Any Real need for salt/electrolyte replacement

Rajy62 · May 14, 2014

In several threads people mentioned the use of electrolyte tablets to help recover from the walk quicker. For my upcoming second Camino i thought i dig into this. It seems there a number of products on the market; nuun, zero, GU Brew, camelbak etc, all offering tablets that dissolve in water, claiming to replace at least sodium and pottasium. And some include other salts such as calcium, magnesium, chloride etc.

Has anyone used these tablets and really felt their claimed benefits in practice?

Well i am overweight and sweat a lot. Did the CF last year without any supplements. I never had any cramps or muscle aches. Mind you, constipated most of the time despite drinking 3/4 litres of water per day, I wonder if these electrolyte tablets could reduce my water intake.

Of course most of the marketing oriented material on the net endorses the need for these sports drinks/tablets. But a more technical analysis of sweating and electrolytes recommends the complete opposite:

drink to thirst, but just make sure you are getting enough ENERGY in
Don’t waste money on salt tablets – you don’t need them!

The two part article can be found here:
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes/
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes-part-2/

KinkyOne · May 14, 2014

Raj Sanmugam said:
In several threads people mentioned the use of electrolyte tablets to help recover from the walk quicker. For my upcoming second Camino i thought i dig into this. It seems there a number of products on the market; nuun, zero, GU Brew, camelbak etc, all offering tablets that dissolve in water, claiming to replace at least sodium and pottasium. And some include other salts such as calcium, magnesium, chloride etc.

Has anyone used these tablets and really felt their claimed benefits in practice?

Well i am overweight and sweat a lot. Did the CF last year without any supplements. I never had any cramps or muscle aches. Mind you, constipated most of the time despite drinking 3/4 litres of water per day, I wonder if these electrolyte tablets could reduce my water intake.

Of course most of the marketing oriented material on the net endorses the need for these sports drinks/tablets. But a more technical analysis of sweating and electrolytes recommends the complete opposite:

drink to thirst, but just make sure you are getting enough ENERGY in

Don’t waste money on salt tablets – you don’t need them!

The two part article can be found here:
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes/
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes-part-2/

Hi, Raj,

I am too overweight (slightly , 95kg/180cm/44yo) and sweat quite a lot especially when physically active but never did took those tablets. On the other hand I've found well before my first Camino that my "taste" require more salt as such, as additive to food, in hot months than during winter. I have no special medical knowledge but makes sense to me, even my skin turn a bit white from the salt in sweat. As I know potasium and manesium are good for preventing cramps in muscles. Well, my two cents...

Ultreia!

AJ · May 14, 2014

I find that a tapa of bacalao fixes cramps. And Vegemite of course fixes everything.

wayfarer · May 14, 2014

Take salt with your meals, sea salt if possible and I have been told that cucumber is as good or better than any electrolyte products.

jamesjd · May 15, 2014

Tomatoes and Bananas are also good along with nuts and plenty water.

Sent from my iPhone using Camino de Santiago Forum

pbucilla · May 15, 2014

The two part article can be found here:
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes/
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes-part-2/[/QUOTE]

I'm sorry Raj, but I am a little concerned with your conclusions based on these articles. The articles you provide discuss Gatorade specifically and are not based on research but an imaginary patient. Although they quote a couple of studies, the do not communicate a complete understanding of dehydration or electrolyte imbalance. Some of the conclusions they make, disagreeing with the authors of the research, are questionable. Hyponatremia can be a problem for some people, especially those who are exercising for long periods of time, who are exercising in heat and may not have time to recover from earlier deficits. Many people use Aquarius drinks because it is isotonic and replaces some sodium and postassium. I leave tomorrow for my Camino and likely will periodically drink Aquarius. I'll let you know when I get home what my experience was like.

annakappa · May 15, 2014

When it's very hot weather, we consume many deliciously fresh Aquarios cans, hoping that it lives up to its name, but it's bulky to carry with you. So, we also have some sachets of electrolytes, which are sold here in Costa Rica especially for babies and children, but are used for everyone. They weigh next to nothing and can easily be added to your bottle of water between villages. They have proved invaluable on several occasions. Anne

annakappa · May 15, 2014

Forgot to mention: cramps. I have never suffered them while walking the Camino, but within a few days if returning home, both Adriaan and I are always woken up several times every night with horrible cramps. I finally resolved this last time, by taking a potassium pill once a day. Anne

Mark Lee · May 15, 2014

Lots of water and bananas.

