mochilaverde
New Member
- Time of past OR future Camino
- Portuguese 2023, Ingles 2024
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I do the same. Or I take it and leave it unwrapped. I think that I read that albergues (at least in some regions) are required to provide some kind of sheet, so if they don't want to wash cloth sheets they use the disposable ones.I did refuse them on occasion. No problem doing that. I sleep in a silk sleeping bag liner.
No. That's disgusting, because those liners are there for a reason. If you refuse them, you're adding a night's-worth of your sweat and sebum and skin flecks on the mattress. Thanks a lot.Or thought about it
Has anyone tried refusing disposable sheets in albergues? (Or thought about it?)
Eucalyptus isn't native to Spain and growing eucalyptus requires a lot of water and wrecks the soil for indigenous trees in Galicia. Eucalyptus forests are also a huge fire hazard. (see https://www.eoi.es/blogs/imsd/the-eucalyptus-in-galicia-and-its-impacts/ )
I didn't bring a sleeping bag on my most recent Camino, but next time I would like to bring a sleeping bag (or half sheet, half sleeping bag) and try refusing disposable sheets. I don't use the albergue pillows at all (they are too plump for a front sleeper) and I usually just sleep with my head on my fleece sweater. edit to add: with a sleeping bag or half sheet, half sleeping bag, none of my body is in contact with the mattress.
I understand your concerns, it's a huge amount of waste. You could do what some of us do and simply take it with you after your first night, and reuse it for several days.Has anyone tried refusing disposable sheets in albergues? (Or thought about it?)
Eucalyptus isn't native to Spain and growing eucalyptus requires a lot of water and wrecks the soil for indigenous trees in Galicia. Eucalyptus forests are also a huge fire hazard. (see https://www.eoi.es/blogs/imsd/the-eucalyptus-in-galicia-and-its-impacts/ )
I didn't bring a sleeping bag on my most recent Camino, but next time I would like to bring a sleeping bag (or half sheet, half sleeping bag) and try refusing disposable sheets. I don't use the albergue pillows at all (they are too plump for a front sleeper) and I usually just sleep with my head on my fleece sweater. edit to add: with a sleeping bag or half sheet, half sleeping bag, none of my body is in contact with the mattress.
If they are paper-based then it is very possible. Eucalyptus is one of the major species used for pulp and paper industry. A large proportion of the trees grown in both Spain and Portugal are used for pulp production.Are you suggesting that the disposable sheets are made from Spanish/Galician eucalyptus trees?
Whilst I agree with you the OP did specifically say "none of my body is in contact with the mattress".No. That's disgusting, because those liners are there for a reason. If you refuse them, you're adding a night's-worth of your sweat and sebum and skin flies on the mattress. Thanks a lot.
Has anyone tried refusing disposable sheets in albergues? (Or thought about it?)
Eucalyptus isn't native to Spain and growing eucalyptus requires a lot of water and wrecks the soil for indigenous trees in Galicia. Eucalyptus forests are also a huge fire hazard.
As hygroscopic literally just means 'water seeking' that doesn't really answer the question as to what material they're made from.They are made from a hygroscopic material the same used in agriculture, really good to throw onto of a bed of vegetables in early spring and not on a bed designed to sleep in.
No, I did not. I respect rules - usually. If the sheet is correctly put on over the mattress, and you have your own liner or sleeping bag, what is the problem?Has anyone tried refusing disposable sheets in albergues? (Or thought about it?)
Eucalyptus isn't native to Spain and growing eucalyptus requires a lot of water and wrecks the soil for indigenous trees in Galicia. Eucalyptus forests are also a huge fire hazard. (see https://www.eoi.es/blogs/imsd/the-eucalyptus-in-galicia-and-its-impacts/ )
I didn't bring a sleeping bag on my most recent Camino, but next time I would like to bring a sleeping bag (or half sheet, half sleeping bag) and try refusing disposable sheets. I don't use the albergue pillows at all (they are too plump for a front sleeper) and I usually just sleep with my head on my fleece sweater. edit to add: with a sleeping bag or half sheet, half sleeping bag, none of my body is in contact with the mattress.
The problem is that the sheet is thrown away, regardless as to whether or not you use your own liner/ sleeping bag as well. Let alone the plastic bag they generally come in.If the sheet is correctly put on over the mattress, and you have your own liner or sleeping bag, what is the problem?
Whatever.The problem is that the sheet is thrown away, regardless as to whether or not you use your own liner/ sleeping bag as well. Let alone the plastic bag they generally come in.
As mentioned more than once above, the simple solution is of course to take your first one with you to reuse as long as practical.
Perhaps I will go back into my shell again. Not much point really, is there? No. Let the forum be for real camino issues, not for debatable points of divergence.Whatever.
