I have.

 

[MinaKamina]

Your problem may not be with Spain, but (possibly) with the Netherlands.
Digital Nomad Esther Jacobs has written about the problems that she got into with the council of the town she calls home..
The Netherlands have a rule that you have to sleep at home at least six months a year in order to be registered as a citizen.
This registration is the basis for everything, from pensions to taxes, driving licence and passport, voting rights, Chamber of Commerce.
In the case of Esther, the council became aware that she was travelling more than those six months, and they started a formal investigation.
Blog by Esther Jacobs (in Dutch): https://estherjacobs.info/blog/2013/02/ik-pas-niet-in-het-systeem-2/

If you think this is totally Kafka, yes that is what it is.

 

[natefaith]

Thank you @natefaith and @JabbaPapa for your quick and elaborate responses! You are right about my Dutch passport. That will be sufficient to travel around in Spain. I am priviliged as a EU-citizen for that.

What I don't know: I might need to register myself somehow in Spain. For example getting a NIE. And there I might get into trouble. First of all, I thought that a fixed address in Spain is necessary to register, and I simply don't have that. Second, legally I might have to pay taxes in Spain (instead of in the Netherlands), because within the EU they look at in which country you have stayed the biggest part of the year. That will get me into a lot of administrative trouble, because of still having a house and earning money in the Netherlands (considering I'll have clients as a copywriter). These are typical problems a lot of digital nomads have nowadays: there are no rules for us yet.

That's why I was wondering: what would happen if I simply wouldn't let the authorities know that I am there?

Hi Luka,
My American-German friend didn't have to get a NIE; instead he got a DNI. This, I think, was because he has an EU passport, and the NIE is for non-EU citizens (at least, that was the impression we all got from the national police when my friend went through the process). Again, I could be very wrong here! But I know for sure my friend got a DNI. In your case, though, whether it's a DNI or a NIE may not matter to you right now, since your concern is whether you should even register with the Spanish government.

Your concern about taxes is a valid one. Our asesor said that those who have been living in Spain longer than (something like) 183 days have to file taxes. Our teammate arrived on July 4 and just made it under the 183-day threshold, and she didn't have to file taxes for that year. Whew! I'm not sure what to tell you about living in Spain yet still being able to only file taxes in Holland, but you could check with an asesoría here.

 

[Luka]

Thanks again!

@Kathar1na I have been digging in Dutch law for a while now. I think I know everything there is to know. It's complicated, because the law doesn't take into account the digital nomad lifestyle. A rather famous Dutch digital nomad even wrote a book about this. You more or less fall in between the rules. So everyone finds his/her own way to deal with this, depending on their personal situation. In my case to keep Dutch residence is important for a number of reasons.

@natefaith you are right about those 183 days, thanks for the reminder! That would save my butt for taxes, because I will arrive in Spain on the 4th of July and leave before the 30th of June, which would make the Netherlands my primary country of residence for both years, taxwise.

I still think a Spanish residence card wouldn't be an option, because of my Dutch residence and not having a fixed address. I'll have to sort that out a little further on both sides (Dutch and Spanish).

 

[Jersey]

How would the healthcare work in this situation?
I'm a US citizen & have looked into living in Spain for a year.
I would have to prove I have the means to support myself.
But I also have to prove I have health care coverage.
I assume so I won't be a burden on Spain if I get sick.

 

[Patch]

Hi, not sure about the digital nomad bit making you different. I have lived and worked (although not mutually exclusively)in Luxembourg, Belgium, Germany and France (but not Spain) over the years. I simply registered at the local police station and/or town hall and that was it. For tax purposes I was declared "Non taxable" here in the UK and my tax base shifted to the country I was in. The only complicated bit as I remember was trying to get myself back into the UK tax system after I had finished my wanderings. But....their are all sorts of complications with such things as inheritance - depends on which countries. I do know that if you are residing in Spain you should do them a favour and register - the cost of any health care you need is reimbursed by the UK to the Spanish government.

