Litter on the Camino

[happymarkos]

While walking out of Leon recently we saw a group of about a dozen volunteers from the local Camino Association collecting trash, mainly litter than was not biodegradable. They focused on the section from San Miguel to Villladangos Del Paramo and had collected over a dozen large garbage bags by mid morning.
They did comment as we passed at how uncaring some pilgrims seem to be.
We had no way of telling if this was just discarded in 2018 or had accumulated over a number of years.
Although there are few bins for litter except in the last 80-90 km it would help if there were more bins provided and signs asking people to take their trash with them.
You would think it is unnecessary to ask people to take their trash with them.
Perhaps it requires more publicity.
Any suggestions?
Buen Camino
Happymark

 

[Oravasaari]

I've always carried my rubbish with me to the next town, even bypassing worse than useless tiny bins stuffed full and overflowing.
It ain't rocket science...

 

[happymarkos]

I've always carried my rubbish with me to the next town, even bypassing worse than useless tiny bins stuffed full and overflowing.
It ain't rocket science...

I fully agree; the issue is how to get the message out to people that don't do what you do??
thanks
Happymark

 

[VNwalking]

I fully agree; the issue is how to get the message out to people that don't do what you do??

Good question, Mark, and one that's been asked over and over.
There will always be idiots, and they won't listen to what we say in this echo chamber.

So....What to do? A few ideas:

• Set an example.
• If you see someone has dropped trash along the way - return it to them. (Asking politely if they have dropped it, as though you were returning something of value. )
• Pick up trash yourself.
• Join the Ditch Pigs - or contribute to what they do every year.

Yes...be irritated by this...and then do something. We can complain endlessly, but if everyone here were to pick up at least one bag of trash a day while walking...we would make a difference.

 

[Albertagirl]

Good question, Mark, and one that's been asked over and over.
There will always be idiots, and they won't listen to what we say in this echo chamber.

So....What to do? A few ideas:

• Set an example.
• If you see someone has dropped trash along the way - return it to them. (Asking politely if they have dropped it, as though you were returning something of value. )
• Pick up trash yourself.
• Join the Ditch Pigs - or contribute to what they do every year.

Yes...be irritated by this...and then do something. We can complain endlessly, but if everyone here were to pick up at least one bag of trash a day while walking...we would make a difference.

@VNwalking
I agree with this and shall certainly continue to pick up litter. But I wonder why it is that there is little on some routes. There was almost none on the Via de la Plata/Sanabres.

 

[VNwalking]

But I wonder why it is that there is little on some routes. There was almost none on the Via de la Plata/Sanabres.

Hmm...good question @Albertagirl.
Maybe it's sheer numbers? Or rather, the lack of them.
The absence of the 'pilgrims' who do the most littering may also be a factor (just guessing here, as I have no idea who those people might be).

 

[Rj7797]

It like many things on the camino reflects the world in general. We all need to be more mindful of our trash and rubbish.

 

[Cayou]

I'm no Saint - not even close, but twice my wife & I have carried bags and collected litter over a 5km section. That's all it took to fill them. This world has extremes, and sometimes it's best to at least try to level the field.

 

[m108]

Some of us have been raised that we do not leave trash , some do not. The society is made in such a way that those who do not have this as an internal value - prescribe the rules. Maybe a little move would be achieved if the attachment to each credential is a friendly list (do not leave trash, do not write graffiti, do not steal fruit, ... be respectful to locals and others on the way ....perhaps in a witty style or as a comic drawings ). It really sounds ridiculous, but incomprehensibly large amounts of garbage prove that it is not for all self-evident. Even a "worse" reception would be a sign that the pilgrim agrees with these rules. I know it sounds awful, but that's it: for those who do not have internal rules - tell them what they are. Of course, this does not mean that everyone will follow them immediately.

 

[happymarkos]

Some of us have been raised that we do not leave trash , some do not. The society is made in such a way that those who do not have this as an internal value - prescribe the rules. Maybe a little move would be achieved if the attachment to each credential is a friendly list (do not leave trash, do not write graffiti, do not steal fruit, ... be respectful of locals and others on the way ....perhaps in a witty style or as a comic drawings ). It really sounds ridiculous, but incomprehensibly large amounts of garbage prove that it is not for all self-evident. Even a "worse" reception would be a sign that the pilgrim agrees with these rules. I know it sounds awful, but that's it: for those who do not have internal rules - tell them what they are. Of course, this does not mean that everyone will follow them immediately.

Excellent suggestions to have something in the credentials.
I will contact Monique in St Jean where I have volunteered and ask her to raise it with The Association.

 

[m108]

Excellent suggestions to have something in the credentials.
I will contact Monique in St Jean where I have volunteered and ask her to raise it with The Association.