Rajy62 · May 15, 2014

KinkyOne said:
Hi, Raj,

I am too overweight (slightly , 95kg/180cm/44yo) and sweat quite a lot especially when physically active but never did took those tablets. On the other hand I've found well before my first Camino that my "taste" require more salt as such, as additive to food, in hot months than during winter. I have no special medical knowledge but makes sense to me, even my skin turn a bit white from the salt in sweat. As I know potassium and magnesium are good for preventing cramps in muscles. Well, my two cents...

Ultreia!

I agree that minerals such as potassium, magnesium, sodium etc can help prevent cramps. What i have trouble with, is this tablet/sports drink form for consuming it. May be for extreme athletes such as runners/cyclists/triathlons this form may be required. But for average amateur hikers like us this form seems an overkill. If you eat healthy, your body can store the necessary salts and release them when needed (e.g calcium in bones, magnesium in muscle etc.). And if you can not eat healthy, while on Camino, why not take a good multivitamin which contain the whole spectrum of minerals (and more ) that are needed for balancing electrolytes.

Rajy62 · May 15, 2014

annakappa said:
Forgot to mention: cramps. I have never suffered them while walking the Camino, but within a few days if returning home, both Adriaan and I are always woken up several times every night with horrible cramps. I finally resolved this last time, by taking a potassium pill once a day. Anne

Anne, I also developed cramps after i stopped walking. I have been taking a potent multivitamin which contains the complete set of salts/minerals. But i ran out during the camino. Once i get back on my multivitamins i recovered quickly. I also eat banana everyday. I will keep an eye out for that Aquarios drink. Can i get them in Spain?

Anniesantiago · May 15, 2014

Re cramps: do a google search on using mustard for cramps. Many atheletes carry small packets of mustard, like those you get at mcdonalds, and if they get cramps they just open and suck down one. They insist it stops cramps within minutes. I tried it with a foot cramp and by golly it worked! I'm carrying mustard now!

wayfarer · May 15, 2014

I was advised by the local pharmacist to drink tonic water for cramps and I saw several other pilgrims doing this when we walked. We also drank lots of Aquarios Lemon in 2013 but only as a refreshing drink which we both liked and originaly choose because they were the only lemon drink there. I did not know it had electrolyte properties.
As we say here "It's a bad day when you don't learn something new".

bystander · May 15, 2014

re: Gatorade
Was offered it once by well-meaning American hosts to ameliorate a hangover
Tried it
Preferred the hangover.

Tia Valeria · May 15, 2014

Our remedy for cramps, recommended by a doctor in the tropics, was to lick salt off your hand. If it tastes good you need it, if horrible you don't. You will never lick up too much. We still do this occasionally. (You cannot drink salt in water as it is an emetic.)
On the Camino we carry the medical type rehydration sachets (Diarolyte - lemon), not the sports type. Again if needed they taste great...etc. We can get ones that dissolve in a glass of water (200ml) in Spain the equivelent dissolves in 1 litre and the sachets are obviously also bigger. Usually we find we need them more in the first week home - interesting!
Personally I cannot use the sports type as they too often contain sweeteners to which I am allergic, but the 'post stomach upset' ones are fine.
Choices...............

sriyantra · May 15, 2014

Raj Sanmugam said:
In several threads people mentioned the use of electrolyte tablets to help recover from the walk quicker. For my upcoming second Camino i thought i dig into this. It seems there a number of products on the market; nuun, zero, GU Brew, camelbak etc, all offering tablets that dissolve in water, claiming to replace at least sodium and pottasium. And some include other salts such as calcium, magnesium, chloride etc.

Has anyone used these tablets and really felt their claimed benefits in practice?