 

[MinaKamina]

Hi, not sure about the digital nomad bit making you different. I have lived and worked (although not mutually exclusively)in Luxembourg, Belgium, Germany and France (but not Spain) over the years. I simply registered at the local police station and/or town hall and that was it. For tax purposes I was declared "Non taxable" here in the UK and my tax base shifted to the country I was in. The only complicated bit as I remember was trying to get myself back into the UK tax system after I had finished my wanderings. But....their are all sorts of complications with such things as inheritance - depends on which countries. I do know that if you are residing in Spain you should do them a favour and register - the cost of any health care you need is reimbursed by the UK to the Spanish government.

Being a digital nomad does make a difference, because you do not need to be in the same country as your clients or in the same country where your company is registered.. It is vastly different from the situation where you have a job or contract as an expat, there are many regulations for that, and companies know how to manage them.
The best option for a digital nomad imho is to never get sick and don't let the authorities notice you, until you have fully established what you want to do.

 

[Luka]

I read Esther's Blog about how she was struck from being domiciled in her own country despite owning property there.

Yes, she is the wellknown Dutch digital nomad I am talking about! Her situation has even led to a short discussion in the Dutch pariament, but so far nothing has changed.

Otoh, based on my own and a close family member's experience again (and that includes 3 EU countries) if you have a really tiny footprint, so to speak, i.e. move without having to deal a lot with authorities, not needing social security benefits etc, not buying property, not renting, not working, nobody cares or takes note where you are or what you do.

This exactly my situation and that's why I am contemplating not to make myself known to the Spanish authorities.

I don't know about NL law but if you are self-employed and have a VAT number, that may also be an important point of consideration.

That is one of the reason I would like to keep my registration in the Netherlands. I am self-employed, have a VAT number and a registration at the Dutch Chamber of Commerce.

I personally would be most concerned about sickness insurance, i.e. staying in my national system or securing my rights to return to it again if I want to. Potential pitfalls there, again depending on individual EU countries concerned and your individual situation (age limits for example).

That is another reason I want to keep my Dutch registration. As long as I have a residence here, my healthcare costs are covered, also in Spain.

 

[Luka]

How would the healthcare work in this situation?
I'm a US citizen & have looked into living in Spain for a year.
I would have to prove I have the means to support myself.
But I also have to prove I have health care coverage.
I assume so I won't be a burden on Spain if I get sick.

I do have a health care coverage, as long as I keep my Dutch residency. I probably would have to prove I have the means to support myself if I would make myself known to the Spanish authorities. I am just afraid I would fall in between the rules in Spain as well...

Being a digital nomad does make a difference, because you do not need to be in the same country as your clients or in the same country where your company is registered.. It is vastly different from the situation where you have a job or contract as an expat, there are many regulations for that, and companies know how to manage them. The best option for a digital nomad imho is to never get sick and don't let the authorities notice you, until you have fully established what you want to do.

You are right, it is different. So far I guess your suggestion would be my best option. Getting sick won't be a financial problem though.

 

[Ribeirasacra]

My wife is Dutch. If you live in Spain for more than 183 cumulative days in one calendar year you are liable to pay taxes in Spian.
You are correct that the tax law does not take into account any "freedom of moment" I do not know any country that does.
You may also have to pay taxes over any assets you hold outside of Spain.
In general Spain is not the most tax friendly country to live in.
Once you have your NIE you are "traceable" .
I give you two links. This one is non bias and information is quite clear.
ANGLOFILE
And one from a tax advisor which I think helps to reinforce the information. Maybe a bit more on how to set up your comapny here if you choose to do so.
ADVOCO
There is a forum for Dutch who want to and live in Spain. There is a small fee of 2.50€ to be able to ask questions, whilst reading it is free. This is to stop the spammers joining.
Fourm
Hope this makes up your mind if the move to this part of the world is worth the move.