It took some time for me to be horrified over the waste at Camino. I am a retired teacher, so it became clear to me over time that this is a matter of education.
It is likely that every one of us ever did something in his life, which he was later ashamed of - for lack of information.
There are bio-degradable bags made from plant starch. They are extremely lightweight and occupy very little space - everyone can have their own garbage bag. If they were prepared to attach them to the Credential in the SJPDP, I would buy 1000pcs, donate and send them to the SJPDP.
So, @happymarkos if you contact the office in the SJPDP, please ask if this would be feasible / appropriate

 

[t2andreo]

Perhaps, and as part of the educational effort, the Camino association that runs the office at SJPdP might offer small, light, rolls of the degradable dog poop bags at cost to departing pilgrims. A box or basket of them under the large rules sign explain what it means to pilgrims who ascribe to the concept, would work well, IMHO. They could use crowdsourcing to fund the initiative. I would donate...

Making the bags available and visible with a large sign with the rules on it would help sell bags. I suspect that if you give the person the bags and they relate it to the rules, they might actually use them.

Ideally, the bags would be custom produced and overprinted with the rules in several languages on both sides of the bag. I am thinking French, Spanish and English at least... Italian might be a good idea. Two on one side and two on the other....

Also, as the Pilgrim Office in SJPdP is the one place that virtually every departing pilgrim goes to to get a credential, last minute information on the pass, a shell, and the first stamp in their credencial, this is the IDEAL place to have the educational and marketing effort.

Hope this helps.

 

[kelleymac]

Some of us have been raised that we do not leave trash , some do not..

And still others pick up others' trash.

 

[kelleymac]

I'm no Saint - not even close, but twice my wife & I have carried bags and collected litter over a 5km section. That's all it took to fill them. This world has extremes, and sometimes it's best to at least try to level the field.

My son and I picked up trash everyday for about a half hour while walking the camino. We are scouts and needed to incorporate a service project into our "50 Mile Hike", in order to get our "50 Mile Award". Our service project became habit, and then it was simply a regular chore to do each morning.

 

[t2andreo]

I know it is a lot to expect, but I cannot help wondering if "sponsoring" a segment of the Camino to police trash, might be something worth exploring. Here in the US, it is common for local businesses to sponsor keeping a small segment of a highway free of litter. Employees of these businesses will turn out periodically (like a few times a year) to pick up trash.

I do not know if this fits culturally, but one does wonder if service organizations, businesses, schools, or Camino associations located in larger towns and cities might not take this up as a way to give back to the Camino. It IS their lifeblood, especially along the Camino Frances.

If the Camino becomes too "trashy" it might dissuade pilgrims in future. This, in turn, affects these businesses and their continued viability.

As we approach 'peak pilgrim' and the coming Holy Year in 2021, this problem is going to exacerbate. now is a good time to try to get some initiative up and running.

But, and alas, I am stuck living in Florida... Were I there, I would certainly be better situated to organize something, or to at least raise the issue with groups benefiting from the Camino.

Sigh...

 

[Deleted member 3000]

it was simply a regular chore to do each morning

Don't expect sainthood or even a badge for doing what needs to be done!

It is a good habit, so nurture it...

From an Eagle and father of two Eagles

 

[gloria lowe]

Maybe in order to receive a stamp from somewhere you have to turn in some trash. Either your own or some you picked up.

 

[mette]

While walking out of Leon recently we saw a group of about a dozen volunteers from the local Camino Association collecting trash, mainly litter than was not biodegradable. They focused on the section from San Miguel to Villladangos Del Paramo and had collected over a dozen large garbage bags by mid morning.
They did comment as we passed at how uncaring some pilgrims seem to be.
We had no way of telling if this was just discarded in 2018 or had accumulated over a number of years.
Although there are few bins for litter except in the last 80-90 km it would help if there were more bins provided and signs asking people to take their trash with them.
You would think it is unnecessary to ask people to take their trash with them.
Perhaps it requires more publicity.
Any suggestions?
Buen Camino
Happymark

Hm I think more bins for litter would be good. But don’t only blame the pilgrims, it could also be locals. Just look at the rest of the world and see how people throw waste all over

 

[jmcarp]

Hm I think more bins for litter would be good. But don’t only blame the pilgrims, it could also be locals. Just look at the rest of the world and see how people throw waste all over

But perhaps a few enviro-conscious pilgrims could set the example for others, including non-pilgrims, to follow.

Also, a bin of those biodegradable trash bags that @m108 described could be placed in each albergue -- especially if it could be done at no cost to the hospitaleros. This might be a project that the "Camino Angels" organization could sponsor, and we all could donate Euro or two to cover the cost of the bags. Of course such a project would require strategically-placed rubbish bins to accept the filled bags -- that's an infrastructure question that can only be answered by the local governmental bodies.

