Graffiti on the Frances

[GerryFitz]

This is probably an old chestnut but why do people (I won’t call them pilgrims) insist on putting stupid graffiti messages on the way markers on the Camino Frances. Having joined the Frances yesterday at Arzua from the ‘unspoilt’ Del Norte I was dismayed at all the graffiti and litter along this way! I walked the Frances twice a few years back and it has disimproved so much! Who gives these so called pilgrims the right to spray paint stupid messages on way markers. I may be old fashioned but I believe if you cannot walk in the spirit of and with respect for the Camino then don’t walk at all! Anyway that’s my Camino rant for 2018!

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Many consider it a tradition. It won't be going away anytime soon.

 

[Karl Oz]

With respect, it must be a very recent phenomenon rather than a tradition, since I also saw no graffiti when I walked the CF only a few years ago. Nor much litter either. The explosion in numbers on the CF has included younger folk who I expect are in the main responsible for the graffiti. However, many western societies seem to have had considerable success with the elimination of casual littering, (although graffiti does seem an intractable problem). I wonder whether a public education campaign could render similar successful results on the CF.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

A decade ago in 2008, mojone graffiti:

 

[blueskywa]

My thoughts exactly arriving at Arzua from the beautiful Del Norte in June this year!!

 

[Karl Oz]

A decade ago in 2008, mojone graffiti:

View attachment 48272

Was this common back then? I honestly never saw anything like this in 20112-14. Maybe an effort was made to subsequently clean the markers. Or maybe I missed it.

 

[Theatregal]

Sadly, these are all from 2012. Grafitti has been prevalent on every camino I've walked.

 

[Karl Oz]

Ok, in that case I'm getting a guide-dog. Or maybe just lay-off the indigenous mushrooms.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

In 2007 I passed the same mojone just after the cleaning crew got there, but not before the first graffiti:

 

[bmcbride]

I did not notice as much graffiti when I walked the Frances in 2014, but after coming off the Primitivo last year and joining the Frances, I definitely noticed it, and how many km. signs had been taken (and some broken in an attempt to take them).
"Take only photographs - leave only footprints."

 

[sandyecds]

This is probably an old chestnut but why do people (I won’t call them pilgrims) insist on putting stupid graffiti messages on the way markers on the Camino Frances. Having joined the Frances yesterday at Arzua from the ‘unspoilt’ Del Norte I was dismayed at all the graffiti and litter along this way! I walked the Frances twice a few years back and it has disimproved so much! Who gives these so called pilgrims the right to spray paint stupid messages on way markers. I may be old fashioned but I believe if you cannot walk in the spirit of and with respect for the Camino then don’t walk at all! Anyway that’s my Camino rant for 2018!

I agree. When people ask what to take on the camino, I always say a wide sharpie pen to write all over everything serms to be an essential cuz this is what I see everywhere.

 

[PK Smit]

This phenomenum started the moment the Camino become commercialised. Business class peregrinos and taxi grinos and "pilgrims" carrying daypacks. My honest opinion.

 

[andywild]

I kinda like it... (But I don't add to it).

 

[MichaelB10398]

I despise it; everywhere I see it I despise it. I grew up being instructed on how to appreciate art, sculpture, architecture, and beauty. Nothing in my upbringing taught me this kind of activity is good, beautiful, or worthy of appreciation.
I am a very sad pilgrim when I see it and I choose to ignore it if at all possible. There is so much beauty in the world that it is easier to focus on it rather than the defacement of structures meant for the benefit of all.

 

[trecile]

It probably wouldn't work, but maybe they should put up some kind of structures that are designed for people to leave their "mark".

 

[Paladina]

I kinda like it... (But I don't add to it).

There was evidently no need for Team Tortoise to add their tag to the waymarker photographed by @falcon269. The original tortugas beat you to it by a decade. You must have been caught napping!

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Nothing in my upbringing taught me this kind of activity is good, beautiful, or worthy of appreciation.

Some cities, Logrono for example, think graffiti is art and encourage it:

 

[countycork]

I noticed more of it from Sarria to Santiago than from St Jean to Sarria....what's more I thought there was a different 'kind' of pilgrim walking that route too who seemed to be hell bent on getting in the last 100kms as quickly as possible!

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I thought there was a different 'kind' of pilgrim walking that route too who seemed to be hell bent on getting in the last 100kms as quickly as possible!

The Spanish are 44% of the pilgrims. About 60% of the pilgrims walk the Camino Frances. About 30% start in Sarria. I imagine that motivations are myriad, but about 44% walk for "religious" reasons, motivated by the religious nature of the compostela. I personally would not speculate on whether any of them increase their speed in the five days of the last 100km from Sarria; in thousands of miles of walking, I have passed only three pilgrims who were not taking a rest, so I am pretty sure that I am the slowest pilgrim out there! I would speculate that almost no one dawdles, and I have seen pilgrims driven to cover distance early in the 780km, and I have seen pilgrims hobbling slowly on blisters in the last 100km. Both seemed more heaven bent than hell bent!

