Just a thought

[Sojourner47]

There's been loads of stuff on the forum about travelling alone, meeting other pilgrims, "hooking up", even.Some want to meet others, some want to be alone.
I'll give my take on it, for what it's worth.
As previously posted on another thread, I walked from SJPDP to Najera last April.
First night St Jean, at L'Esprit was brilliant,Huberta and Arno made us all very welcome, and the communal evening meal was lovely.
The next day across the Pyrennes was really good: Fantastic scenery, good weather and I was gratified I'd managed to walk the 27kms to Roncevalles without trouble.I even met another Englishman to chat to along the way.
Next day to Trinidad was good walking again, zero contact with other pilgrims, but the albergue was nice, and when I eventually got a Menu peregrino it was well worth while.
Third day to Obanos was OK, again, no contact with other pilgs, despite attempts to start a conversation with some. A couple of Irish women were decidedly standoffish - must have thought I was trying to chat them up, or something.(or dare I say it - I'm English....)
Obanos alb was nice - enjoyed my shop bought meal of bread cheese and wine.But everyone there was keeping to themselves.
Long day to Los Arcos, where I actually met some friendly pilgrims (Dutch,German) , and during the extra kms after Monjardin, did the only walking with another - Belgian woman.
Then to Viana, where I stayed at private alb - single room, bliss, but again, 4 women pilgs there, 2 French, 2 German, attempts to interact brushed aside as if I was some kind of pervert.
Last night, at Navarette was probably the worst. El Cantaro alb - nice - I was in "overflow" apartment away from the actual alb - 5 bed room, first there. Joined by a single German guy, then 3 Belgians, man and 2 women. Again, I attempted to interact with them ( they spoke much better English than my Dutch!), but brushed aside - in fact they were prattling on to each other non stop through out the evening. And, given they'd been walking together for over a week, what is there to say?
After that, I carried on to Najera and caught coach to Madrid, flight home, disillusioned.
But, as has been said before on here, don't have any expectations, about anything.
I post this merely as an obverse to the usual gushing reports of super friendships made along the Way. :mrgreen:
Some may say I'm paranoid, but I did try to talk to my fellow pilgrims - I guess I just picked a bad week......
So, to all those who talk about the joy of meeting up with others, etc, it doesn't always work out that way.
So, for all that I'm drawn towards the camino, I think future walks will be in the UK - enough long distance paths to keep me going for the next few years.

 

[george.g]

Hi Sojourner47.
How unlucky can you get? Fancy not finding a walking companion along the Camino, I consider myself a rather introvert person and perhaps a little "standoffish" but during my most recent Camino (Seville-
Astorga-Finnisterre) never lacked for company, except the Farm Moreruela-Astorga leg, but thats another story. So perhaps Sojourner47's experiance was a bit of a "one off"

George.g

 

[tyrrek]

I agree, that's pretty unlucky. I was on the Frances in December litter picking with Rebekah and the Camino was very quiet. When I was going home I walked the 10kms or so from Moratinos to Sahagun to get the train and still managed to find a 'Camino family'. Obviously I wasn't fully 'initiated' as such because I was just walking to the train station, but I met a Brazilian and Korean peregrina along the way. We stopped at San Nicolas for a coffee/beer on the way and met the rest of the 'family' in the bar.

I was introduced by the Brazilian as 'Hey guys! This guy is here from UK picking up all our s**t!', which was a conversation starter.

Buen Camino!

 

[Sojourner47]

With apologies to Bob Dylan.
"How many days must a man walk the Way,
Without meeting up with a friend?
How many nights must he sleep in an alb
Without cheerful talk at the end?
How many days must he walk in the sun,
Without someone's kind ear to bend?
The answer my friend is blowing in the wind
The answer is blowing in the wind."

I guess this is, in a way, my farewell to the camino, and to this forum.
I've done the Camino Ingles, Ferrol to SdC
The Camino Madrid, Fuencarral to Cercedilla
The Camino Frances, SJPDP to Najera,
So I've given it a go.
Thanks, everyone for all the info and support.