 

[Micah26]

I just finished my first Camino Frances in October. It seems that Spain does a lot of recycling and takes it very seriously. Along the way several places handed out these bright yellow bags... I used mine to put my shoes in. But many used them for shopping or trash. We were taught to clean up after yourself and if you saw trash on the ground pick it up. I filled a few bags along the way. Maybe modeling for those who grew up differently would help... pack it in, pack it out.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Maybe in order to receive a stamp from somewhere you have to turn in some trash. Either your own or some you picked up.

There are thousands of places to get stamps. While they support a clean Camino, I doubt that they would want the responsibility of demanding a piece of trash before giving stamp!

Ideas that generally want to coerce green behavior are not likely to get support. A flier suggesting that Pilgrims clean up as they walk? I hope there is a recycle bin nearby for those fliers so they don't land on the ground...

 

[Trude]

Hm I think more bins for litter would be good. But don’t only blame the pilgrims, it could also be locals. Just look at the rest of the world and see how people throw waste all over

Especially in that section it may not be pilgrims. I know I would never litter anywhere in the world, I was horrified in Cuba when a public bus I was on, pulled over stopped, opened the door and threw a plastic bottle and a pizza box out the door and then carried on as if it was normal. Maybe to him and others it is.

 

[VNwalking]

Maybe to him and others it is

Some of us live in a sanitized cultural bubble where littering is considered wrong. The rest of the world (and vastly more people) does not.

A friend of mine was walking in a park in Singapore with a third friend, who was from a country (where there is no such thing as 'littering;' it's just what people do.). As they were waking along, the Burmese friend casually dropped a wrapper on the ground as he ate his snack...it's normal, right? Hee hee. Of course NOT in Singapore. Ever. There was quite a scramble to remove the evidence of the crime PDQ before he got arrested.

There are vastly more places that are not like Singapore than are.
People from most places are probably shocked at us and wonder what all the fuss is about.

 

[Oravasaari]

On the CF the very high volume of walkers also means that quite a lot of accidental "spillages" happen - lost water bottles, tissues and food wrappers from side pockets (I almost always find a 20€ note on the path on my caminos too!). It is bound to happen when people are foraging through side pockets on the move etc. I've never seen anyone deliberately throw/drop litter/rubbish/trash.

 

[Albertagirl]

I don't think I would be likely to see anyone dropping their toilet tissue.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

lost water bottles, tissues and food wrappers from side pockets

I think we can put blame directly on cyclists for the discarded large water bottles! I have never seen a walker with bottles of that size. Maybe they "bounce" off the bicycles!

 

[Trude]

I don't think I would be likely to see anyone dropping their toilet tissue.

One or two good rains and the toilet tissue is disintegrated, unfortunately we are humans and have to go. It’s also one of the best ways of knowing you are not lost.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

One or two good rains and the toilet tissue is disintegrated, unfortunately we are humans and have to go. It’s also one of the best ways of knowing you are not lost.

Nope. Those tissues are still there WEEKS later, tattered and uglier than ever. You can "go" without leaving a bright white flag behind you.
I've been picking up litter on the camino for 12 years now. Trends emerge. It used to be cigarette packets and soda cans. Then it became plastic bottles. Now, in the last 4 or 5 years, it's tissues by the thousand, left by people who tell themselves it's OK, the rain will wash it all away.
Nope.
Don't leave ANYTHING behind you that doesn't belong in nature.
And not just on the Camino.

 

[VNwalking]

One or two good rains and the toilet tissue is disintegrated, unfortunately we are humans and have to go.

I invite you to try this in a private corner of your back yard and see just how long it takes.
After that you might be less likely to leave it on the Camino for countless others to enjoy.
Pack it out in a zip-lock bag and dispose of it where trash should go - in the bin at the edge of the next village.

 

[howlsthunder]

I did some ice climbing on glaciers when I was younger and we were not allowed to leave ANYTHING on the ice, including fecal matter. We learned to poop in bags if we needed to go. Luckily, I never needed to do that on the Camino but I was prepared to if need be.

Trash along the Camino was a big concern of mine before I walked for the first time. It was actually one of the reasons I decided on a spring walk as opposed to autumn, having read that the trash can be worse later in the season. While trash wasn't near as bad as I feared, I still made sure to keep a shopping bag available to fill as I walked and do what I could to offset the impact of less thoughtful pilgrims.

I wonder if good citizen behaviour could be encouraged by passing out little trash pick-up kits? Like, if beforehand I put a non-latex glove and a biodegradeable trash bag in a little ziplock to hand to others who seemed interested in the idea? Or just carry a roll of the bags? Just a thought.