Well i am overweight and sweat a lot. Did the CF last year without any supplements. I never had any cramps or muscle aches. Mind you, constipated most of the time despite drinking 3/4 litres of water per day, I wonder if these electrolyte tablets could reduce my water intake.

Of course most of the marketing oriented material on the net endorses the need for these sports drinks/tablets. But a more technical analysis of sweating and electrolytes recommends the complete opposite:

drink to thirst, but just make sure you are getting enough ENERGY in

Don’t waste money on salt tablets – you don’t need them!

The two part article can be found here:
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes/
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes-part-2/

For the constipation take more magnesium. I have been suffering from leg and foot cramping so increased my daily intake from 1 tablet to 2 tablets and away went the constipation (which I have suffered from for years despite fibre and lots of water). I checked with my GP to make sure I wasn't taking too much magnesium but he said I could take 4 tablets @ 400mg each a day if required. There is also a product called Magnesia Pelegrino that has the same effect. Nothing like talking like an old lady is there..........

Olivares · May 15, 2014

It is no coincidence that tomato sandwiches are a staple along the Camino! The Spanish Omelette (the real one, not the crap they called Spanish Omelette in the USA!) replaces protein the best, bananas provide magnesium for muscle function. Plenty water and there you have the basic nourishment for a pilgrim. Supplement if you see necessary.

bimblingalong · May 15, 2014

All good tips......plus I found a good magnesium supplement purchased in the pharmacia early on & almonds as a natural source helped against muscle cramps, this combined with bananas for potassium, the odd can of coconut water/ juice from Asian grocery stores...& an emergency supply of powdered magnesium/ electrolytes( that I never needed, but my good walking companion, who was a nurse did!!))....and cooking a good pot of brown rice & veges once in a while all helped keep muscle cramps away....oh, plenty stretching too...;-)

ampgaray · May 15, 2014

I would use them I gave the tablets and it can't hurt since diet is lacking and sweat is plentiful . My feet perfect my leg ache not so much!!!

Mark Lee · May 15, 2014

bystander said:
re: Gatorade
Was offered it once by well-meaning American hosts to ameliorate a hangover
Tried it
Preferred the hangover.

That's my favorite hangover remedy. Gatorade+aspirin+a banana.........

bystander · May 15, 2014

Mark Lee said:
That's my favorite hangover remedy. Gatorade+aspirin+a banana.........

Mine?
A Bl00dy Mary!

koilife · May 15, 2014

Hi Raj,

I'm curious if you have a medical background of some sort, or if you have a direct issue with sports drinks, or if you're just curious about people's experience. Since most of us on the forum aren't medical professionals, but many of us have fairly extensive experience walking/hiking/backpacking, you're less likely to get a true medical response and more likely to get a lot of common sense (that may or may not be medically correct).

I think it's probably safe to say that dehydration is a far more pervasive problem on the Camino than hyponatremia. The six to eight hours of exertion, often in heat, results in significant sweating, and a 1/2 replacement as suggested by your articles above will likely result in dehydration by end of day or after several such days. 1/2 rehydration rates may work for a two-hour regime, but it can leave you several litres down on water by the end of a hot day. Regular intake of coffee and alcoholic beverages before, during, and after the walking will compound the problem.

A quick search of reputable medical sources (e.g. NIH, MayoClinic) shows that electrolyte replacement should be part of the typical treatment for dehydration. Therefore, it seems prudent to carry sachets of electrolyte mix and use them within reason. As to personal experience, at times where I was mildly dehydrated (including on the Camino), I have found electrolyte mixes to work quite well at accelerating recovery from mild dehydration, much faster than water alone or water with proper food.

