Drones

[NathanS]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

I’m sure you have already googled drone rules for Spain, as have I. I too am thinking of taking my mini 2. I want to use it solely for photography, not video, of landscapes and features of geological interest so I’ll only be out in the wilds. My take is that we must register on the standard EU form. I will do that in Ireland and it will be valid for Spain. Although the mini 2 is less than 250g it is a requirement because it has a camera - privacy issues.

 

[Anniesantiago]

I personally hate them
I find them invasive, especially when I'm walking a quiet trail and one buzzes over.
But I walk the Camino looking for peace and quiet, to hopefully get away from electronics, so that's me . . .

 

[Amused212]

I personally hate them
I find them invasive, especially when I'm walking a quiet trail and one buzzes over.
But I walk the Camino looking for peace and quiet, to hopefully get away from electronics, so that's me . . .

Agree, I find them invasive and contrary to the peace of the camino.

 

[henrythedog]

Also intrusive. I’d like to be asked before I’m photographed. (I know, CCTV everywhere, surveillance society, but still …)

 

[NathanS]

I personally hate them
I find them invasive, especially when I'm walking a quiet trail and one buzzes over.
But I walk the Camino looking for peace and quiet, to hopefully get away from electronics, so that's me . . .

I understand that sentiment....mine is a Mini 2, very small, unnoticable from more than 100 feet. Also I would never fly it near other people.

 

[Anniesantiago]

I understand that sentiment....mine is a Mini 2, very small, unnoticable from more than 100 feet. Also I would never fly it near other people.

So if I'm sqatting in the bush taking a pee, you can ensure me that your drone isn't going to fly overhead?
Sorry, every time I see one, I want to shoot it down.
If I can SEE it, it can SEE me, and I really don't like that at all.

 

[JJW]

I understand that sentiment....mine is a Mini 2, very small, unnoticable from more than 100 feet. Also I would never fly it near other people.

A neighbor of mine says they like dogs, but it is insensitive dog owners that they don’t like. (Barking, pooping w/o pickup, etc) Maybe same can be said about drones?

It is difficult to find anywhere on the Frances that does not have many people on the track, so your choices to use away from people will be few and that means carrying something that is rarely put to use; these items are often found in the free boxes at albergues when good sense overcomes fancy.

I think most pilgrims will thank you for leaving it at home. When we walk to the top of a hill or peak, the photos we take with hand held devices are enhanced by the experience of climbing and also the memory of the moment that is recorded internally and can be retrieved without a power source.

 

[Damien Reynolds]

Last year this guy from near where I live claimed he was a “filmmaker” while walking around taking videos of other Peregrinos with his iPhone without their permission. It annoyed me. The final straw was when I and friends were hanging out for our last night together, watching the sunset on the cliffs at Finesterre, when his annoyingly loud buzzing drone perched over our heads obviously filming us. I think he thought he was cool. Not cool.

 

[Purple Backpack]

They actually scare me. I had one follow me down a street and literally couldn't get away from it until there was a building I could pop into. I started using an umbrella whenever one is around.

 

[Tincatinker]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

Just in case you've not done that google thing here's at least one account: https://www.grupooneair.com/spanish...nes,airport, aerodrome or controlled airspace.

Data Protection & therefore privacy rules in the EU can catch the unwary. That said so long as you remain within the rules and comply with guidance there is nothing to stop you using a Drone for photography purposes along the Caminos. Except, perhaps, for other peoples feelings...

 

[lt56ny]

I understand that sentiment....mine is a Mini 2, very small, unnoticable from more than 100 feet. Also I would never fly it near other people.

Never say never as the saying goes. They are intrusive and they are an invasion of privacy for homeowners on the camino. Do you always know when you will be over a home or even a person walking? I do not know? In my most humble and singular opinion there are many of us who think there needs to be a limit to electronics etc. When you are in your own private space it is fine. But on the Camino or those really rude people who listen and watch videos or speak on the phone in sleeping areas in albergues or who stay on their phone after the lights have been turned off are inconsiderate and rude. You want to talk or watch videos without a headset or be on your phone when the lights are out, go sit on the toilet or outside. It isn't that tough to do.

 

[Phoenix]

Within the rules, fly fly fly your drone until each and every battery is depleted.

 

[Damien Reynolds]

Within the rules, fly fly fly your drone until each and every battery is depleted.

Or I hit it with a well placed random rock throw… fair?

 

[Phoenix]

Some of the responses ITT make me want to buy a drone just to take with me on Camino.

Moderator note - ITT means In This Thread

 

[Amused212]

I understand that sentiment....mine is a Mini 2, very small, unnoticable from more than 100 feet. Also I would never fly it near other people.

Is it silent? Exactly how small? How quickly can you get up and out of sight so as not to be unsightly or noisy? If you must bring it, maybe you could only use it if you there are no people around. That would pretty impossible on the Frances but maybe one of the other routes would be better suited to drones.

 

[Sparrow in Texas]

In general, I think that europeans are much more sensitive than Americans about the possibility of being in photos taken by someone else. This has as much to do with privacy as with personal security. I take photos of places, not people and never post them online without permission. This goes especially if children are in the photo.

 

[Zordmot]

I actually feel honored to be in other people’s photos of their Camino. I smile and wave.