Rather a rude response to a reasonable answerWhatever.
Perhaps you should, if you can’t at least be civil. You chose to answer the thread.Perhaps I will go back into my shell again. Not much point really, is there? No. Let the forum be for real camino issues, not for debatable points of divergence.
Rather a rude response to a reasonable answer
Perhaps you should, if you can’t at least be civil. You chose to answer the thread.
The OPs question is reasonable, and waste is a real Camino issue - far more so than many that are debated time and again here on the forum.
Why? Because we are visiting Spain, at the very least we have a moral responsibility to minimise our impact on the land and it’s people.
Me too. Also I do not like the idea of single use plastic stuff. In fact I sometimes reuse my disposable sheet a few times. Not sure if that creates a bedbugs transfer mode.I did refuse them on occasion. No problem doing that. I sleep in a silk sleeping bag liner.
I always bring a silk sheet on the Camino, and I also often find the pillows too plump. I bring a small inflatable pillow which is really good. Next time i'll try to avoid the disposable sheets.Has anyone tried refusing disposable sheets in albergues? (Or thought about it?)
Eucalyptus isn't native to Spain and growing eucalyptus requires a lot of water and wrecks the soil for indigenous trees in Galicia. Eucalyptus forests are also a huge fire hazard. (see https://www.eoi.es/blogs/imsd/the-eucalyptus-in-galicia-and-its-impacts/ )
I didn't bring a sleeping bag on my most recent Camino, but next time I would like to bring a sleeping bag (or half sheet, half sleeping bag) and try refusing disposable sheets. I don't use the albergue pillows at all (they are too plump for a front sleeper) and I usually just sleep with my head on my fleece sweater. edit to add: with a sleeping bag or half sheet, half sleeping bag, none of my body is in contact with the mattress.
Please don't go- many of your responses give me my daily chuckle. Your response didn't feel rude to me, but.....whatever!Perhaps I will go back into my shell again. Not much point really, is there? No. Let the forum be for real camino issues, not for debatable points of divergence.
The part taking them with you to the next stop is an excellent idea. It could be on the notice board at the albergue.I understand your concerns, it's a huge amount of waste. You could do what some of us do and simply take it with you after your first night, and reuse it for several days.
If they are paper-based then it is very possible. Eucalyptus is one of the major species used for pulp and paper industry. A large proportion of the trees grown in both Spain and Portugal are used for pulp production.
Disposable sheets seem to be made from all sorts of things - some are cellulose based, others polypropylene, etc
Whilst I agree with you the OP did specifically say "none of my body is in contact with the mattress".
As I have never yet slept completely cocooned in my sleep sheet, part of my body - specifically my arms - would always end up touching the mattress so from that perspective....
Perhaps the OP is different.
No, the bottom sheets are always fitted with elastic corners (in my experience), and come with a pillow case that may test your patience when trying to open it!For newbies (me) am I understanding there are two types of disposable sheets at municipal albergues? One that’s fitted and might stay on the sheet overnight, and one that’s just a flat thin doctors table tissue type which seems like it would be useless?
There are official efforts and policies to put an end to eucalyptus farming in Spain. Nothing too draconian, but I wouldn’t say that the long-term future of the eucalyptus tree in Spain is a foregone conclusion. And many would disagree with the use of “successful” in the quoted post. I am not a botanist, but I walked years ago with a mushroom specialist from the University of Santiago de Compostela, and on the few days from Santiago to Finisterre he was almost at the point of tears to see what the eucalyptus had done to mushroom/hongo growth.but I think the concern for the invasive eucalyptus is a little, too late. The tree has been part of the Spanish landscape for well over a hundred years and used for pulp production for sixty? more? years. The tree, like any other successful introduced species, is established.
Since eucalyptus trees have been mentioned....There are official efforts and policies to put an end to eucalyptus farming in Spain. Nothing too draconian, but I wouldn’t say that the long-term future of the eucalyptus tree in Spain is a foregone conclusion. And many would disagree with the use of “successful” in the quoted post. I am not a botanist, but I walked years ago with a mushroom specialist from the University of Santiago de Compostela, and on the few days from Santiago to Finisterre he was almost at the point of tears to see what the eucalyptus had done to mushroom/hongo growth.