Basic common sense would seem to indicate that prevention is the best cure:

Yes, drink when you're thirsty, but also immediately hydrate in the morning and drink regularly throughout the walk at a rate (a good rule of thumb is 1 litre more or less, depending on exertion, ambient conditions, etc. per 10km walked)
Moderation in caffeine and alcohol intake
Watch your urine color (should be clear or pale yellow) and output
Good nutrition with plenty of fruits and vegetables (the typical Menu Peregrino is often deficient here); lots of good suggestions in the posts above
Regular and moderate food intake throughout the walk

obinjatoo · May 15, 2014

I agree with the post about eating bananas. It's potassium really that your body is after. Unfortunately you would have to eat about 10 pounds of bananas for the postssium IF you become dehydrated. The rule is really drink BEFORE you get thirsty and then drink more. Depending on conditions a half liter an hour or more is a begining. Table salt in the food should be enough. If you do find yourself dehydrated (testing skin turgor and color of urine and feeling crappy) a tablespoon of iodized salt in a quart consumed over an hour will help. Remember the the 2 Cs of pee. It should be clear and copious. Also drink the fresh squeezed OJ you can find at the cafes.

tploomis · May 15, 2014

Three or four days into the Camino I was sitting around a large table with a number of Europeans digging into my second course of the pilgrim's menu, when I got a massive cramp in my left hamstring, causing me to nearly fall out of my chair. After the excitement had calmed down, the Europeans were astonished to discover I was not taking magnesium pills, which was their go to preventative for muscle cramps. They were all using this electrolyte on a daily basis. As an American, magnesium wasn't even on my radar. The Spanish pharmacies all sell magnesium tablets that dissolve in water and taste pleasant. I used them from then on and never again had any cramps. Afterwards I was curious about use of magnesium for prevention of cramps. My doctor did not know much about it, and there was not a lot of internet. presence. I found it interesting that something that was so ingrained in European understanding was completely foreign to me.

annakappa · May 15, 2014

Raj Sanmugam said:
I will keep an eye out for that Aquarios drink. Can i get them in Spain?

Aquarios is EVERYWHERE, in every bar, every supermarket, or even the smallest grocery shops and in every coin operated distributer.
I fully agree about bananas, salt, drinking a lot before and when walking. And going slow on coffee and alcohol.
I personally feel that if I am between villages ( ones that are distant, one from the other - for instance on the Aragonés or the Primitivo), then a sachet of electrolytes added to your bottle if water can do more good than harm.
There are not many places on the Francés that are more than 8 Kms apart. But it's always good to be prepared! Anne

gerardcarey · May 16, 2014

bystander said:
Mine?
A Bl00dy Mary!

I'm with you cobber.
The only thing better is two of them.
Regds
Gerard

Say Simba · May 16, 2014

Raj Sanmugam said:
In several threads people mentioned the use of electrolyte tablets to help recover from the walk quicker. For my upcoming second Camino i thought i dig into this. It seems there a number of products on the market; nuun, zero, GU Brew, camelbak etc, all offering tablets that dissolve in water, claiming to replace at least sodium and pottasium. And some include other salts such as calcium, magnesium, chloride etc.

Has anyone used these tablets and really felt their claimed benefits in practice?

Well i am overweight and sweat a lot. Did the CF last year without any supplements. I never had any cramps or muscle aches. Mind you, constipated most of the time despite drinking 3/4 litres of water per day, I wonder if these electrolyte tablets could reduce my water intake.

Of course most of the marketing oriented material on the net endorses the need for these sports drinks/tablets. But a more technical analysis of sweating and electrolytes recommends the complete opposite:

drink to thirst, but just make sure you are getting enough ENERGY in

Don’t waste money on salt tablets – you don’t need them!

The two part article can be found here:
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes/
http://www.sportsscientists.com/2007/11/sports-drinks-sweat-and-electrolytes-part-2/

I drank water from a bladder the whole way, stopped for a coffee a couple of times a day, drank beer in the plaza or wherever once reaching my daily destination, ate olives and nuts for snacks, and feasted on the cheap peregrine meal each evening, rarely taking in anything else by way of salt and such. This seemed to be all that was needed. Others may be different, but buy the sports drinks for taste, not because you believe they will give you something extra. You will do just as well eating a bag of olives, some dried and salted corn nuts and drinking water. Water can not be stressed enough.

susanawee · May 16, 2014

AJ said:
I find that a tapa of bacalao fixes cramps. And Vegemite of course fixes everything.