 

[Roland49]

There are some basic pan-european regulations.
You can fly them for fun / private w/o permit (up to 250g MTOW), don't fly over private property or over groups of people or in cities. Only fly on sight and not higher than 120m over ground. You have to place a plate with your name and contact on the drone. No take-off near airports or airfields. Update the drone's firmware! You should have an insurance.
The maximum fine for violation is 225.000€.

HTH
Roland

 

[Kev&Kath]

Out walking a few days ago and observed this guy launching a DJI Mini 2. Honestly, I could hardly hear it…and after about 10 seconds…couldn’t even see it!

I was certainly drawn to my first Camino…largely by watching a few YouTube…ers who incorporated drone footage in their videos. Just about all footage was filmed well off the walking track. I definitely appreciate their part in inspiring this pilgrim to walk.
The above aside…I also wouldn’t want one sitting in my face, and would only hope most drone owners would think the same.

 

[Damien Reynolds]

Out walking a few days ago and observed this guy launching a DJI Mini 2. Honestly, I could hardly hear it…and after about 10 seconds…couldn’t even see it!

I was certainly drawn to my first Camino…largely by watching a few YouTube…ers who incorporated drone footage in their videos. Just about all footage was filmed well off the walking track. I definitely appreciate their part in inspiring this pilgrim to walk.
The above aside…I also wouldn’t want one sitting in my face, and would only hope most drone owners would think the same.

Totally get it. Agree. Just keep it out of my face and earbuds, and don’t take any pictures of me without my permission.

 

[jsalt]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

Hi, why do you want to bring it on a pilgrimage?
Not judging, just curious.

 

[Anniesantiago]

I actually feel honored to be in other people’s photos of their Camino. I smile and wave.

While you're peeing?
Whatever floats your boat, I guess.
(Someone just called me out on how rude this sounded, so I'm adding a smiley face because I really WAS laughing when I posed it - it's hard to get humor across when you can't see someone's face.)

 

[Peregrinopaul]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

I have to be honest, Nathan, when I first saw your post I was slow to reply because I was waiting for the onslaught. You received 22 replies so far, 3 of which actually offered a reply to your straightforward question. I would like to point out that there are probably a billion photographs of the Camino with ubiquitous pilgrims in the picture, one of whom may very well be you.

These people are walking in a public space. Was the photographer committing a serious violation of privacy? Should he/she have asked permission for these people to be in the picture? The photo was taken from an altitude of 3 feet. Should it be judged differently if it had been taken from an altitude of 30 feet?
Yes, it is possible to violate privacy with a drone, just as it is with a mobile phone. If Nathan or I use our drones we will obviously be sensitive to peoples feelings in this regard, just as most people are when they take photos on the Camino.

 

[SeaHorse]

While you're peeing?
Whatever floats your boat, I guess.

Do you pee outside that often that drones are a serious concern? There are bars with toilets on every step on Frances. Please don't take it as an insult, I don't know how to phrase it better so I just shoot it out: please see a doctor about it.

To the author of this thread: I knew this question will bring out the worst in people. Also use search, there was at least one another thread before.

 

[Anamiri]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

There are some great videos including drone footage, Efron Gonzales has a whole series, and I'm seen a few others on this forum as well - there was a good one by a young guy who went with an older friend.
Most of them offer a mix of speaking direct to camera, wider drone footage and other shots. None of them breach privacy that I'm aware of, I'm sure they could offer advice.
Here's one Efron made of the Norte which is enhanced by his drone footage.

 

[NathanS]

Hi, why do you want to bring it on a pilgrimage?
Not judging, just curious.

I am not going for any spiritual reasons. I travel for the culture, history and scenery. Drones record scenery magnificently.

 

[NathanS]

I personally hate them
I find them invasive, especially when I'm walking a quiet trail and one buzzes over.
But I walk the Camino looking for peace and quiet, to hopefully get away from electronics, so that's me . . .

My small Mini 2 is nearly unnoticeable unless it is very near you. And I would not fly it near anyone.

 

[Colette Z]

I am not going for any spiritual reasons. I travel for the culture, history and scenery. Drones record scenery magnificently.

I just returned from my 4th Camino (portuguese central from Lisbon). I didn’t encounter any drones let alone many fellow pilgrims. Although you’re not doing the Camino for “spiritual” reasons if you’re occupied with a drone you’ll miss out on your the magic of disconnecting from this especially now “messy” world. If your reason is for culture and scenery perhaps you don’t specifically need to occupy the Camino path? But I am a tolerant pilgrim, so perhaps just respect others who ARE on a once (or more) in a lifetime journey. The Camino IS my church in nature.

 

[Anniesantiago]

Do you pee outside that often that drones are a serious concern? There are bars with toilets on every step on Frances. Please don't take it as an insult, I don't know how to phrase it better so I just shoot it out: please see a doctor about it.

To the author of this thread: I knew this question will bring out the worst in people. Also use search, there was at least one another thread before.

I've walked the Frances many many times, sometimes twice a year, so I'm pretty familiar with the territory.

However, this is posted under "Pilgrim Topics Related to ALL Routes."
And yes, I DO pee outside quite often when on certain routes.
There are many routes where there ARE no bars with toilets the entire etapa.

You're right, my reply was flippant, as I was laughing when I posted,
and I probably could have said it better.
But it's still a concern for me and probably others.
And, by the way, I've had a drone follow me on a trail in the California desert and it was a bit frightening.
I've also had one right outside my dining room window - that also was disturbing.
It's an invasion of privacy imo.