 

[nidarosa]

What to do if you come across some of these vandals/taggers though? Shortly before Castrojeriz this autumn I saw someone's signature at the back of a traffic sign with the day's date and was hoping I would bump into her (yes, Anneke, you) and wondered what I would say if I did. I suppose I would ask why she needed to sign and date that sign - was her camino not valid unless she had made her mark on it? Was she planning to come back so she could reminisce by her previous tagging? And why on earth could she not just have taken a selfie to prove she was there? Packing a sharpie or can of spray paint seems very premeditated. I have no problem confronting people who litter, but how would you confront someone who is tagging?

 

[notion900]

Call this number

 

[andywild]

Call this number
View attachment 48333

Pure genius!

 

[andywild]

There was evidently no need for Team Tortoise to add their tag to the waymarker photographed by @falcon269. The original tortugas beat you to it by a decade. You must have been caught napping!

Being caught napping is one of the things team tortoise excelled at !!

 

[GerryFitz]

Some cities, Logrono for example, think graffiti is art and encourage it:

View attachment 48329

Some cities, Logrono for example, think graffiti is art and encourage it:

View attachment 48329

I actually agree that some graffiti in cities is extremely artistic - the Berlin Wall would be a typical example! But stupid scrawls like ‘Dylan loves Lisa 2018’ gets up my nose and is pure defacement! And there is so much of this type of stuff on the waymarkers - we all love people but do we need to scribble it in permanent ink - I don’t think so!

 

[Theatregal]

Some I do like...depends on what it is and where it's placed. Don't like it on the waymarkers at all - wouldn't dream of doing it myself on any camino (or anywhere else!) but have seen some pretty amazing graffiti art in places. Some beautiful and some very interesting and politicaly provocative. Had a fun walkabout in Bristol searching for Banksy with some dear U.K friends. There are graffiti artists that are also incredibly gifted muralists...though of course, not to be compared with those who are tagging camino waymarkers

 

[lunna]

Fortunately, I've only experienced this, really, on the Camino Frances. I may be a grump, but I found the banal, new age-y platitudes (e.g., "don't stop walking" and blah, blah) even more annoying than the other graffiti. Smacks of self-important privileged college kids.

That said, I'll make an exception, though, for L'Alchemiste, whose musings are dotted on small removable signs along a significant portion of the Le Puy trail - at least he is sincere, and shows his sincerity by providing walkers with the best gite by far (and a donativo no less) of any hostel/albergue/gite on any of the trails I've ever walked.

 

[Pelegrin]

The only graffiti allowed on the way marker should ' Diputacion Provincial Lugo ' which is the government institution that provides funds for the maintenance of 4200 kms of roads and municipal services as garbage collection and lighting for more or less 200000 people. And Lugo is not a rich province.

 

[notion900]

Sometimes graffiti makes a very important political statement:

 

[Sharonih]

When asked to name the one thing I didn't like about the CF my immediate answer was the Graffiti, I found it so disrespectful to the Spaniards. I don't like someone spreading trash and spray painting my home so why should we do this to another's country and then say it is acceptable because it's "tradition". the markings I loved were the signs written on stones on the ground or drawn in the dirt not defacing the countryside. Yes, some of the Graffiti is beautiful artwork and has encouraging statements but that still does not make it right.

 

[trecile]

found it so disrespectful to the Spaniards. I

I'm not condoning it, but I would guess that a fair amount of the graffiti on the Camino is done by Spaniards, since nearly half the Pilgrims are Spanish.

 

[Bob from L.A. !]

This past summer while on the Norte I was touring a beautiful old church (unknown exactly where) and found graffiti crudely engraved into the interior walls near a baptismal area of the church. While leaving I mentioned my findings to one of the priest assigned to the church. When I did he said he was aware of the issue, shrugged and said. "Sometimes some people are like animals who have to mark their territory".

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

Sometimes graffiti makes a very important political statement:
View attachment 48386

Had to think about this , but it's my opinion that this picture with a political statement doesn't belong here. Forum rule 2 .

 

[Icacos]

Sometimes graffiti makes a very important political statement:
View attachment 48386

Had to think about this , but it's my opinion that this picture with a political statement doesn't belong here. Forum rule 2 .

Oh darn ....I need someone to explain to me the political statement.

 

[Pelegrin]

Oh darn ....I need someone to explain to me the political statement.

'Mas futvol por fabor 'is not a political statement , it's a joke.Means More football please but with misspelling. Correct is 'Mas futbol por favor.' So what the writer needs is more culture.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

So what the writer needs is more culture.

Or more Galician???

 

[Pelegrin]

Or more Galician???

Ha Ha Ha. In Galician would be 'Mais futvol por fabor ' (also with misspelling ).So, the original is Spanish.

 

[SabsP]

'Mas futvol por fabor 'is not a political statement , it's a joke.Means More football please but with misspelling. Correct is 'Mas futbol por favor.' So what the writer needs is more culture.

