Happy Shavuot!!!

scruffy1 · Jun 8, 2024

For my fellow Jewish Pilgrims do try to remember that this coming Tuesday evening is our Shavuot holiday, not one but two days. Shavuot is one of the required Jewish pilgrimages, totally appropriate for your efforts. Look for a cheesecake, a quiche, or even a pizza to celebrate. The real Pentecost as known by our Christian brethren since this is a Jewish Leap Year and everything a month later

Mycroft · Jun 8, 2024

scruffy1 said:
For my fellow Jewish Pilgrims do try to remember that this coming Tuesday evening is our Shavuot holiday, not one but two days. Shavuot is one of the required Jewish pilgrimages, totally appropriate for your efforts. Look for a cheesecake, a quiche, or even a pizza to celebrate. The real Pentecost as known by our Christian brethren since this is a Jewish Leap Year and everything a month later

Thanks for bringing this up, scruffy. I know little of this tradition so had to start reading. Things started falling into place, thanks to you!

David Tallan · Jun 9, 2024

scruffy1 said:
For my fellow Jewish Pilgrims do try to remember that this coming Tuesday evening is our Shavuot holiday, not one but two days. Shavuot is one of the required Jewish pilgrimages, totally appropriate for your efforts. Look for a cheesecake, a quiche, or even a pizza to celebrate. The real Pentecost as known by our Christian brethren since this is a Jewish Leap Year and everything a month later

Two days unless your family is Israeli, if I recall correctly.

ShoshTrvls · Jun 9, 2024

David Tallan said:
Two days unless your family is Israeli, if I recall correctly.

You know the saying “two rabbis, three opinions?” This is one of them.

Jewish calendars identify months from the new moon; in ancient times, that was when the new moon was seen in Jerusalem. The tradition (actually a rabbinical dictate) of observing for two days was begun to ensure that Jews who lived far from Jerusalem “captured” the entire holiday period since it wasn’t always known on which day the new moon was seen. Jews in Jerusalem always observed for only one day since they were not dependent on guessing what day the month started.

Modern day, some rabbis say that Israelis only need celebrate one day wherever they are since the date of the holiday is known, some rabbis say that you follow the tradition of where you are at the time, and others (reform and some conservative) say that since there is now a fixed Jewish calendar not dependent upon when the new moon is observed, everyone need only observe for one day.

There are some exceptions. Fast days such as Yom Kippur are observed for only one day wherever you are, since the dictate is only to fast from sunset to sunset, or 25 hours (again, to account for the possibility of being incorrect on the exact times).

Dov of the Galilee · Jun 9, 2024

Chag sameach

scruffy1 · Jun 9, 2024

David Tallan said:
Two days unless your family is Israeli, if I recall correctly.

ShoshTrvls said:
You know the saying “two rabbis, three opinions?” This is one of them.

Jewish calendars identify months from the new moon; in ancient times, that was when the new moon was seen in Jerusalem. The tradition (actually a rabbinical dictate) of observing for two days was begun to ensure that Jews who lived far from Jerusalem “captured” the entire holiday period since it wasn’t always known on which day the new moon was seen. Jews in Jerusalem always observed for only one day since they were not dependent on guessing what day the month started.

Modern day, some rabbis say that Israelis only need celebrate one day wherever they are since the date of the holiday is known, some rabbis say that you follow the tradition of where you are at the time, and others (reform and some conservative) say that since there is now a fixed Jewish calendar not dependent upon when the new moon is observed, everyone need only observe for one day.

There are some exceptions. Fast days such as Yom Kippur are observed for only one day wherever you are, since the dictate is only to fast from sunset to sunrise.

One day only here in Jerusalem, two abroad -until modern times another day was added to allow and ensure all Jews including isolated Jewish communities would receive confirmation that the holiday had arrived. In ancient times the message was passed by mathematical/astronomical calculations leaving room for error and by bonfire meaning it would take time for the message to pass from Jerusalem to say Santiago.

David Tallan · Jun 9, 2024

ShoshTrvls said:
You know the saying “two rabbis, three opinions?” This is one of them.

Jewish calendars identify months from the new moon; in ancient times, that was when the new moon was seen in Jerusalem. The tradition (actually a rabbinical dictate) of observing for two days was begun to ensure that Jews who lived far from Jerusalem “captured” the entire holiday period since it wasn’t always known on which day the new moon was seen. Jews in Jerusalem always observed for only one day since they were not dependent on guessing what day the month started.

Modern day, some rabbis say that Israelis only need celebrate one day wherever they are since the date of the holiday is known, some rabbis say that you follow the tradition of where you are at the time, and others (reform and some conservative) say that since there is now a fixed Jewish calendar not dependent upon when the new moon is observed, everyone need only observe for one day.