 

[Anniesantiago]

I'm trying to be more positive these days - trying not to "hate" things - so I'll change my post to "I dislike them intensely (when they invade my privacy)

 

[Former member 92300]

Out walking a few days ago and observed this guy launching a DJI Mini 2. Honestly, I could hardly hear it…and after about 10 seconds…couldn’t even see it!

I was certainly drawn to my first Camino…largely by watching a few YouTube…ers who incorporated drone footage in their videos. Just about all footage was filmed well off the walking track. I definitely appreciate their part in inspiring this pilgrim to walk.
The above aside…I also wouldn’t want one sitting in my face, and would only hope most drone owners would think the same.

Yes, it is funny because I "love" seeing the drone footage in some of the better Camino videos - but I also find them very annoying. I don't want to be filmed by some random person who I probably don't even know. And I don't want to hear/see it. I think for me a big thing is - how far away is the person managing the drone from? Does the owner realize when they are hovering over someone? Is the owner able to see when they need to move their drone away from people? It all boils down to how respectful the owner is when flying a drone. That said - while I may not be able to immediately escape a flying drone - I can control how often I walk near a pilgrim who likes to fly a drone - once I figure out who is flying it. I can slow down or speed up my walk to get away from that person.

 

[Albertagirl]

I have had a drone fly near over my head in a narrow street, with houses on both sides, on a camino route. I was both frightened: a crashed drone could land on my head, and offended at the invasion of my privacy. I have also had my picture taken without asking me on a camino, but this was partly my own fault, as I was sitting on the steps in front of a small chapel and the passing pilgrim probably wanted a photo of the chapel, not of me. I think that some, perhaps many, pilgrims are introverts like myself and feel a deep attachment to our privacy. But outdoor spaces on the camino are not private, even squatting behind a bush, which is sometimes necessary in Spain. I can only hope that any drone flying over only gets a picture of the back of my head and my shoulders. One reason why I am looking forward to walking the Le Puy this fall is the presence of public toilets along the route.

 

[lt56ny]

I actually feel honored to be in other people’s photos of their Camino. I smile and wave.

While you're peeing?
Whatever floats your boat, I guess.
(Someone just called me out on how rude this sounded, so I'm adding a smiley face because I really WAS laughing when I posed it - it's hard to get humor across when you can't see someone's face.)

My small Mini 2 is nearly unnoticeable unless it is very near you. And I would not fly it near anyone.

Annie it is funny and I don't think you needed to add any smiley faces but that is your choice. It is also Zordmot's choice to feel what he feels. It is the person who started the thread's choice to use a drone. But that "choice" imposes himself on many others who do not want to have their homes, farms, or person photographed whether they know it or not, or pilgrims walking who feel the same way, or for others who have their own reasons why they don't like a drone buzzing overhead.
The bottom line is no matter how "careful" someone is with a drone there is absolutely no way whatsoever they will never impose their wants over someone else"s lives and needs. You can never know who is emerging from a home, from a field or from sitting under a tree. No drone or their owner can be all seeing and knowing. Each person also has a choice of what they consider noticeable or not.

 

[Kev&Kath]

Yes, it is funny because I "love" seeing the drone footage in some of the better Camino videos - but I also find them very annoying. I don't want to be filmed by some random person who I probably don't even know. And I don't want to hear/see it. I think for me a big thing is - how far away is the person managing the drone from? Does the owner realize when they are hovering over someone? Is the owner able to see when they need to move their drone away from people? It all boils down to how respectful the owner is when flying a drone. That said - while I may not be able to immediately escape a flying drone - I can control how often I walk near a pilgrim who likes to fly a drone - once I figure out who is flying it. I can slow down or speed up my walk to get away from that person.

I hear ya! I suspect you wouldn't even see the better drone flyers, and you certainly shouldn't see or hear their craft. I recall one of the 'better' Camin drone users I follow on YouTube saying '...he gets in and takes his footage and gets out quickly...no fuss and no annoyance...'. If they were all like him....we'd all be pretty relaxed. And yes...they're monitoring the drone through their controller and know exactly where the drone is and what image(s) its capturing. They would know if their drone was hovering over people.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

I haven't read all the replies, but have yet to encounter seeing a drone on the Camino, although I've not gone yet since my 2020 Camino was cancelled.
I love Efren's videos!

 

[Kev&Kath]

Annie it is funny and I don't think you needed to add any smiley faces but that is your choice. It is also Zordmot's choice to feel what he feels. It is the person who started the thread's choice to use a drone. But that "choice" imposes himself on many others who do not want to have their homes, farms, or person photographed whether they know it or not, or pilgrims walking who feel the same way, or for others who have their own reasons why they don't like a drone buzzing overhead.
The bottom line is no matter how "careful" someone is with a drone there is absolutely no way whatsoever they will never impose their wants over someone else"s lives and needs. You can never know who is emerging from a home, from a field or from sitting under a tree. No drone or their owner can be all seeing and knowing. Each person also has a choice of what they consider noticeable or not.

So....are we're suggesting cameras should be banned altogether? Your second paragraph infers any photography is invasive.

The drones are used for photography. The initial question was based on the DJI Mini 2....a drone that is the size of my iPhone...invisible to all but the pilot, and pretty much silent to anyone on the ground. In the hands of a responsible flyer....it would have absolutely no impact on the wise pilgrim.