As @peregrina2000 says, there are official efforts underway against eucalyptus - for very good reasons. It is absolutely disastrous environmentally (heavy transpiration, reduces biodiversity & soil fertility, allopathic) plus it is actually a major fire issue and in the increasingly drought stricken areas causing an incredible amount of harm. Both because it is an extremely thirsty tree, and of course because of the fire risks.The environmental burden imposed by the disposable (maybe biodegradable) ill-fitting mattress covers, and their associated and even more ill-fitting pillow slips, is a fair topic for discussion, but I think the concern for the invasive eucalyptus is a little, too late. The tree has been part of the Spanish landscape for well over a hundred years and used for pulp production for sixty? more? years. The tree, like any other successful introduced species, is established. At least it is being managed if it is harvested for an end product. Refusing to use that product will ensure that the eucalyptus can really take over without any limits.
Yes, thanks, Peter. It's a very good read.I came across this article regarding fire risks some time ago, some of you may find it interesting.
Thanks also for this.Opening this thread with another device I found that @mochilaverde has edited & added some very worthwhile additions to her original post, you might want to jump back up to post number one.
They are fitted, but all too often they are fitted for a mattress that is just a tiny fraction smaller than the one on your bed. making it barely possible or impossible to get that fourth corner in place and very easy, if you manage to succeed, for it to let go during the night.No, the bottom sheets are always fitted with elastic corners (in my experience), and come with a pillow case that may test your patience when trying to open it!
Both are made of a thin nonwoven fabric of unknown origin.
I don't think this is what you meant to type. Was the second supposed to be China (based on your comment of the effect of Covid on shipments from China)?Only a very small part of the disposable sheets come from Spain, by far most of them come from Spain.
Sadly, considering the sheer amount of pulp that Spain produces, you're absolutely correct. According to Google Spain exports a whopping 97% of its wood pulp to the Netherlands.I've always assumed those liners were not manufactured in Spain - and the additions seem to confirm that assumption. So having the sheets isn't supporting the Eucalyptus pulp industry. But there are other climate effects, those from global commerce and shipping. Unfortunately these are the same kind of effects we all cause when we buy shoes and backpacks and clothes.
That I do understand...it is the tallest, the most elegant and the most incendiary of trees...it is a case of 'horse...stable...bolted'As @peregrina2000 says, there are official efforts underway against eucalyptus - for very good reasons. It is absolutely disastrous environmentally (heavy transpiration, reduces biodiversity & soil fertility, allopathic) plus it is actually a major fire issue and in the increasingly drought stricken areas causing an incredible amount of harm. Both because it is an extremely thirsty tree, and of course because of the fire risks.
Whilst some of the large plantations are well managed unfortunately many are not. In addition to which there are many small plantations which have long since been abandoned because of their lack of profitability. Let alone the abandoned rural properties (common in Spain and Portugal) which are becoming overgrown with self-seeded trees.
The Primitivo (Hospitales) was closed in April last year because a wildfire ripped through the plantation that borders it. I saw the devastation myself in July. At Lugo I transferred across to the Norte, a couple of days later I stood at a T-intersection and actually videoed a clip.
Very well-run new plantation on my left, another well-run more mature plantation on my right. Straight ahead of me an abandoned plantation, overgrown, loads of debris on the plantation floor, strips of dead back hanging from the trees - just waiting for a hot day and a spark....
The suggestion to recycle the disposables that several have offerred here was one of those forehead slapping moments - why did I never think to do this??!Every time I handwash my disposable sheets and hang them to dry in the sun, people look at me like I'm Borat or Crocodile Dundee. I suspect their ecological awareness has a lot of room for improvement.
The suggestion to recycle the disposables that several have offerred here was one of those forehead slapping moments - why did I never think to do this??!
Sorry, you are right. The sentence I meant to write was:I don't think this is what you meant to type. Was the second supposed to be China (based on your comment of the effect of Covid on shipments from China)?
Another good idea!re-use them as bin liners in the various dorms, cabins and bathrooms.
Which of course means only that the bedbugs cannot crawl through them (same as for cotton or silk sheets) They must walk around or over the sheet to get to their target.They also claim that they are bedbug-proof
People frequently talk about 'paper sheets' - really, they mean disposable sheets.Stupid question mayb, but what is this talk of biodegradable and eucalyptus about?
Which they certainly will do.Which of course means only that the bedbugs cannot crawl through them (same as for cotton or silk sheets) They must walk around or over the sheet to get to their target.
Ever un-made the bed in one of those chain-Hotels? The stains could tell a thousand stories....I’d never refuse a sheet if they offered me one. Those mattresses are very dirty
I was the sole occupant of an albergue yesterday. Rubberised mattress cover, no sheets at all on offer. It was explained that they were trying to reduce waste. On a warm night in the Meseta the bits of me that weren’t enveloped in the sleeping bag liner were stuck to the mattress and doubtless the residue of many a previous occupant.Has anyone tried refusing disposable sheets in albergues? (Or thought about it?)