There are some exceptions. Fast days such as Yom Kippur are observed for only one day wherever you are, since the dictate is only to fast from sunset to sunrise.

See, I thought that the more traditional view was to follow not the traditions of where you happen to be at the moment, but of your parents, which is why I said "unless your family is Israeli" rather than "unless you are in Israel". But I make no claim to real expertise.

Also, I didn't know that Yom Kippur was sunset to sunrise (just the night). I thought it was from just before sunset to just after sunset the next day (the Jewish day being sunset to sunset, the before and after to ensure you got the full day). I can certainly see the dictate only being one day, because to abstain from drinking for two days in Andalucia or other hotter climates probably would have been quite dangerous.

lt56ny · Jun 9, 2024

David Tallan said:
See, I thought that the more traditional view was to follow not the traditions of where you happen to be at the moment, but of your parents, which is why I said "unless your family is Israeli" rather than "unless you are in Israel". But I make no claim to real expertise.

Also, I didn't know that Yom Kippur was sunset to sunrise (just the night). I thought it was from just before sunset to just after sunset the next day (the Jewish day being sunset to sunset, the before and after to ensure you got the full day). I can certainly see the dictate only being one day, because to abstain from drinking for two days in Andalucia or other hotter climates probably would have been quite dangerous.

If I remember correctly you may be right about the time you are allowed to break the fast. After looking it up I do believe this site is correct saying the fast last 25 hours.

A Quick Guide To Fasting On Yom Kippur

We break down everything you need to know.

18doors.org

I will confirm with my younger daughter who started out a heathen and has turned into a pretty religious Jew in her late 20's.

ShoshTrvls said:
Jewish calendars identify months from the new moon; in ancient times, that was when the new moon was seen in Jerusalem. The tradition (actually a rabbinical dictate) of observing for two days was begun to ensure that Jews who lived far from Jerusalem “captured” the entire holiday period since it wasn’t always known on which day the new moon was seen. Jews in Jerusalem always observed for only one day since they were not dependent on guessing what day the month started.

scruffy1 said:
One day only here in Jerusalem, two abroad -until modern times another day was added to allow and ensure all Jews including isolated Jewish communities would receive confirmation that the holiday had arrived. In ancient times the message was passed by mathematical/astronomical calculations leaving room for error and by bonfire meaning it would take time for the message to pass from Jerusalem to say Santiago.

Everything I have read confirms one day in Israel/2 everywhere else.
I went to an Orthodox shul in The Bronx and we celebrated 2 days. I loved it because before you were Bar Mitzvahed you could play downstairs and the Cantor was there. He was super nice and the food was great!

ShoshTrvls · Jun 9, 2024

You are right on Yom Kippur. I misspoke and will correct it.

David Tallan said:
See, I thought that the more traditional view was to follow not the traditions of where you happen to be at the moment, but of your parents, which is why I said "unless your family is Israeli" rather than "unless you are in Israel". But I make no claim to real expertise.

Also, I didn't know that Yom Kippur was sunset to sunrise (just the night). I thought it was from just before sunset to just after sunset the next day (the Jewish day being sunset to sunset, the before and after to ensure you got the full day). I can certainly see the dictate only being one day, because to abstain from drinking for two days in Andalucia or other hotter climates probably would have been quite dangerous.w

Liltravlr · Jun 9, 2024

scruffy1 said:
For my fellow Jewish Pilgrims do try to remember that this coming Tuesday evening is our Shavuot holiday, not one but two days. Shavuot is one of the required Jewish pilgrimages, totally appropriate for your efforts. Look for a cheesecake, a quiche, or even a pizza to celebrate. The real Pentecost as known by our Christian brethren since this is a Jewish Leap Year and everything a month later

Shalom! Blessings to you on your pilgrimage. Hi from Canada!

ShoshTrvls · Jun 9, 2024

This is what Chabad says about 2 days in/out of Israel:

Please note: Regarding the law for travelers to or from Israel, although some authorities say that you should keep Yom Tov for one day if you are in Israel and two days if you are elsewhere, most authorities rule that wherever you are, you keep Yom Tov for the number of days it is kept in the country of your permanent residence. One should consult with one’s own rabbi before traveling.

https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/527614/jewish/Why-Do-We-Still-Celebrate-Holidays-for-Two-Days-in-the-Diaspora.htm

Tali · Jun 10, 2024

Chag Sameach

Heather R. · Jun 15, 2024

Chag Sameach from Hawaii

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Happy Shavuot!!!

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