 

[Phoenix]

Overall, this thread has the vibe of a scowling Clint Eastwood in Gran Torino growling, "Get off my lawn!"

 

[lt56ny]

I do not know where i suggested that. A drone and a camera are no where near the same thing. Once again your idea of absolute may be totally different than someone else's. Mine included. Overall when I look at the impact and potential impact of drones I see far more avenues for abuse and the threat to personal privacy or even physical harm. Just ask the civilians on the ground in different places around the world the destruction drones have wrought. Once again for as many similarities of a camera and drone, there are just as many, if not more differences. I think it makes no sense to me when people assume what another person is thinking about a completely unrelated topic when you have no knowledge of the other person. The only fact that is evident in your assumption is you have no knowledge whatsoever of what I think of people who take photos with cameras and how and what effect it has on others. Remember what Felix Unger says about assuming.

 

[Kev&Kath]

There are some great videos including drone footage, Efron Gonzales has a whole series, and I'm seen a few others on this forum as well - there was a good one by a young guy who went with an older friend.
Most of them offer a mix of speaking direct to camera, wider drone footage and other shots. None of them breach privacy that I'm aware of, I'm sure they could offer advice.
Here's one Efron made of the Norte which is enhanced by his drone footage.

Efren's Frances series was really my introduction to the Camino. Like you...I think his drone work is brilliant!

 

[Kev&Kath]

The attached Camino Story, by drone, sort of sold me on walking the Camino, and now after walking, it remains as inspiring as ever. Irrespective of your opinions on drones....I'm pretty sure....everyone who loves the Camino....would enjoy this.

 

[JJW]

Some of the responses ITT make me want to buy a drone just to take with me on Camino.

Overall, this thread has the vibe of a scowling Clint Eastwood in Gran Torino growling, "Get off my lawn!"

Thanks for your opinion, although you are in the minority on the issue in this string I don't think you are reflecting NathanS responses to the concerns of many.

He asked a simple question on a forum used by pilgrims, not legal experts, on aviation rules. Pilgrims gave their opinions about courtesies their negative experiences.

NathanS assured folks that he would be mindful of intrusion. That is a good example of positive communication, and shows respect. Thank you Nathan, and welcome aboard!

 

[Phoenix]

Thanks for your opinion, although you are in the minority on the issue in this string I don't think you are reflecting NathanS responses to the concerns of many.

He asked a simple question on a forum used by pilgrims, not legal experts, on aviation rules. Pilgrims gave their opinions about courtesies their negative experiences.

NathanS assured folks that he would be mindful of intrusion. That is a good example of positive communication, and shows respect. Thank you Nathan, and welcome aboard!

Oh, I understand what's going on ... it's called sarcasm/levity in response to all the bellyaching.

Thanks for the counseling, but not needed.

 

[henrythedog]

Oh, I understand what's going on ... it's called sarcasm/levity in response to all the bellyaching.

Thanks for the counseling, but not needed.

I’m not sure that’s the case Phoenix - but I do think it shows that there are divergent views. Perhaps some are borne out of ignorance - I’ll certainly confess mine. It’s commendable that Nathan seems to appreciate the views expressed.

Some drone-enabled photography is quite exceptional and shows a perspective that would previously have required a full-sized helicopter.

Everyone’s entitled to do as they wish, IMHO, providing that it harms no other. And therein lies the problem.

 

[Albertagirl]

I love Efren's videos!

I like Efren's videos even more since I saw his recent video of his walk through Pamplona, after walking the Le Puy. He commented that there was a recent ban on the use of drones in Pamplona which he was honouring, so the drone in his recent video was from a previous time in Pamplona. I see this as respect of the law and letting viewers know that the drone video was not taken for that specific occasion. For whatever reason, I felt safe with this.

 

[Sparrow in Texas]

I would like to express my appreciation to NathanS, the original poster of this thread for asking about the use of drones on the Camino. He was courteous and respectful about a topic that can draw strong reactions. I appreciate that he would ask and not just assume that drones would be welcome. Thank you NathanS!
For the record, I do not care for drones, but them I have never flown one either.

 

[NathanS]

I've walked the Frances many many times, sometimes twice a year, so I'm pretty familiar with the territory.

However, this is posted under "Pilgrim Topics Related to ALL Routes."
And yes, I DO pee outside quite often when on certain routes.
There are many routes where there ARE no bars with toilets the entire etapa.

You're right, my reply was flippant, as I was laughing when I posted,
and I probably could have said it better.
But it's still a concern for me and probably others.
And, by the way, I've had a drone follow me on a trail in the California desert and it was a bit frightening.
I've also had one right outside my dining room window - that also was disturbing.
It's an invasion of privacy imo.

I didn't yet read your "flippant" reply - now very curious! But don't assume all drone operators are disrepectful or invaders of privacy! As always, a few bad apples spoil the broth!

 

[Peregrinopaul]

How many of you have been “invaded” by a drone flying over you on the Camino? Does the “problem” actually exist?

 

[Anniesantiago]

How many of you have been “invaded” by a drone flying over you on the Camino? Does the “problem” actually exist?

:::raises her hand::::
Yes, it exists.

 

[Amused212]

:::raises her hand::::
Yes, it exists.

Have not been bothered on the Camino (have only walked it once), but while visiting a waterfall in Iceland we were annoyed by the buzzing of two drones. Perhaps they were flying too low but it was quite loud.