 

[gerardcarey]

That's all you've gotta do cobber,
"Give it a go"
Bon voyages

 

[cmsmith]

I am sorry that your experience on the Camino Frances did not include the fellowship you had hoped for, particularly since you had gone out of your way to help me prepare for the Camino Ingles. You offered to share some detailed information by PM which I took you up on. My son and I used your advice in our planning and particularly noted your comment about cold beer in the vending machine in at the Bruma albergue. May there be many cold beers awaiting you in your future walks--wherever they are.

CMSmith

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I met a Cambodian-American in Santiago. She had walked a miserable two weeks from Leon, not feeling that she fit into any group. Adding misery, her boyfriend broke up with her about mid-Camino. When she arrived in Santiago, she fit right into "my group" through someone she met in the line to get her Compostela. Her entire experience and outlook changed in one day, almost one dinner (and some other meals and lots of vino tinto).

Sometimes it takes patience waiting for the camino to provide!

 

[Anonymous]

Times have changed.

A few years ago, newly separated and in dire need to get away, I signed up for a 15 day group tour through Egypt.
There were 15 of us.
Myself
A single twenty something girl from Quebec
Two young party girls from Toronto
A young married couple from outside Toronto
A middle aged married couple from Toronto
The token flamboyant over the top gay guy from USA
Two twenty something girls from central Canada
A single egghead woman from western canada
Three australians - two brothers and the wife of one.

Almost immediately, I was looked upon as the single guy who must be there to get laid. Nothing could be firther from the truth. At 49, I simply wanted to see and experience Egypt. The two girls from central canada joined up with the egghead and almost from day one, picked on me and criticized everything I did in front of others. Obvious issues with past men in their lives, in their minds I somehow became their dad/ex boyfriend/ex hubby, the one who abused them physically and mentally as they were growing up. The right age, single, I became their focus of hate.
They took out their anger on me. I simply minded my own business and tried to interact with the group during lunch/dinner or on the lengthy bus rides. I was the only one without an MP3 player, so on the buses, everyone had tuned the world out "listening to the tunes" and not even interacting with the other group members.
The flamboyant over the top american gay guy would not shut up for more than a few seconds the entire trip, talking loudly so everyone within 3 miles could hear him. He had to let the entire planet and adjoining planets know he was gay and how awesome his lifestyle was....dude, good for you, but we don't care....really, we dont!
He singlehandedly ruined the sanctity of our climb atop Mt. Sinai that commenced at 2:00 AM by endlessly chatting and yelling and singing TV jingles and quoting movie characters. Mose, had he been there, would have added the 11th commandment, "Thou shall shut the F up".
We spent 3 days and 2 nights sailing down the Nile on two Felucca sailboats...lucky me I had the trio on my boat...I brought sandwiches with me and cookies and chips, as I need to eat regularly for blood sugar. They embaressed me in froont of the others for eating when they were not, I brought a pocket radio with me to quietly listen to local radio on the boat, and one yelled, "Do you really think you can pick up canada with that radio?" And on and on...
I finally had enough and told the mouthy trio of girls to leave me the F**K alone and not worry about what I eat or drink or buy or wear and to stop trying to turn the rest of the group against me. The rest of the trip was tense, but the rest of the group, some of whom was also being targeted by these three angry bitter women, sat on their hands and clammed up, glad that I told them off and I was the target more.
Bottom line, there are a$$holes in this world. we hear about many on the news each night. And sometimes, they take vacations and end up near you. Luck of the draw.
Also, society has changed globally....if you are social and friendly, everyone thinks you must be after something....if you are a single middle aged man, well, you must be here pumped up on Viagra wanting to get laid.
How sad.

 

[vagabondette]

^^^ Is the perfect example of why I don't go on group tours that last more than a couple hours. I can't think of anything more miserable (traveling-wise) than being forced to hang out with a bunch of strangers I hate for days on end. Heck, I don't even want to travel with most of my friends for that long.