Eucalyptus isn't native to Spain and growing eucalyptus requires a lot of water and wrecks the soil for indigenous trees in Galicia. Eucalyptus forests are also a huge fire hazard. (see https://www.eoi.es/blogs/imsd/the-eucalyptus-in-galicia-and-its-impacts/ )
I didn't bring a sleeping bag on my most recent Camino, but next time I would like to bring a sleeping bag (or half sheet, half sleeping bag) and try refusing disposable sheets. I don't use the albergue pillows at all (they are too plump for a front sleeper) and I usually just sleep with my head on my fleece sweater. edit to add: with a sleeping bag or half sheet, half sleeping bag, none of my body is in contact with the mattress. I also wanted to clarify that the mattresses I have in mind have a rubberized cover (which the disposable cover goes on top of). I'm not proposing to sleep sans sheet on a mattress without a rubberized cover.
edit 2 to add:
Thanks to everyone for commenting. I tried to find out some more information:
My understanding is that most albergues have mattresses with a rubberized cover for hygiene reasons and that the disposable sheets are offered to people because it's uncomfortable to have skin in contact with the rubberized mattress cover. In other words, the disposable sheets are for comfort, and not because they protect people from germs or bedbugs.
- is there was a health code requirement for albergues in Spain to provide a fitted sheet (and mandate their use?) I didn't find any such requirement, but perhaps someone else with better Spanish might.... On my last Camino I walked without a sleeping bag and I borrowed synthetic blankets from albergues for two cold nights. My impression is that these blankets are not washed....
- what are albergue disposable sheets made of and where are they manufactured? I found disposable sheets for sale on Temu and Amazon, so there is a good chance that disposable sheets in albergues aren't even made in Spain. (And in that case, the content and origin of the fibres in the sheets might be pretty opaque.) Perhaps someone volunteering as a hospitaliero can find more information about the manufacturer on a box of sheets?
For me, part of the Camino experience is contemplating what I truly need and considering the impact that I have on the world around me. Seeing invasive eucalyptus prompted me to consider the environmental costs of manufacturing and disposing of sheets. Of course, laundering bedding has environmental costs as well, but as a general rule, manufacturing an item only to throw it away after a single use creates more harm than manufacturing a single durable item and cleaning it.
Rubberised mattress cover
The nice thing about rubberised mattress covers is that one can clean them with a wipe down, before and/or after you use them.the residue of many a previous occupant.
Wondering how all the commenters on this thread get to Spain.. do they take a mode of transport that emits NO carbon? If we truly want to minimize our impact on the planet we would stay home. No? So we make trade offs instead. I’m wary of those who pontificate about the state of the environment in Spain (from garbage in ditches to this issue of reusable sheets/eucalyptus trees). I hope they are also being eco-warriors on their home turf and looking at waste in their own backyards. Do they worry about the environmental impact of their micro fibre hiking gear, carbon walking sticks or the material in their mochilla? Really.. we all live in glass houses.Rather a rude response to a reasonable answer
Perhaps you should, if you can’t at least be civil. You chose to answer the thread.
The OPs question is reasonable, and waste is a real Camino issue - far more so than many that are debated time and again here on the forum.
Why? Because we are visiting Spain, at the very least we have a moral responsibility to minimise our impact on the land and its people.
You're absolutely right we all do live in glass houses. I agree completely that if I was an eco warrior that I wouldn't be going to Spain in the first place, nor would I have my rucksack with it's synthetic materials.Wondering how all the commenters on this thread get to Spain.. do they take a mode of transport that emits NO carbon? If we truly want to minimize our impact on the planet we would stay home. No? So we make trade offs instead. I’m wary of those who pontificate about the state of the environment in Spain (from garbage in ditches to this issue of reusable sheets/eucalyptus trees). I hope they are also being eco-warriors on their home turf and looking at waste in their own backyards. Do they worry about the environmental impact of their micro fibre hiking gear, carbon walking sticks or the material in their mochilla? Really.. we all live in glass houses.
Trying to make the connectionAre you suggesting that the disposable sheets are made from Spanish/Galician eucalyptus trees?
None of the disposable sheets I've used on the Camino have been made of paper. They are all made of a non-woven fabric that feels synthetic to me.Not all paper sheets are created equal FWIW.
PIncidentally, for anyone who's actually interested, just a reminder that there's an entire thread on minimizing our impact.
Thread 'Inviting reflections on the wider costs of walking a Camino' https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...on-the-wider-costs-of-walking-a-camino.85575/
Clearly if you're not interested or you just want to be negative, as @trecile says (post number 2) - don't bother.
There's plenty of other thread's to read on here!
Rather a rude response to a reasonable answer
Perhaps you should, if you can’t at least be civil. You chose to answer the thread.
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