 

[JohnnieWalker]

You need to distinguish between Spanish residence card, national ID card/national passport. They are three distinctly different legal documents and how many of the three you can hold at any given time depends on the laws of both of your country of nationality and your country of residence. If you are not Spanish you won't get a Spanish ID card, you will get a Spanish residence card - tarjeta de residencia - even if it may look nearly the same as the ID cards of Spanish nationals.

Targetas de residencia are no longer issued - rather for EU citizens a Certificado de Registro de Cuidadano de la Union is issued.

 

[JohnnieWalker]

Hi Luka,
My American-German friend didn't have to get a NIE; instead he got a DNI. This, I think, was because he has an EU passport, and the NIE is for non-EU citizens (at least, that was the impression we all got from the national police when my friend went through the process). Again, I could be very wrong here! But I know for sure my friend got a DNI. In your case, though, whether it's a DNI or a NIE may not matter to you right now, since your concern is whether you should even register with the Spanish government.

Your concern about taxes is a valid one. Our asesor said that those who have been living in Spain longer than (something like) 183 days have to file taxes. Our teammate arrived on July 4 and just made it under the 183-day threshold, and she didn't have to file taxes for that year. Whew! I'm not sure what to tell you about living in Spain yet still being able to only file taxes in Holland, but you could check with an asesoría here.

Hi - you are correct about the 183 day rule but I think wrong about the DNI as far as EU citizens are concerned. EU citizens living in Spain for longer that 183 days nowadays are issued with a Certificado de Registro de Ciudadano de la Union. This Certificate contains the NIE number - Numero de Identidad de Extranjero. It is effectively an identity number without which you cannot open a bank account or sign contracts. It serves as your tax reference number.

In terms of tax EU citizens are also subject to a Double Taxation agreement - which basically means you don't pay tax in both your country of origin and in Spain. I am a tax resident in Spain but I continue to pay my taxes in the UK - and the Spanish authorities are content with that.

I've found the Hacienda - Spanish Tax office - to be very helpful.

I hope that this helps.

John

 

[natefaith]

Hi - you are correct about the 183 day rule but I think wrong about the DNI as far as EU citizens are concerned. EU citizens living in Spain for longer that 183 days nowadays are issued with a Certificado de Registro de Ciudadano de la Union. This Certificate contains the NIE number - Numero de Identidad de Extranjero. It is effectively an identity number without which you cannot open a bank account or sign contracts. It serves as your tax reference number.

In terms of tax EU citizens are also subject to a Double Taxation agreement - which basically means you don't pay tax in both your country of origin and in Spain. I am a tax resident in Spain but I continue to pay my taxes in the UK - and the Spanish authorities are content with that.

I've found the Hacienda - Spanish Tax office - to be very helpful.

I hope that this helps.

John

John, yes, I should have clarified in my post that the 183-day rule I referred to was applied to our American teammate (Gale) NOT an EU citizen. I don't know what the Spanish tax office does with EU citizens as well as I do with us Americans . I'm also starting to question whether or not our German friend has a DNI or not....I know it's not a pink NIE card.

 

[Luka]

@Kathar1na I have been in touch with my insurance company to sort things like that out. Thanks for the advice, very important indeed.

And yes, I have been mixing residence and tax paying. Taxwise I won't have a problem, as long as I return to the Netherlands before the 1st of July 2018 (which is the plan).

@Ribeirasacra thanks for the link to the Dutch forum. I got some answers there, but it is still not clear to me how they deal with persons who travel around in Spain. So far, it seems like I just should make myself known and prove that I am able to support myself and do have a healthcare insurance. But I am a bit afraid of Spanish bureaucracy...

 

[Luka]

EU citizens living in Spain for longer that 183 days nowadays are issued with a Certificado de Registro de Ciudadano de la Union. This Certificate contains the NIE number - Numero de Identidad de Extranjero. It is effectively an identity number without which you cannot open a bank account or sign contracts. It serves as your tax reference number.

Do you know whether this Certificado de Registro de Ciudadano de la Union has anything to do (or is linked with) empadronamiento? I don't want to register myself with any Spanish municipality (which would be a registration on paper, because I am moving around), because that might lead to losing my residence registration here in the Netherlands.