 

[Roland49]

In 2019 on my CF I've seen 2 times a drone. None in cities, none over private property, none over groups.
The first one was near Atapuerca, maybe used to map the digging site (was a massive Octocopter),
the other one was near the canal of Fromista. Both non-intrusive and well flown.

 

[Damien Reynolds]

How many of you have been “invaded” by a drone flying over you on the Camino? Does the “problem” actually exist?

2005-2020 Never saw one.

2021 - Just one annoying drone not conscientiously flown.

 

[Former member 92300]

How many of you have been “invaded” by a drone flying over you on the Camino? Does the “problem” actually exist?

Well, I did see one on my Camino last summer - thankfully it was far enough away it didn't bother me. That said - I have experienced rude drone etiquette in other adventures and in my own neighborhood at home. Is it a big problem on the Camino? Nope. Most pilgrims don't want to carry the weight of a drone, much less take the time to fly it. I do have an issue with poor drone flying etiquette, who don't know or care (depends on interpretation) who their drone may be bothering. I do not have a problem with someone more experienced flying a drone responsibly and away from people to the extent possible. And like I said before - if I find a drone flyer to be bothersome - I have the option of speeding up or slowing down my walk to avoid it. So - I can control my experience with drone flyers that way. We can all make an effort to avoid the situation if we want to (maybe not immediately escape the drone - but to not walk with a drone day after day).

Back to the OP - Fly responsibly as I think you will based on your posts, and all will be good!

 

[David Tallan]

Personally, I don't have an issue with drones if they are flown legally and far enough away from people not to pose a safety concern, especially if they are far enough away that I can't hear them.

I understand that some people have privacy concerns that people may by photographed by drones without their permission. As Peregrinopaul points out above, people are photographed by handheld cameras all the time on the Camino. I admit, there are plenty of photos I've taken on the Camino (especially after Sarria!) that include other pilgrims without having secured all of their permissions in advance. People also show up in webcams (e.g. at the wine fountain or in Santiago). I don't see a significant difference in the invasion of privacy of taking photos of someone without permission depending on whether the camera is handheld, on a tripod, mounted on a building, or mounted on a drone.

 

[MichelleElynHogan]

If it is of any help, look up the channel, "Efrén Gonzalez," on Youtube. He has a plethora of vlogs there of his travels, mostly Caminos in Europe but also includes South America, Italy, France and Mt. Everest. Soon, he will be leaving for a trek in Japan. He uses a drone in each and every one of his instalments.

 

[William Garza]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

What percent of people are that hypervigilant to hear and much less identify the whir?
Everyone is in their own head and mind in public places and have higher priorities watching for hazards if an organic nature.

I photograph professionally.
My large DSLR and white lens makes it painfully obvious what i am doing.

Most people in large venues will see and wave, so one of two things

1.My high paying client is getting their shot so I move,wait or extremely politely tell them i need to get a shot..and most times they oblige.

2.out comes my cell phone and i get the shots..because it has a 108mp camera,shoots 8k video which is obnoxiously better than my DSLR. Because my client needs the shots.

Drone cameras are amazing for what they can do.
But they wont be CIA spy satellites.

As for when ime a touregrino?

Ime there for the scenery and people are in the way.
Follow the rules
Follow the decorum
Do you.

 

[Antonius Vaessen]

Many posts stress the intruding aspects of using a drone. Most of them apply also to the use of photocameras or smartphones, certainly with the possibilities of zooming in. You will never know if you are being photographed. The decisive factor in judging the filmer/photographer is how careful he/she is in avoiding to intrude in the privacy of others.

 

[Katherine Radeka]

Drones give me the creeps.

They are far more intrusive and obnoxious than smartphones to my lizard brain, even though I know any person with a smartphone also has a high res camera. It’s not rational I know.

If I see a drone operator, I give them dagger looks and wide berths.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

I give up.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

I hereby apologise to the people in this photo for invading their privacy. If you don't recognise it, it's the Ramblas, Barcelona. This is the only time the photo has been shared on social media.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

Since I thoroughly enjoy watching drone footage of many beautiful places in the world, I am not opposed to them in the least; assuming they are flown within laws and without recklessness where people are concerned.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

Check out

Videos of the camino by Peter Fleisher

 

[naplesdon]

Efren Gonzales is the expert about drones and has a large library of vlogs on You Tube. He could describe a lot of issues he has faced. He is on FB

 

[Ultreia et Suseia!]

Together with the rude cyclists and the close encounters with hunters, this has to be the most downer post.
Pffff so much for the camino's introspection and a break from urban life

 

[SabsP]

Together with the rude cyclists and the close encounters with hunters, this has to be the most downer post.
Pffff so much for the camino's introspection and a break from urban life

Walking a Camino is like Life itself.The good, the bad & the ugly.

Carpe Diem!

 

[Pathfinder075]

Can't say i would take a drone on Camino. Even a Mavic. If I could get lighter goggles and radio, then maybe I would consider taking my whoop and a couple of LiPos, but not for shooting videos. Only for ripping bandos, of which there are a fair few along the Frances. I don't fly near people, in fact I hate being around people when I fly as it adds in an unknown vector that can cause trouble. But each to their own.