 

[sulu]

^^^ Is the perfect example of why I don't go on group tours that last more than a couple hours. I can't think of anything more miserable (traveling-wise) than being forced to hang out with a bunch of strangers I hate for days on end. Heck, I don't even want to travel with most of my friends for that long.

Travelling with people is often difficult, there was a whole thread on this somewhere else.
As an older female I can offer the other side to Alan's experience. Some men seem to see a social and friendly woman as being after something. I am sure that, if I were 20 something, this would not be a problem
There are many men about who are sufficiently confident to be friendly without feeling threatened, just a few seem to think that friendliness is a threat, is going to lead to a demand for something, and that a woman on her own must be after something, desperate even:!:
I have always enjoyed my caminos, I've met people who annoy me but mostly I have met sufficient people to make my journey a great pleasure. When people annoy me I try to see this as being a defficiency in me 8)
It is a shame that some people are so self centred that they assume that friendliness may be a threat, but it does seem to be so, both for males and females. All one can hope for on the camino is that there will be, at least, a mix and we meet enough people to find pleasure in good company. Mostly we do, I think.

 

[miguel_gp]

Just throwing a virtual glass of water over this thread to cool it down a little. You'll have people getting all unnecessary, Alan

Cheers
Mig

 

[tyrrek]

Sorry Alan. As a 'neutral non-moderator' I think Mig is right. Your thread on intimacy was useful, and as you say, we're all human beings and intimacy anywhere is great and would also be so on the Camino. Fantasies etc. are maybe going to far for this discussion board?

Buen Camino!

 

[grayland]

This thread is now reopened and ready for comments germane to the original post.

I was somewhat surprised by the experience described by Sojourner47 as it is quite different from anything I have experienced
It is obvious that not all Camino groups are sociable and that you may run into a similar situation. I would think that it would be very unusual and that speeding up or slowing down would put you in contact with a more "normal" group.

 

[Globetrottergirl]

Re: Just a thought- to FALCON269

Hey Falcon! I am falling off my chair laughing at your post! I am that "girl" though not Cambodian. I was telling a friend about the Camino two days ago because he had mentioned traveling to Spain. He is interested in going this year for himself. I just randomly thought about googling a topic about a girl breaking up on the Camino and came upon this blog. How random is that?! Anyhow, the breakup was one of the best thing that's ever happened to me! I am a much happier person now without someone who was so unkind and selfish to me for so long...and of all places he continued to display those characteristics on the Camino. I wish I had met you and your group much earlier on my walk but it was better late than never. I didn't have dinner alone and am still thankful to this day that I met such wonderful people who were there for me. Buen Camino, my friends. Cheers- S.

 

[Globetrottergirl]

I met a Cambodian-American in Santiago. She had walked a miserable two weeks from Leon, not feeling that she fit into any group. Adding misery, her boyfriend broke up with her about mid-Camino. When she arrived in Santiago, she fit right into "my group" through someone she met in the line to get her Compostela. Her entire experience and outlook changed in one day, almost one dinner (and some other meals and lots of vino tinto).

Sometimes it takes patience waiting for the camino to provide!

Hey Falcon! I am falling off my chair laughing at your post! I am that "girl" though not Cambodian. I was telling a friend about the Camino two days ago because he had mentioned traveling to Spain. He is interested in going this year for himself. I just randomly thought about googling a topic about a girl breaking up on the Camino and came upon this blog. How random is that?! Anyhow, the breakup was one of the best thing that's ever happened to me! I am a much happier person now without someone who was so unkind and selfish to me for so long...and of all places he continued to display those characteristics on the Camino. I wish I had met you and your group much earlier on my walk but it was better late than never. I didn't have dinner alone and am still thankful to this day that I met such wonderful people who were there for me. Buen Camino, my friends. Cheers- S.