 

[JohnnieWalker]

Yes it does as you produce the empadronamiento as evidence of your residence.

But

If you simply want to travel around and don't intend to work, register with the health service or empadronamiento why not just get on with it without notifying anyone. Many, many people do this.

 

[Luka]

If you simply want to travel around and don't intend to work, register with the health service or empadronamiento why not just get on with it without notifying anyone. Many, many people do this.

Thanks for the encouragement! That is the other option I am considering. People on the Dutch forum are discouraging me to do that, because they say there are many ways I might encounter the authorities. But I can't think of a situation how I would. Taking into account that I won't break any law or commit any crime. It might save me an administrative Catch-22...

 

[JohnnieWalker]

Freedom of movement for EU citizens means just that. If you do not intend to work, buy property, open a bank account, enter into contracts - why would you need to register particularly if you intend to travel around?

 

[Luka]

Freedom of movement for EU citizens means just that. If you do not intend to work, buy property, open a bank account, enter into contracts - why would you need to register particularly if you intend to travel around?

Because you have to make yourself known if you stay in Spain for longer than 3 months. They want to know that you are there. Put you in the system. There still are a few rules coming with this freedom of movement for EU citizens. For example: if you are not an employee or a student, you have to prove that you are able to support yourself.

That would be the official answer. But if you are a digital nomad, you have to find your own way.

 

[Tuesday Wildchild]

Just do what a lot of British do here in france and cherry pick which laws/rules/regulations they feel they should follow.

We are not cherry pickers as it's cheaper to live in france than uk so why some do I don't know.

Sorry I'm of no help am I but that's me often.

 

[Tuesday Wildchild]

. That's what @Luka can't do so easily. Because the UK does not have an obligatory registration system similar to the Netherlands and to Spain and quite a few others, as far as I can tell. And I did look up the rules on Council tax just to make sure, the closest thing there is to it.

In fact, based again on first hand experience of a close family member, it's dead easy to register as a resident in one EU country (provided you fulfil all the requirements) and keep a residence in the UK at the same time when you are a UK passport holder.

Until Brexit it's easy.

 

[JohnnieWalker]

I know, again from first hand experience, that you can get into odd situations with the global right to move and reside freely vs the national obligation to register when the national rules of two EU countries collide, and it can be very frustrating when you want to be a law abiding citizen.

Perhaps it helps to know that one of the main reasons for obligatory registration is the interest of a municipality to know how many inhabitants there are overall or how many persons there are in a household because the numbers can determine their share of national or regional taxes or the amount they can raise in local taxes. Since you plan to be on the move anyway ... also, any sanctions - if they exist at all - for an EU citizen not registering in another EU country as resident (where this obligation exists) must be proportionate and must not be more severe than those for nationals who fail to register.

It's all a bit surprising, given the fact that Spain in particular is one of those EU countries where Northern pensioners go for winter holidays of more than 3 months.

I think that's absolutely correct. Under Spanish law there is an obligation to register at the Oficina de Extranjeros if planning to reside in Spain for longer than three months. I did this because I wanted the NIE number to open a bank account, lease a house and telephone and join the Spanish Health Service. However many people don't until they have to. What would the consequences be of coming contact with the authorities, for example when reporting a crime, and it emerged that you weren't registered but had been in the country longer than three months. I cannot find evidence of there being any sanction other than they will tell you to register as follows:

On 10 July 2012 the Spanish government introduced details of the new residency requirements for all EU citizens.
Under the new rules, EU citizens applying for residency in Spain may be required to produce evidence of sufficient financial means to support themselves (and dependants). Applicants may also be asked for proof of private or public healthcare insurance.

As far as Brexit is concerned @Tuesday Wildchild : there are many Spanish nationals living in the UK as there are UK nationals living in Spain. Inevitably reciprocal agreements will be put in place just as there are now.

I hope this helps.