More culture : more awareness , less ignorance.
Less graffiti also.
People who tag graffiti are like internettrolls.

 

[Charlotte Helbig]

Thank you for talking about this. We also were disgusted by the amount of graffiti we encountered when we walked the CF in the fall of 2017. We had a name for those that defaced the markers which I cannot repeat on this forum. Also distressing was that someone had removed the km distance plates from most of those beautiful markers in La Rioja. I don’t know if they have been replaced or not.

 

[Icacos]

'Mas futvol por fabor 'is not a political statement , it's a joke.Means More football please but with misspelling. Correct is 'Mas futbol por favor.' So what the writer needs is more culture.

I understood the misspelling bit, but I'm guessing that was intentional. Hmmmm, I wonder now if the political message @notion900 referred to is in the intentional misspelling. (Am leaving this here, for fear of breaking Rule 2.)

 

[notion900]

I know nothing except it's all over Lugo. And I don't think those naughty pilgrims dunnit.

Maybe they did this one in Oviedo?


The plot thickens....

 

[lunna]

I think some of those 'pilgrims' are not all that innocent....

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Humans are predictable enough in aggregate that Galicia should have known the plaques and kilometer insets would be targeted by souvenir hunters. The distance etched into the granite worked quite well in the old mojones! That is victim blaming, I know, but tax dollars should be spent with a little bit of common sense.

 

[lunna]

Humans are predictable enough in aggregate that Galicia should have known the plaques and kilometer insets would be targeted by souvenir hunters. The distance etched into the granite worked quite well in the old mojones! That is victim blaming, I know, but tax dollars should be spent with a little bit of common sense.

Aesthetics count though!

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Aesthetics count though!

I doubt that aesthetics were the deciding factor. I am betting cost. A brass plaque is much less expensive than carving in granite and can be changed easily in the future as distances change. If you think the tile or the distance marker are highly aesthetic, may I suggest a visit to the Prado!!

 

[Sharonih]

I'm not condoning it, but I would guess that a fair amount of the graffiti on the Camino is done by Spaniards, since nearly half the Pilgrims are Spanish.

I completely agree with you a lot is done by the Spanish but I feel that regardless how much they have done we should not add to it.

 

[domigee]

I may be boring but I don’t like graffiti. I feel it is a violation of the space we all share. By graffiti I mean things like ‘so and so was here’ or ‘Jesus didn’t start in ...’.
I think the need to write graffiti must be a residue of a primeval instinct, like my cats pee on things in the garden to make their mark - ‘it’s MY space’.
I thought we humans had evolved Wrong!

 

[YoCo]

This is probably an old chestnut but why do people (I won’t call them pilgrims) insist on putting stupid graffiti messages on the way markers on the Camino Frances. Having joined the Frances yesterday at Arzua from the ‘unspoilt’ Del Norte I was dismayed at all the graffiti and litter along this way! I walked the Frances twice a few years back and it has disimproved so much! Who gives these so called pilgrims the right to spray paint stupid messages on way markers. I may be old fashioned but I believe if you cannot walk in the spirit of and with respect for the Camino then don’t walk at all! Anyway that’s my Camino rant for 2018!

I'm with you. Not appreciating the messages that were positive. Really? A well intentioned message has to be spray painted? I was just on the Frances, Norte, and Primativo and just could not believe all the mess.

 

[KJFSophie]

With respect, it must be a very recent phenomenon rather than a tradition, since I also saw no graffiti when I walked the CF only a few years ago. Nor much litter either. The explosion in numbers on the CF has included younger folk who I expect are in the main responsible for the graffiti. However, many western societies seem to have had considerable success with the elimination of casual littering, (although graffiti does seem an intractable problem). I wonder whether a public education campaign could render similar successful results on the CF.

" a few years ago" ? I walked in 2014 & 2015 and was disgusted by all of the graffiti both on markers and on roads, walls, tunnels, statues, crosses, etc... I walked the Portuguese route this past Sept and saw no graffiti at all until entering Spain. Not sure what the solution is, but I find it self centered, disrespectful, and heartbreaking.

 

[Karl Oz]

" a few years ago" ? I walked in 2014 & 2015 and was disgusted by all of the graffiti both on markers and on roads, walls, tunnels, statues, crosses, etc... I walked the Portuguese route this past Sept and saw no graffiti at all until entering Spain. Not sure what the solution is, but I find it self centered, disrespectful, and heartbreaking.

Specifically it was 2012-14. And I honestly did not see any. However, I have since been thoroughly repudiated by keener-eyed pilgrims than myself. Or maybe it was a matter of timing, in that some cleaning had been done.

 

[notion900]

Blame the Romans...


"I admire you, wall, that you haven't fallen down, you who bear so much tedious writing"

From Pompeii

 

[Oravasaari]

There was a petition in the UK a while back to reinstate a much loved grafitti slogan above the M25 motorway "Give peas a chance" (peace spelled incorrectly).
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-45593174

Some of the arty murals are very good on the CF. The tagging on signs is ugly though.