 

[Anakasha]

I think I had those same three women on my Greek cruise. They were determined to ruin this one poor guys vacation. The man was super shy and on vacation alone trying to get over the horrific year that he had just had, his wife left him as his mother was dying. I had buddied up with a few people in the group as we were all assigned the same dining table and didn't notice what they were doing. The second one of the other girls and I did these girls got the shock of their lives. We walked over took his plate of food and his glass and moved him to our table.
He ended up being a lovely man, once he came out of his shell, and a wealth of information about ancient Greece which was like having our own personal tour guide which was amazing since as a phtographer im always way behind in the group and miss whatever a guide is saying. The last night of the trip he picked up the alcohol tab and purchased a few bottle of really nice wine for the table.
A few weeks after we got home I got a tear jerking email from his 18 year old daughter thanking me for being so kind to her father at a time when he thought all kindness had left the world. She invited me to stay with her if I ever came to Hawaii. She sent similar emails to a few other people at our table. Quite frankly, I thought I got more out of being friends with him, than he got out of being friends with me.

 

[dazzamac]

While I met and chatted with quite a few people on the Camino, I never made any life-changing friendships but then again, I never expected to. I get on easily enough with others but I'm not one for forming deep friendships. Interesting people come and go through my life and every so often one of them stays.

I walked at my own pace and I'd see many of the same people in different places along the Camino. We'd stop and chat and then we'd head on our way. I see nothing wrong with that.

In regards to the original post, it can be hard for an individual to become part of an established group (even a group of two or one recently formed on the Camino). It very much depends on whether the group or an individual within the group welcomes the newcomer.

People are people wherever they go and the Camino is no exception. The same kind of cliques and prejudices exist on the Camino as everywhere. And just as equally there are very many welcoming and friendly people that walk the Camino too.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

I walked the camino frances twice. The first time was a blast, with wonderful friends who remain a precious part of my life. The second time was a long, lonely journey. I did meet some nice people, even walked with a couple of them over some days, but it was nothing like the instant, intimate family group I so enjoyed the first time.

Everyone walks his own camino. And every camino is different. You can never walk the same camino twice!

 

[fraluchi]

...I post this merely as an obverse to the usual gushing reports of super friendships made along the Way. :mrgreen: [...].. to all those who talk about the joy of meeting up with others, etc, it doesn't always work out that way.

The latter is quite true. However, meeting up and making super friendships should not be the primary reason for walking the Camino. Fellow pilgrims are often like ships passing in the night: lit up and quickly disappearing. Which doesn't remove the beauty of it all!

 

[steinhoj]

Alcohol

 

[annelise]

Having been thinking for some time about the question Sojourner raised – regret about lack of interacting with persons on the camino (or finding a 'camino-family'), I think that some of this might stem from original expectations about what the camino would or could be.

For myself, I came to the camino with absolutely no expectations in any way (elderly lady, 66, unfit). I had a plan B: if I found I could not cope, I would just buy some clothes and go on and have a wonderful holiday in Spain!

Well, I did cope (much to the surprise of my sons). But I never found a so-called camino family to associate with. I was a slow walker and needed to take my rest days.

However, I had many wonderful – if somewhat brief – meetings and meaningful interchanges with fellow pilgrims, some of whom I have been in contact with after the camino.

So, in short, I do not think it is the quantity of interchanges/communications you will have with your fellow pilgrims, but rather the quality of the in-depth communications you sometimes have the privilege of sharing along the way – and the ever present kindness of fellow-pilgrims passing you (when having a rest, looking tired) asking you whether you are OK.

 

[mspath]

....

So, in short, I do not think it is the quantity of interchanges/communications you will have with your fellow pilgrims, but rather the quality of the in-depth communications you sometimes have the privilege of sharing along the way – and the ever present kindness of fellow-pilgrims passing you (when having a rest, looking tired) asking you whether you are OK.

Annelise,

I totally agree. It is the shared serendipity that helps makes it special!

Margaret