John

 

[Ribeirasacra]

Hi - you are correct about the 183 day rule but I think wrong about the DNI as far as EU citizens are concerned. EU citizens living in Spain for longer that 183 days nowadays are issued with a Certificado de Registro de Ciudadano de la Union. This Certificate contains the NIE number - Numero de Identidad de Extranjero. It is effectively an identity number without which you cannot open a bank account or sign contracts. It serves as your tax reference number.

In terms of tax EU citizens are also subject to a Double Taxation agreement - which basically means you don't pay tax in both your country of origin and in Spain. I am a tax resident in Spain but I continue to pay my taxes in the UK - and the Spanish authorities are content with that.

I've found the Hacienda - Spanish Tax office - to be very helpful.

I hope that this helps.

John

We too have found them helpful. However we felt our gestoria, who has to work on a day to day basis with them, smooths some paths.
The double taxation is not covered by every country. The UK and Spain has it. But it is not an EU sort of thing but an agreement between two counties. As we do not "earn" money from the NL it is hard to say what the Dutch/Spanish have as an agreement.
ID cards are only issued these days to non Spanish who are citizens of a non EU country. Rumour has it a group of Brits. went to the EU courts to say they did not want ID cards as it infringed on their rights, saying something along the lines that the UK does not have them. Of course the clever ones got around this and issued certificates now. The large A4 certs. have been replaced with CC card sized plastified paper ones. Still not acceptable for ID as there is no photo.

@Kathar1na I have been in touch with my insurance company to sort things like that out. Thanks for the advice, very important indeed.

And yes, I have been mixing residence and tax paying. Taxwise I won't have a problem, as long as I return to the Netherlands before the 1st of July 2018 (which is the plan).

@Ribeirasacra thanks for the link to the Dutch forum. I got some answers there, but it is still not clear to me how they deal with persons who travel around in Spain. So far, it seems like I just should make myself known and prove that I am able to support myself and do have a healthcare insurance. But I am a bit afraid of Spanish bureaucracy...

The bureaucracy here has to be said is a nightmare. Sometimes the bod behind the desk as his view and nothing will change it. I am sure you can find someone in the NL who could advise you about the taxation agreements. Do you know you can even get your cars APK inspected in Spain? Look at the RDW website for information. That means you do not have to return when it is due. However there are none in this part of Spain.

 

[Tuesday Wildchild]

Why? Are there any plans afoot to introduce IDcards and the duty to register for all UK residents AFTER Brexit, lol? I don't think so, I know a thing or two about that debate . I did not want to bring up Brexit but the thought crossed my mind how often people blame the EU or EU law when the problem is actually a problem at the national level. And vice versa, how often they tout EU benefits and "it's like this for everyone everywhere in the EU" when it isn't. BTW, before Britain joined it wasn't that hard for a Brit to move to a (then EEC) country for work and to live there and I'm confident it will be the same after 2019. The card you will hold will have a different design, that's for sure. None of this helps to solve @Luka's dilemma.

EU and the EEC are two different things but that's not for here and now.

My comment was tounge in cheek and I don't expect much to change just a bit more paperwork.

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

OK, I'm American and have only been to Europe as a tourist so I have no advice to give and, if I did, you shouldn't listen to me. To me though it looks as Luka should not be considered a resident of Spain because she is not doing anything that a resident would do. However, as I understand it, if she isn't a resident she should only stay in Spain for 3 months. What if she left for a short time and came back? Going back for a short visit home in NL may have some advantages. Or entering Spain from a non-Schegen zone country so there is a stamp in her passport showing when she entered and then visiting a non-Schegen zone country before 3 months to show she left (I'm thinking Ireland, UK, Andorra or Morroco.) How long must an EU tourist be absent from Spain before returning as a tourist again?

 

[WGroleau]

Your problem may not be with Spain, but (possibly) with the Netherlands. ... The Netherlands have a rule that you have to sleep at home at least six months a year in order to be registered as a citizen.