Vegemite.....Of Course....!!

susanawee · May 16, 2014

wayfarer said:
I was advised by the local pharmacist to drink tonic water for cramps and I saw several other pilgrims doing this when we walked. We also drank lots of Aquarios Lemon in 2013 but only as a refreshing drink which we both liked and originaly choose because they were the only lemon drink there. I did not know it had electrolyte properties.
As we say here "It's a bad day when you don't learn something new".

I was given these Aquarius Drinks by the Hospitalero in Castrojerez last year when I was ill with a Gastro Bug whilst staying in the hostel there.....Very helpful indeed in helping to replace the nutrients I had lost during the worst of my illness..

Rajy62 · May 16, 2014

koilife said:
Hi Raj,
A quick search of reputable medical sources (e.g. NIH, MayoClinic) shows that electrolyte replacement should be part of the typical treatment for dehydration. Therefore, it seems prudent to carry sachets of electrolyte mix and use them within reason.

Koilife, I am not in a medical profession. Just someone needs to be convinced before i put anything into my body. So just wanted the members' opinion on supplementing with electrolytes.

Based on the member feedback and some more research, i conclude the following:

-Yes, strenuous exercise depletes essential minerals/electrolytes. Question is how best to replenish them.
-These electrolytes should ideally come from whole food.
-Given that one cannot always have a balanced meal on the Camino, supplementing is beneficial, specially if you are (like me) overweight or have any health conditions.
-It is important to choose an absorbable form of the compound though. There are lot of cheap stuff out there.
-If you are already taking multivitamins; Most high quality multivitamins contains a team of minerals and other essential nutrients that we would be lacking on the Camino diet.
-If you do not take multivitamin or the amount of electrolytes in the multivitamin is not sufficient for your need then add that specific mineral supplement (magnesium, potassium, sodium etc.) for the duration of the walk. Several members claim to have experienced immediate results from magnesium and potassium supplements and many seems to also like the Aquarios drink.

For me, the culprit seems magnesium. I was already deficient in this to start with and didn't hit me until some other members confirmed its connection to constipation and its benefits to other bodily functions. It is also difficult to consume sufficient quantity of magnesium on the camino (broccoli, leafy greens, avocado etc.). My multi provides 250 mg/day. According to Dr Hyman, i need 500+mg for those active days. I have decided to add Magnesium Glycinate (one of the absorb-able form) powder to my water.

Thanks everyone for your valuable feedback. I will report back how this works for me in July.

Rajy62 · May 16, 2014

pbucilla said:
Many people use Aquarius drinks because it is isotonic and replaces some sodium and postassium. I leave tomorrow for my Camino and likely will periodically drink Aquarius. I'll let you know when I get home what my experience was like.

I agree it is just one article. I just wanted to point out the mixed messages on the sports drink/tablet supplementation.
I keep hearing about Aquarius a lot. I don't know what is in it, i am allergic to sugar. Will try on my walk next week. I am starting the el norte Sunday. Enjoy your walk. I did that last october, already going back for more/ Buen Camino!

cahaba · May 16, 2014

I was walking the camino from Villatuerta to Los Arcos. One of my hardest stages. It was a bright sunny hot day. I stopped for lunch under a shed which had a bench. There was an older German man 70 plus already there with his shoes off. I always take my shoes and socks off during breaks to cool my toes. I removed my shoes and socks. He started talking in German I understood not one word. I peeled an orange and offered him some. He 10 minutes later offered me a packet of magnesium. I knocked it back and later was so grateful for his generosity. The camino does provide

Rajy62 · May 16, 2014

tploomis said:
As an American, magnesium wasn't even on my radar. The Spanish pharmacies all sell magnesium tablets that dissolve in water and taste pleasant. I used them from then on and never again had any cramps. Afterwards I was curious about use of magnesium for prevention of cramps. My doctor did not know much about it, and there was not a lot of internet. presence. I found it interesting that something that was so ingrained in European understanding was completely foreign to me.

Hi, agree to some extent. In NA we have to know where to look. I am a fan of Dr. Hyman's strategy for better health. Have a look at his popular post on Magnesium.... http://drhyman.com/blog/2010/05/20/magnesium-the-most-powerful-relaxation-mineral-available/

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Any Real need for salt/electrolyte replacement

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