 

[happymarkos]

I did some ice climbing on glaciers when I was younger and we were not allowed to leave ANYTHING on the ice, including fecal matter. We learned to poop in bags if we needed to go. Luckily, I never needed to do that on the Camino but I was prepared to if need be.

Trash along the Camino was a big concern of mine before I walked for the first time. It was actually one of the reasons I decided on a spring walk as opposed to autumn, having read that the trash can be worse later in the season. While trash wasn't near as bad as I feared, I still made sure to keep a shopping bag available to fill as I walked and do what I could to offset the impact of less thoughtful pilgrims.

I wonder if good citizen behaviour could be encouraged by passing out little trash pick-up kits? Like, if beforehand I put a non-latex glove and a biodegradeable trash bag in a little ziplock to hand to others who seemed interested in the idea? Or just carry a roll of the bags? Just a thought.

Good idea. I think to be successful it will require the assistance of the main places that provide the credentials such as at St Jean PDP, Roncevalles, Burgos etc and through Ivar's site, the American and Irish and English Camino Associations.
I have made a suggestion to Monique at St JeanPDP and heard nothing further.
In the meantime we can individually try and pick up some litter as we walk.
Happymark

 

[Deleted member 86885]

I know it is a lot to expect, but I cannot help wondering if "sponsoring" a segment of the Camino to police trash, might be something worth exploring. Here in the US, it is common for local businesses to sponsor keeping a small segment of a highway free of litter. Employees of these businesses will turn out periodically (like a few times a year) to pick up trash.

I do not know if this fits culturally, but one does wonder if service organizations, businesses, schools, or Camino associations located in larger towns and cities might not take this up as a way to give back to the Camino. It IS their lifeblood, especially along the Camino Frances.

If the Camino becomes too "trashy" it might dissuade pilgrims in future. This, in turn, affects these businesses and their continued viability.

As we approach 'peak pilgrim' and the coming Holy Year in 2021, this problem is going to exacerbate. now is a good time to try to get some initiative up and running.

But, and alas, I am stuck living in Florida... Were I there, I would certainly be better situated to organize something, or to at least raise the issue with groups benefiting from the Camino.

Sigh...

i am a newbie on getting ready for the cf later this year and do wonder if it has become so overcrowded and trashy/**itty that the experience is ruined. i am so drawn to wanting to do it for many reasons i won’t go into here, but i wonder about these trash and overcrowding issues and their impact on the whole. i am a 60 yo woman planning to walk alone. any comments about this from recent pilgrims? we you able to achieve what you wanted or did anyone regret going because of these issues? i guess the question is : how bad are these things really? are you walking with a buff over your nose from the smell or what?

 

[VNwalking]

how bad are these things really? are you walking with a buff over your nose from the smell or what?

Please don't worry.
If you go behind the bushes, it can be disgusting - especially after a long stretch where there's no cover.
But if you don't go behind the bushes? There's occasional TP to be seen but mostly the few eyesores are just trash, the kind that's everywhere.
Really, if it were that bad no-one would be returning. And we come back again and again, some to clean the way year after year as an act of love of the Camino.
No regrets.
None at all.

 

[Karl Oz]

It took some time for me to be horrified over the waste at Camino. I am a retired teacher, so it became clear to me over time that this is a matter of education.
It is likely that every one of us ever did something in his life, which he was later ashamed of - for lack of information.
There are bio-degradable bags made from plant starch. They are extremely lightweight and occupy very little space - everyone can have their own garbage bag. If they were prepared to attach them to the Credential in the SJPDP, I would buy 1000pcs, donate and send them to the SJPDP.
So, @happymarkos if you contact the office in the SJPDP, please ask if this would be feasible / appropriate

I agree, it is an education issue. My own country commenced sustained anti-littering campaigns in the media nearly 50 years ago, and it was certainly needed, as it was commonplace for people to simply discard rubbish almost anywhere they happened to be. It took only a few years for littering to become a rare phenomenon, as it is now almost universally considered to be anti-social and unacceptable. I believe such an initiative is largely absent on the CF.

I respect and admire the efforts of people to remove litter left on the way, but as long as it keeps being deposited removing it will remain an endless task.

 

[t2andreo]

If you are not looking for trash, like if you are part of a “ditch pig” cleanup team, you will simply not see most of the trash. This is especially true if it is spring to early autumn and the foliage is thick. In winter, when the ditch pigs tend to do their thing, the foliage has died off for the year and more trash can be seen.

Hope this helps.

 

[C clearly]

i am a newbie on getting ready for the cf later this year and do wonder if it has become so overcrowded and trashy/**itty that the experience is ruined... i guess the question is : how bad are these things really? are you walking with a buff over your nose from the smell or what?

No, the conditions are absolutely not that bad!!! Don't let the "tsk, tsk-ing" prejudice you against a great experience!