 

[Former member 22438]

There are some great videos including drone footage, Efron Gonzales has a whole series, and I'm seen a few others on this forum as well - there was a good one by a young guy who went with an older friend.
Most of them offer a mix of speaking direct to camera, wider drone footage and other shots. None of them breach privacy that I'm aware of, I'm sure they could offer advice.
Here's one Efron made of the Norte which is enhanced by his drone footage.

Was he using the drone by night ? I only see a black screen

 

[Zordmot]

I guess I don’t understand all the ink spilled here over being bothered by the occasional drone when today, between Sarria and Portomarin I saw no drones but was suddenly confronted at least 10 times by cyclists risking my life by suddenly passing way too close to and riding way too fast. Not to mention the presence of groups of pilgrims speaking and laughing so loudly you could hear them at least 1 km away. I’ll take a drone over that any day.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

@Zordmot, your comparison is an interesting point of view, and I tend to agree with your opinion.

 

[Anamiri]

Was he using the drone by night ? I only see a black screen

I dont know why that isnt working for you. It is a beautiful video.

 

[MinaKamina]

I understand that sentiment....mine is a Mini 2, very small, unnoticable from more than 100 feet. Also I would never fly it near other people.

People have a right to privacy and you are not allowed to fly a drone over them or near them if the camera catches their image. This also applies outdoors.

 

[henrythedog]

Can't say i would take a drone on Camino. Even a Mavic. If I could get lighter goggles and radio, then maybe I would consider taking my whoop and a couple of LiPos, but not for shooting videos. Only for ripping bandos, of which there are a fair few along the Frances. I don't fly near people, in fact I hate being around people when I fly as it adds in an unknown vector that can cause trouble. But each to their own.

I’m genuinely interested in the topic but I don’t understand much of your post - whoop, LiPos; ripping bandos and the unknown vector are utterly incomprehensible to me.

 

[Former member 95219]

I’m genuinely interested in the topic but I don’t understand much of your post - whoop, LiPos; ripping bandos and the unknown vector are utterly incomprehensible to me.

Me too!

Poor fella asks a simple question about drones and everyone assume he going to break all sort of privacy rules, etiquette, etc! Lucky he’s not being an outside broadcast unit!

 

[William Garza]

Me too!

Poor fella asks a simple question about drones and everyone assume he going to break all sort of privacy rules, etiquette, etc! Lucky he’s not being an outside broadcast unit!

Ive gone and do go live with drones and media devices during severe weather events.
people smiled and waived excitedly because as a group?..we were simply humans being in the moments.

 

[Roland49]

Me too!

Poor fella asks a simple question about drones and everyone assume he going to break all sort of privacy rules, etiquette, etc! Lucky he’s not being an outside broadcast unit!

If you don't know the rules it is likely that you break them.

If he was a professional, he do know the rules. Broadcast units do have a communication-officer these days that handles all kinds of requests or complaints. The operators do not have to worry.

My post #19 give the basic rules in Europe. That's all you have to know if you don't fly drones over 250gr. MTOW.

 

[Pathfinder075]

I’m genuinely interested in the topic but I don’t understand much of your post - whoop, LiPos; ripping bandos and the unknown vector are utterly incomprehensible to me.

Whoop = a small drone about the size of your hand that is used by most new pilots learning to fly. Mine weighs about 42g. They are easy to carry and can fly in places that bigger drones have issues with, they also make less noise, so are less likely to scare people.
LiPo = Lithium Polymer Battery. Just the type of battery most drones use.
Bando = Abandoned Building. A good place to fly that is generally frequented by drone pilots. It's unusual to find members of the public in them unless they are doing UrbEx (Urban Exploration). Sometimes you find graffiti artists in them.
Ripping a Bando = Basically flying at an abandoned site and maybe getting some good footage to post on youtube.
Unknown vectors to me are anything outside my control that might threaten me in anyway while i'm doing something (not strictly drone related, but in general). I relate it to threat vectors in cybersecurity, but am not sure if my using it in the way i do is contextually correct.

Basically I fly for fun and don't record people, or actually want to be near people when flying. I like to fly alone or with a couple of friends. I build my own drones. I sometimes record footage of my flights to post on forums I frequent or Youtube.

Hope that helps.

 

[MinaKamina]

These people are walking in a public space. Was the photographer committing a serious violation of privacy? Should he/she have asked permission for these people to be in the picture?

In European law, you have a right to privacy in a public space.
Yes, the photographer was violating that privacy.
Yes, the photographer should have requested permission to take the picture AND the photographer should have requested permission to publish or distribute the picture.

Hope this helps.

 

[Roland49]

In European law, you have a right to privacy in a public space.
Yes, the photographer was violating that privacy.
Yes, the photographer should have requested permission to take the picture AND the photographer should have requested permission to publish or distribute the picture.

Hope this helps.

There are some limitations in this.

IF the persons are the main subject, all you mentioned applies.

But there is the so called "panoramic freedom". As long, as the photographed persons are not the main subject, they can't get control over the image nor the photographer. They have to be "additions / extras" to the main subject, landscape or building.

Only in Italy and France you do not have those rights as a photographer in Europe.

For more information, I recommend this site.

 

[axel_w]

Well with a clear cohort of mixed opinions surrounding drone use - here is my product of my CF in 2021.
Maybe some in this thread may have a different view when they see how the distances of the subjects filmed are too far to make out any real detail. Some of the arguments here against drones only seem to denote that handheld cameras are a bigger issue - which they're not.