I know very little about rules in EU, but I personally know a Dutch family that lives in Navarra. They do winter in Holland, but less than six months. They have done this for several years. I know another Dutch family that recently moved to Navarra, but I don't know their situation in Netherlands, as they spent the past six years in Australia.

 

[Luka]

@MinaKamina the rule is 4 months. But the problem is: there are some conflicting rules. You have to keep your Dutch health insurance when you leave the Netherlands for less than a year. One of the rules of my health insurance company is to be registered as a citizen in the Netherlands...

 

[MinaKamina]

@MinaKamina the rule is 4 months. But the problem is: there are some conflicting rules. You have to keep your Dutch health insurance when you leave the Netherlands for less than a year. One of the rules of my health insurance company is to be registered as a citizen in the Netherlands...

If it is 4 months, then things have improved a little. Esther Jacobs mentions 6 months.

Basically, if you want to get rid of your health insurance, you know what to do ... ... but I guess you want to remain insured for the time being.
Reading this thread over again, I can only conclude that this is a situation where you cannot be good, as they say, so be wise. And do what is best for you. You don't want your time & energy be taken away by bureaucratic hassle.
Hop over a border every now and then and keep the receipt from the ATM to keep Spain happy should they ask and return to the Netherlands maybe twice a year. I think in the case of Esther, the famlily who rented her house missed the letter from the council? Make sure that whoever receives your paper mail is aware of the importance. Should such a letter of inquiry arrive, if and when, you can probably answer it by mail if you use or activate your local mailbox.

Every situation is different. My health insurance would probably be aware of my being away long before the local council did, because I need certain medications and it would show if I got all of those in, say, Spain. I would not go back for those though, I'd make a call and have someone else pick up the prescription and forward it to me.

Don't let all of this hold you back. There is ample time to make the necessary changes if and when you decide to remain in Spain permanently.

 

[WGroleau]

… certain medications and it would show if I got all of those in, say, Spain. I would not go back for those though, I'd make a call and have someone else pick up the prescription and forward it to me.

Caution: Spanish law allows carrying in your meds but not mailing them in. I do not know what the penalty is for violation,nor how easy/hard it is to not get caught.

My thyroid meds cost me eighteen US dollars per month in USA (government pays part due to my military record). But in Spain, I get a hundred doses for less than seven euro with no prescription!

 

[MinaKamina]

Caution: Spanish law allows carrying in your meds but not mailing them in. I do not know what the penalty is for violation,nor how easy/hard it is to not get caught.

My thyroid meds cost me eighteen US dollars per month in USA (government pays part due to my military recortd). But in Spain, I get a hundred doses for less than seven euro with no prescription!

Postal agreements within the EU allow me to sends parcels to Spain (mainland) without a customs declaration. There is a list of exceptions, medications are not on that list.

 

[WGroleau]

There is a list of exceptions, medications are not on that list.

Hmmm. It's been a while, but it seems to my memory that I read it on an official website that did not limit it to non-EU countries.

 

[long trails]

I am in a similar position as a Digital Nomad and have considered staying long term in Spain but the messy tax situation has put me off. I pay my tax in the UK although I do not live there.

If you are in Spain over 183 days you will be a Spanish tax resident and have to declare all worldwide assets too. There is a social security charge of around EUR 250 for just being self employed in Spain, which is way more than most other EU countries.

I know people live in Spain under the radar but sometimes they are caught. In this digital age it's very easy to leave a footprint. If the Spanish authorities do suspect that you are a resident, you will be considered guilty until you prove otherwise e.g. evidence you have spent less than 183 days in the country,

Portugal has a far easier tax setup and more friendly environment to entrepreneurs and that's where I am going to eventually base myself (and the food is better too!).

 

[Luka]

If I am correct they look at in which country you stayed most of the year. For example, I left the Netherlands on July the 4th, 2017. This will mean I'll have to pay taxes in the Netherlands for the year 2017. In 2018 I'll return to the Netherlands before the 1st of July 2018.

But I have the same doubts as you about becoming autónomo in Spain. It is expensive. However I understood you get a bit of social security and a small pension in return.