Hope you enjoy anyway! <3

 

[Camino Chrissy]

Very nice video, Axel. I am who who enjoys drone footage and yours was a quick "overview" of the Camino.

 

[donalomahony]

Well with a clear cohort of mixed opinions surrounding drone use - here is my product of my CF in 2021.
Maybe some in this thread may have a different view when they see how the distances of the subjects filmed are too far to make out any real detail. Some of the arguments here against drones only seem to denote that handheld cameras are a bigger issue - which they're not.

Hope you enjoy anyway! <3

 

[William Garza]

People would have kittens when they see what a 400mp stacked photo could show...
Looking at a Mavic Air 2 to replace my dead one.

 

[Bristle Boy]

I love the delicious irony that this forum throws up sometimes.
I have never encountered a drone flying overhead and whilst this forum has highlighted some peoples need to pee (and worse) I would hardly complain if I was doing it in, and on, someone else's land. Rather than bemoan my choice of toilet (tree cover as well as bush cover might be advisable) it seems churlish to blame the drone rather than your own inability to hide your embarrassment.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

People would have kittens when they see what a 400mp stacked photo could show...
Looking at a Mavic Air 2 to replace my dead one.

WG, what language are you speaking here?

 

[William Garza]

WG, what language are you speaking here?

Woops,Sorry!

Some cameras can take a series of still photos and combine them in camera or via software on your computor.
The file sizes are dependent on your camera, i was referencing a 102 mp file in a Fujifilm camera.it would take 4 images and "stack" them..combine the images into one for incredible detail.
Imagine a field of flowers where every flower is in focus top to bottom sky to foreground
Or
Imagine a photo of the Cathedral in Santiago de Compostela
You can zoom in to see details in the stone work,paintings, the inside that may escape notice otherwise.
It doesnt work for people as they move too much..but the details to be seen and found..are simply amazing.

Imagine creating a photo that one day can be used as a reference standard to what Santiagos statue looked like in 2022. Every last detail, color,texture,position of accessories, their compositions,weave,texture,colors,,the stone work behind and over him.
And someone can see exactly what it was that moment.

Thats my chase..moments.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

Some people feel compelled to fly drones over the Camino. Others take photos of everything around them. Most of them post their pictures somewhere for others to see. Thousands and thousands of pictures and images... just check out the media files here on the forum! Some of the material is fabulous. Some of it is not.

Still, the people with their cameras and drones keep thinking THEIR photo or image will be more wonderful or different from all the rest. (Do any drone-ographers think they can outdo Efrem?)
Or maybe it's a matter of it being THEIR photo or image. By capturing this bit of light in a box, that piece of time and space becomes their private property. They can take it home and share it and treasure it, or they can just throw the memory card in a drawer... in any case, it is THEIRS to keep, preserved forever.

Any time you take a machine and place it between you and the thing you're experiencing, you are removing yourself from the moment. Instead of being there with the moon and poppies, you are instead taking a picture, or flying a drone over said moon and poppies. You're missing out.

You come all this way to walk the Camino. Be here.

 

[Bristle Boy]

In European law, you have a right to privacy in a public space.
Yes, the photographer was violating that privacy.
Yes, the photographer should have requested permission to take the picture AND the photographer should have requested permission to publish or distribute the picture.

Hope this helps.

Thank you for this post. I may be a bit of a scallywag but I'm very much a rule of law person. You may be able to clear this up for me.
@peregrina2000 posted a very informative piece on the law concerning public masturbation/flashing as defined in the Citizens Security Act 2015 and the punishment of between 100 and 600 euros imposed for such an offence.
Now...if I were to witness such an occurrence and take a picture of the perpetrator for identification and possible prosecution purposes could I, according to your post; be culpable under the law by not asking for permission first?

 

[Camino Chrissy]

@Rebekah Scott, I think you can totally BE there experiencing the Caminos, and still take pictures to preserve your memories. I do not take photos of strangers, only of my family, friends, scenery, architecture and food...I do not agree with your view. I smile at home and get immeasurable satisfaction from my photos when I reminisce.

 

[C clearly]

Any time you take a machine and place it between you and the thing you're experiencing, you are removing yourself from the moment. Instead of being there with the moon and poppies, you are instead taking a picture, or flying a drone over said moon and poppies. You're missing out.

That "moment" includes my effort to capture it. Perhaps I am adding an element to the moment rather than missing it.

 

[Tincatinker]

Thank you for this post. I may be a bit of a scallywag but I'm very much a rule of law person. You may be able to clear this up for me.
@peregrina2000 posted a very informative piece on the law concerning public masturbation/flashing as defined in the Citizens Security Act 2015 and the punishment of between 100 and 600 euros imposed for such an offence.
Now...if I were to witness such an occurrence and take a picture of the perpetrator for identification and possible prosecution purposes could I, according to your post; be culpable under the law by not asking for permission first?

There are sufficient "exceptions" in statute to make all things possible in all possible circumstances

Acting in preservation of public peace (if you think thats garble try translating the French version) is a specific exemption - it is perfectly permissible to take a photograph of a person perpetrating a crime as they, by their action, have placed themselves outside the law. Students of paradox might like to research various cases brought against the UK Metropolitan Police for photographing participants in lawful and licensed demonstrations. But please don't post your research results here 'cos thats not what this forum is for...

 

[William Garza]

That "moment" includes my effort to capture it. Perhaps I am adding an element to the moment rather than missing it.

Took the sentiments straight from my heart

 

[William Garza]

Some people feel compelled to fly drones over the Camino. Others take photos of everything around them. Most of them post their pictures somewhere for others to see. Thousands and thousands of pictures and images... just check out the media files here on the forum! Some of the material is fabulous. Some of it is not.

Still, the people with their cameras and drones keep thinking THEIR photo or image will be more wonderful or different from all the rest. (Do any drone-ographers think they can outdo Efrem?)
Or maybe it's a matter of it being THEIR photo or image. By capturing this bit of light in a box, that piece of time and space becomes their private property. They can take it home and share it and treasure it, or they can just throw the memory card in a drawer... in any case, it is THEIRS to keep, preserved forever.

Any time you take a machine and place it between you and the thing you're experiencing, you are removing yourself from the moment. Instead of being there with the moon and poppies, you are instead taking a picture, or flying a drone over said moon and poppies. You're missing out.

You come all this way to walk the Camino. Be here.

It has and always been an existential moment for me when I take the time to create a photo.
Its always the totality of the moment living in me and through me in a photo

The...My creative process is more than composition, it is physics,art,technique,physicality,...the physical,mental,emotional moment..its always more than a perfunctory button pushed.

Its the physics
Within and throughout
The tau of the moment..that evanecsence of ...knowing...from the micro to the macro.

I know everything
And nothing... all at once

The machine in my hands is merely the transit for my being in the moment.
I am at that moment,fully alive and aware and a glowing point in my timeline.

I wont explain about how the components work, what external forces affect it, what can do to change what it does drilling down endlessly of the mechanism..isms in concert in totality..because its innate to me
Same of the external phenomenon.
Same of my internal workings at that moment

I am alive at that moment

Totally and fully alive and with each picture i can recall what my 5 senses were
I simplify because i am wordy and can fill a book just to say what you said..

Be there.

It is simply part of my process
Its a touchstone to everything
And helps me empty into the vital nothing.

I wont remember someday.
I already have the signs..words escape me..painfully and I have to let them.

Things escape me so easy

This is no criticism, its an endorsement of your sentiment!

One day, the essential me...will dissapear into the black
Ime not really afraid of that. What i shoot will be me
It will be my vision of the world ,how i saw it i leave behind.

 

[VNwalking]

I'm one of those with lots of photos.

And I appreciate what Rebekah said because it very much describes what I (mostly) experience when I'm in photo mode. When that happens I begin to see things through a creative inner filter, and it is definitely a very different process than just looking and being open and receptive. It's subtle. But noticible, if I'm paying attention. That's accompanied by a not so subtle greed to have that image 'for later.'

I do look at them sometimes, and yes, the image and memory bring pleasure. But no photos will ever capture what it is to be there, completely. And the taking of them meant that for that moment and all the moments of thinking about it beforehand, I was much less there.

 

[Zordmot]

Is anyone experienced with or familiar with the rules about the use of drones in Portugal and Spain? I hope to bring my small DJI Mini 2.

I don’t have a drone but I guess I just don’t understand why people get all worked up about being filmed walking the Camino from 100 ft elevation

 

[C clearly]

I just don’t understand why people get all worked up

Well, now you will get them all worked up again by renewing the thread!

 

[dick bird]

Try applying the Kantian rule 'what if this behaviour became universal?' as a basic criterion for deciding whether an action is socially acceptable or ethical. Look at it this way: consider how many people take photos on their phone. Now consider if all those people were using drones instead. Consider what the Praça de Obradoiro would be like if even a tenth of the people there were using drones.

 

[Former member 49149]

Try applying the Kantian rule 'what if this behaviour became universal?' as a basic criterion for deciding whether an action is socially acceptable or ethical. Look at it this way: consider how many people take photos on their phone. Now consider if all those people were using drones instead. Consider what the Praça de Obradoiro would be like if even a tenth of the people there were using drones.

Oh my! My poor wee mammy practised Kant without even being aware he had a theory! (So, ok, all your pals want to jump off a cliff...)

 

[Former member 49149]

I'm one of those with lots of photos.

And I appreciate what Rebekah said because it very much describes what I (mostly) experience when I'm in photo mode. When that happens I begin to see things through a creative inner filter, and it is definitely a very different process than just looking and being open and receptive. It's subtle. But noticible, if I'm paying attention. That's accompanied by a not so subtle greed to have that image 'for later.'

I do look at them sometimes, and yes, the image and memory bring pleasure. But no photos will ever capture what it is to be there, completely. And the taking of them meant that for that moment and all the moments of thinking about it beforehand, I was much less there.

I went to Russia - ha!- when I finished school, on a cruise from Scotland. I took no camera. I had not got one, but also I rationalised: if you don't see with your own eyes, what will you see?

edit: and in the words of one of my favourite poets: And then I learned some more...

 

[VNwalking]

I just don’t understand why people get all worked up about being filmed walking the Camino from 100 ft elevation

Because:

consider if all those people were using drones instead. Consider what the Praça de Obradoiro would be like if even a tenth of the people there were using drones.

Or anyplace along the way that would be diminished by the high-pitched whine of someone's tech toy.

if you don't see with your own eyes, what will you see?

Good point!

 

[Camino Chrissy]

Well, now you will get them all worked up again by renewing the thread!

I saw that resurrected thread too, and almost posted before there were new replies, but I had already given my opinion back in June so chose not to repeat my words again.